Obama -VS- McCain Choose your Poison!

[Dan_Dare]

 

I haven't really been following the republicans that much, why exactly are people saying McCain's running mate is a nazi?

 

She's mental. Pro Life, extremely conservative, extremely religious and generally anti everything progressive and liberal in the known world.

[gaggle64]

She also used to be a member of the Alaskan Independence Party. Yes.

[Dan_Dare]

haha brilliant

[Haden]

Shes not a nazi cause like a nazi is someonethat is anti religious, pro one supreme leader, anti semite, racist, aggressively nationalistic, and well she is none of those things. Its loads more things the term gets thrown about and misused more than well anything and as a historian its annoying.

 

What is interesting is that her and Mcain disagree on more than one key policy issue. But I think thats why she was brought in to assure a certian demographic to vote Mcain as he has had trouble assuring the religious right in America of his credentials.

 

I wanted Hilary to win I think if Obama won it would be good for soft power US relations eg most europeans and middle east citizens want him to win and it could reduce tensions somewhat. I also like how he changes his mind I see that as a positive not a negative.

 

For Mcain the big pro is that he would stay in Iraq and not set a timetable his foriegn policy may prevent aggression just cause of its more belligenrent style but may also cause more friction and grouping in the world.

 

Will be interesting whoever wins. I reckon it will be Obama in the end.

[fex]

McCain is soooo damn old, chances are he's out of touch with what the future generation want / need.

 

I think alot of people will not vote obama because he's black, they will vote for the republicans even though they may not agree with their policies. Which is sad, but I hope obama gets in.

[Noodleman]

Voter turnout is going to be key really if the voter turnout is anything like the last election McCain will win. Obama's biggest challenge is to get people who support him to actualy bother to vote for him.

[BlueStar]

Shes not a nazi

 

It's not hard to see where the comparisons come from though, although it depends on your viewpoint and which reports from the media you believe

 

cause like a nazi is someonethat is anti religious,

 

My feelings as a Christian points me to my Lord and Savior as a fighter. It points me to the man who once in loneliness, surrounded by a few followers, recognized these Jews for what they were and summoned men to fight against them and who, God's truth! was greatest not as a sufferer but as a fighter. In boundless love as a Christian and as a man I read through the passage which tells us how the Lord at last rose in His might and seized the scourge to drive out of the Temple the brood of vipers and adders. ...Today, after two thousand years, with deepest emotion I recognize more profoundly than ever before the fact that it was for this that He had to shed his blood upon the Cross. ...

 

- Adolf Hitler

 

pro one supreme leader,

 

The idea of bi-partisanship has never been particularly high on the agenda of the right-wing of the Republican Party now, has it? That fringe of the party supported Bush being able to do whatever he wanted, no matter what the public, other members of the party or the constitution said

 

anti semite,

 

Palin's church recently invited a speaker from Jews for Jesus, and Palin sat in the congregation as he told them terrorist attacks on Israelis were God's "judgment of unbelief" of Jews who haven't embraced Christianity.

 

racist,

 

According to the waitress who was serving Palin on the day Obama beat Hillary she told those on her table "“So Sambo beat the bitch!”, and refers to the native people of Alaska as "arctic arabs"

 

aggressively nationalistic

 

Oh, come on, "Aggressively nationalistic" is pretty much inscribed in latin under the blue and red elephant.

[Haden]

It's not hard to see where the comparisons come from though, although it depends on your viewpoint and which reports from the media you believe

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The idea of bi-partisanship has never been particularly high on the agenda of the right-wing of the Republican Party now, has it? That fringe of the party supported Bush being able to do whatever he wanted, no matter what the public, other members of the party or the constitution said

 

 

 

Palin's church recently invited a speaker from Jews for Jesus, and Palin sat in the congregation as he told them terrorist attacks on Israelis were God's "judgment of unbelief" of Jews who haven't embraced Christianity.

 

 

 

According to the waitress who was serving Palin on the day Obama beat Hillary she told those on her table "“So Sambo beat the bitch!â€, and refers to the native people of Alaska as "arctic arabs"

 

 

 

Oh, come on, "Aggressively nationalistic" is pretty much inscribed in latin under the blue and red elephant.

 

That Hitler quote is interesting. When he rose to power he had to say stuff like that. He got the aristocrats on his side the religious powers by using language like that. Mussolini was a anti clerical fascist but had a 'conversion' before he came to power and made a deal with the pope. In both cases it was simply false. Both Hitler and Mussolini went against christian youth groups went against the teachings of the church. Hitler later declared you are either a german or a christian you cannot be both and closed down all youth groups bar hitler youth.

