Past uses/misuses of the Wii controller

[Jav_NE]

Reading through the WiiMotionPlus thread it was mentioned how some developers havn't even grasped the current Wii remote properly, and therefore wont be able to take full advantage of WMP anyway.

 

So i was wondering what others opinions were on the current uses of the controller. What have we seen that has been great? What truly groundbreaking controls have there been that have really made a difference? And what has failed? What have people tried that hasn't worked?

 

In short, what games have worked on the Wii and what games havn't?

[Emasher]

I think some games are better with Waggle. The Zelda controls were great and so were the Mario Galaxy ones. The Aiming in MP3 was great, however the other motion controls in the game were really annoying. Zack and Wiki perhaps has made the best use out of the Wii Remote yet. Racing games like Excite Truck and Mario Kart feel great with accelerometer controlled steering. Yet, I'm glad some games like NIGHTS and Brawl allowed us to use more traditional control schemes as they weren't meant for the Wii Remote at all. Then there are the games that didn't need it. Alot of people said Red Steel was pretty bad, though I haven't played it myself. Alot of other ubisoft games come to mind here. The remote was pretty revolutionary for casual games as it didn't put non-gamers off from playing it like many other controllers, however us gamers generally just found tacked on motion controls to gimmicky. Another game that didn't need motion controls was Sonic and the Secret Rings. It was an average game to begin with, but the motion controls just ruined it for me.

[Cube]

The pointer is usually a pretty good thing in games, and tilting in games like Excite Truck and Sonic and the Secret Rings were great.

 

Although waggle in a lot of stuff either just seems to be a replacement for a button or something that barely works. Really, there hasn't really been any great uses for motion sensing, apart from little stuff like the doors in Metroid Prime 3.

[Chris the great]

okami is a great example of how mixed bag the pointer is. some of the drawing is fantastic, whilst some is difficult, and the waggle fighting is actualy very poor.

[D_prOdigy]

Zack and Wiki springs to mind for proving how versatile the controller can be. I also hear that The Godfather makes rather excellent use it, although someone who's played it will have to vouch for that.

[...]

The waggle fighting in Okami works perfectly, what are you talking about? It works as well as in Zelda or Mario's spin attack. The drawing is also flawless, and by that I mean that the brush draws exactly what you draw on the screen, it follows your every move, just like the pointer in the Wii menu. Now, if some drawings fail to be recognized by the game, that's NOT a problem of the pointer, it's a problem of the game programming that may have difficulties in computing what you just drew.

 

The gestures in Metroid Prime 3 also work perfectly, especially the opening of hatches.

 

I also hear that The Godfather makes rather excellent use it, although someone who's played it will have to vouch for that.

 

I own it, I've played it, I've finished it and I vouch for that 100%. The gestures in The Godfather are spot on. The aiming (IR) sucks though, but only in free aiming mode, it's toooooo sensitive. But the game compensates this with an excelent lock on system, that allows you to move your cursor only on the targeted enemy's body.

[D_prOdigy]

The waggle fighting in Okami works perfectly, what are you talking about? It works as well as in Zelda or Mario's spin attack. The drawing is also flawless, and by that I mean that the brush draws exactly what you draw on the screen, it follows your every move, just like the pointer in the Wii menu. Now, if some drawings fail to be recognized by the game, that's NOT a problem of the pointer, it's a problem of the game programming that may have difficulties in computing what you just drew.

 

The gestures in Metroid Prime 3 also work perfectly, especially the opening of hatches.

 

 

 

I own it, I've played it, I've finished it and I vouch for that 100%. The gestures in The Godfather are spot on. The aiming (IR) sucks though, but only in free aiming mode, it's toooooo sensitive. But the game compensates this with an excelent lock on system, that allows you to move your cursor only on the targeted enemy's body.

 

 

This just proves that - while we all casually joke MotionPlus is going to turn the remote into what it should have been in the first place - the majority of developers are still not using what is already there to its full potential. It's pretty sad, really.

[ghost_zero]

okami is a great example of how mixed bag the pointer is. some of the drawing is fantastic, whilst some is difficult, and the waggle fighting is actualy very poor.

 

 

That's not true. The fighting works perfectly. The difference is however that instead of how it was done in Zelda, you have to do it probably.

It is not just shaking around BUT you have to time, e.g. move it from left to right and then WAIT until it got executed and then do it from the right to the left. It is more like really fighting a.s.o.

However, for the rosaries I think it was a bit more like Zelda.

 

And regarding the pointer there "..." said everything already.

 

 

WHAT I disliked about Okami though, was the USE of the NUNCHAK for dodging. THAT just didn't work well. Well: I think it could work perfectly, if the Nunchak would have motion support like the controller itself. However, it might could have been done better with the current Nunchak though - I mean it still could be some sort of calculation problem currently (though I doubt it).

[Emasher]

The gestures in Metroid Prime 3 also work perfectly, especially the opening of hatches.

 

Some were ok, but alot of them just didn't work very well. They were trying to use the IR to sense rotation seeing as the remote cannot detect that so I guess it may have just been the angle I was sitting at. It would have worked better with the WMP though.