 

Bush is stepping down after his elected 2nd term he is not a supreme leader.

 

That anti Semite thing is interesting do you have a link? Palin did not say that though its like saying Obama is racist cause he went to church with that guy who hates white people.

 

According to the waitress who was serving Palin on the day Obama beat Hillary she told those on her table "“So Sambo beat the bitch!â€, and refers to the native people of Alaska as "arctic arabs"

 

lol wat? Sambo beat the bitch!! wow thats insane if true. However firstly thats unverified I take it? Secondly nazis are openly racist and into genitics and all sorts of freaky shit that noone has any proof Palin is anywhere near.

 

Maybe I should redefine and say insanely nationalistic and agrresive The Nazi party wanted to annex all of Europe round up other races and kill them and declare war on everyone pretty much. Palin is not calling for Mexico to be annexed.

 

I honestly dont think there is any comparison at all. Although to play devils advoacte to myself didn't Palin say she supported back in the day Pat Buchanen? But again Obama went to that racists guys church and everyones forgiven him for that so maybe its time to hear her end of the story.

[BlueStar]

Yeah, like I say, it depends on which reports you believe and also if Palin attending a church which invites such views and sitting through the speech equals being complicit to it. Here's a link about the Jews for Jesus speech, including a youtube vid of what she sat through

http://www.israelenews.com/view.asp?ID=3026

 

As for Hilter's religious convictions or otherwise, it's been done to death on the internet and never really been resolved - there are definitely many quotes where Hitler bigs up religion and pushes his own faith. People who want to paint him as an atheist respond to these documented quotes by saying he was just invoking religion to further his political ambitions. But that itself, if it is a trait we can attribute to the Nazis, is something that Political Christianity, of which Sarah Palin is a poster child, is often accused of - picking and choosing aspects of religion to invoke and using religious rhetoric to justify their political aims and garner support for them.

[Shino]

I can't imagine the how bat shit she went when her daughter told her she was pregnant.

[Emasher]

McCain is soooo damn old, chances are he's out of touch with what the future generation want / need.

 

I think alot of people will not vote obama because he's black, they will vote for the republicans even though they may not agree with their policies. Which is sad, but I hope obama gets in.

 

You'd be right there. Apparently McCain doesn't even know how to use a computer.

[Dan_Dare]

That's not as bad as it sounds. I mean, I expect my world leaders have better things to do than read forums. Or, for that matter, do their own typing.

[gaggle64]

Old age is a problem with McCain though, especially with Palin as his VP. As I've said, I don't mind McCain but I don't want the risk of some crazed gun toting evangelist like Palin taking the wheel.

 

As Frankie Boyle on Mock the Week put it:

He could be the first world leader in history to be assassinated by someone bursting a paper bag.

[Haden]

I agree the Fascist and religion thing is well confusing

 

I ahd to do an essay on it and for every statement like this

 

For example Goering when talking one of the most Fascist organisations in Germany the S.S. brings in the subservience of all Germans to God. ‘Be in no doubt we would not be able to be this body of men bound by a solemn oath if we did not have the firm belief in a Lord God who rules over us.’

 

There are more like this

 

Religion and European traditions were exalted by Edgar Jung who was Von Papen’s speechwriter and a lawyer by profession ‘Those who fight against human values must never forget that alongside the version enshrined in the Rights of Man of 1789 there is also the natural law version of Christianity of which European culture is based.’ Moral objections based on twin European and Christian values became more common to conservative elites as the nazi party’s radicalism intensified. This radicalisation was concluded as more and more rhetoric like Broman’s in 1941 came to the fore ‘National Socialism and Christianity are mutually exclusive the possibilities of Church influence must be constantly eliminated by the State.’

 

Anyway this is going way off tangent all I will say is although Palin uses here religion for a political purpose I think she is a christian. At the democrat convention there where so many thank the lord segments I thought I was at church. Not that im not saying the democrats weren't christians its just both parties know christianity is popular in america and use that knowledge. The same way blair is scared to say he is a christian because christianity is unpopular here.

[LazyBoy]

Wait... i'm not the only person on this forum who doesn't believe Russia are the bad guys?!?!?!

 

Bad guys? HA! The Russians are the only guys with the balls to stand up to the poisonous spread of American imperialism. If it comes to war, i'm defecting.

[Shino]

Bad guys? HA! The Russians are the only guys with the balls to stand up to the poisonous spread of American imperialism. If it comes to war, i'm defecting.

 

You've been in China far too long.

[LazyBoy]

You've been in China far too long.

 

I've been back a month, wish I had never left.

[Shino]

I've been back a month, wish I had never left.

 

May I ask why?

[LazyBoy]

You know what Shino, I don't want to bog down this conversation too much, so if you want to do this in detail we'll make another thread. But in short it's the people and their culture that makes me miss China and dislike England (and to a greater extent the USA).

 

Nothing like English dairy though.

[Shino]

You know what Shino, I don't want to bog down this conversation too much, so if you want to do this in detail we'll make another thread. But in short it's the people and their culture that makes me miss China and dislike England (and to a greater extent the USA).

 

Nothing like English dairy though.

 

Honest to god, it was an innocent question. Just curious to know what makes you think that way.

[Pit-Jr]

McCain now has a 4-point lead over Obama in the polls. Looks like his VP selection has paid off in spades. Surely my country wont elect a president because the VP is hot?

 

Lazyboy, im curious about that too as ive never been to China. Feel free to elaborate!

[LazyBoy]

Oh I know, it was an innocent answer, sorry if I came off otherwise. It's a complicated country, and one we can learn a lot from. There's so much to it that if I begin to list the reasons for why I like the country the introduction would be 2000 words long. I recommend everyone visit it, but should you do so be sure to PM me first.

[McPhee]

Bad guys? HA! The Russians are the only guys with the balls to stand up to the poisonous spread of American imperialism. If it comes to war, i'm defecting.

 

Don't you just love the irony of "Russia attacked Georgia because they are trying to re-establish their old empire!"?

 

I've been interested in a trip to China for a long time, very interesting country. Had plans to do it this year at one point, then decided against it because of the Olympics (too busy, hotel prices were WAY too expensive). I might go next year, gonna take the trans-siberian railway so i can see a bit of Russia and Mongolia along the way.

 

Old age is a problem with McCain though, especially with Palin as his VP. As I've said, I don't mind McCain but I don't want the risk of some crazed gun toting evangelist like Palin taking the wheel.

 

It wouldn't surprise me to read about McCain having an "accident" after a year or so in power. A nice little "heart attack" would see Palin become the first female President, she'll be a lot better at screwing the world up than Bush was. Hell, under her command i wouldn't be suprised to see another Vietnam or Laos situation happen.

[Sanchez]

I don't understand americans.

 

They have just had 8 years of a very destructive presidency, the loss of civil rights (patriot act), the creation of the most un-american place on earth (Guantanamo bay), 4000 lost soldiers in a war that at best will be ended peacefully but the damage has still been done, the peace process in the middle east has probably been delayed by decades and a debt of several trillion dollars. All of this has been under a republican presidency and 5 years of a republican congress. McCain is a once decent man who has turned back on everything he believed in, into something where I can't help feeling is being puppeted by his campaign. He has made a fiercely political choice by choosing Palin (who has her own problems already covered) but ignoring that, it says beyond a shadow of a doubt that "i only chose her for the votes" (mere weeks after saying obama puts the election before the country. America has the worst unemployment rates in ages, the only developed country in western civilization without universal healthcare thousands of people defaulting on their mortgage, one of the highest prison rates in the world and a huge rich-poor divide.

And yet, here is a candidate (and i hate to use a campaign slogan) who is more of the same beating the other candidate, frankly I'm stunned Obama isn't having a landslide victory.

 

Sorry for the ridiculously poorly constructed paragraph but Americans confuse are frighten me at the same time.

[DCK]

Bomb bomb bomb, bomb bomb Iran. Yep he's very qualified for president.

Regarding military action against Iran, McCain has said, "I pray every night that we will avoid a conflict with Iran." He has also said, "There's a whole lot of things we can do before we seriously consider the military option," but clarifying, "I still say there's only one thing worse than military action against Iran and that is a nuclear-armed Iran." His comments regarding "bombing Iran" made to veterans in South Carolina have come under scrutiny, despite McCain's statement that the comments were made in jest.

He's a republican, what you're going to expect?

McCain voted with Bush 95% of the time.

Again, he's a republican.

 

I know the Republicans suck, but McCain will definitely be an improvement over Bush. That is, as long as he doesn't die and let his puppet take over. My, that would be horrible.

 

But yeah, I'm all for Obama.