[steggy]

I second Godfather, as the gestures were brilliant. Garott wire, or bare hand strangulations were some of the best.

 

I also think Mercury Meltdown did a great job, better than monkey ball & Kororinpa basically because you held the controller sideways and used two hands.

 

Oh and Trauma Centre is another good example

[brynpearson]

pro evo ! !

[Chris the great]

you can say that im wrong about the battle mechanics of okami all you like, but the fact remains that its a frequently criticised part of the game (check out its wiki page) the timing, for me at least didnt seem to be the issue, what i found was that it was fairly inconsistant with that it actualy picked up, when using anything outher then roseries, the game seemed unwilling to recognise the initial swing (not subsiquent, combo swings) around 30-40% of the time.

 

i also realise its the games programing was to blaim for poor recognition of painting, that was the point i thought we were making, that developers still struggle to properly incorperate the wii remote. im not blaiming the hardwear for this, weve all seen how well it can work.

[darksnowman]

pro evo ! !

 

You think it uses the remote badly? I would have said Pro Evo is pretty much a master class in how to refresh games with the Wii controls. Justify yourself, Bryn!

[Blue_Ninja0]

Weird. You all say waggle as a substitute for motion controlls.

 

I only use it as in a motion control that works by just flailing your Wiimote around. For instance, TP's sword controls are waggle, but Wii Sports, MP3, and Mario Kart are not waggle.

[D_prOdigy]

You think it uses the remote badly? I would have said Pro Evo is pretty much a master class in how to refresh games with the Wii controls. Justify yourself, Bryn!

 

I think he means it uses it in a good way.

 

Oddly enough though, I have come across people who are adament that they hate the controls and demand classic controller compatibilty for 09. I'm sure they're just awkward sods saying that for the sake of being different, though.

[darkjak]

I absolutely love Twilight Princes, but I'm affraid I have to bash it here. The sword combat sucks! Why the f**k couldn't they have used motion controlls for real. I'm not talking about 1:1 controlls. I'm talking about stabs resulting in stabs, vertical slashes resulting in vertical slashes, like in (dare I say it) Red Steel. Instead they just replaced the GC-s B-button with waggle. That's the worst use of the Wiimote so far.

 

The best use was in the Godfather: Blackhand. You really had controll over everything and the controlls really helped the gameplay.

[...]

They [in Metroid Prime 3] were trying to use the IR to sense rotation seeing as the remote cannot detect that

 

I'm sorry? So how can I play the rollgoal mini-game in TP by rotating the wiimote with its camera covered? It does read rotation.

 

i also realise its the games programing was to blaim for poor recognition of painting, that was the point i thought we were making, that developers still struggle to properly incorperate the wii remote. im not blaiming the hardwear for this, weve all seen how well it can work.

 

Ah, I knew someone would interpret what I said this way. Except it's not what I meant. What I mean is not Wii specific. The game not computing well what you draw has nothing to do with wiimote implementation. It has to do with the program interpreting the drawings themselves. Whenever you have to draw something with your own hand in a game, it has problems interpreting it well, be it with a wiimote, with a mouse or with a pad. Because what you draw is very personal (like handwriting, more or less) and the program may not recognize something like that. I don't if I made myself any clearer now, but I hope so.

[Emasher]

I'm sorry? So how can I play the rollgoal mini-game in TP by rotating the wiimote with its camera covered? It does read rotation.

 

 

http://www.invensense.com/support/library.html#motionsensing

[James McGeachie]

I think Wii Sports is still the best example of motion control on the system. All the games felt good to some degree with me (yes even boxing. It was flawed but I can work around it and the training was fun) and some like Baseball are still the closest to 1:1 there's been without the motion plus. Only real problem was the lack of any depth.

 

The IR in RE4 made it even more fun to play than on GC and that by itself is a big accomplishment. It justified paying money for the same game again and is one of the few titles where you can say that. The waggle for some other stuff felt "okay" at least too and never hindered the game.

 

Trauma Centre's controls are good in that it's a game at least where it can only be done on DS and Wii still (well I guess the iPhone too!). It wasn't perfect but it's an example at least of IR being used to create an experience not possible on the "next gen" systems which is always a good thing.

[tapedeck]

I'll vouch for The Godfather. It's still a pioneer of what motion control can bring to a traditional gaming experience. Everything works exceptionally and even IR is great. Typically the bane of sandbox titiles: Driving a car and shooting with pin-point precision, is excellently done and feels perfect. The motion controls are brilliant because they always work. Yes, I said ALWAYS! Smash a goon with your right fist and then left and then grab him and headbut him...and it works flawlessly. With relevant motions.

 

I'm still eager for a sequel. The controls were so good my fiance played this to death and just loved throwing molotovs, grabbing goons and throwing them about. Possibly the best example of how motion control can breath new life into a tiring genre. When a remake feels fresher and more fun than something like GTA4 you know it got something right.

[Jamba]

I was pleasantly surprised by the use in Paper Mario actually and was very happy about using the pointer and the controller turned sideways. Really didn't enjoy the game all that much and traded it but it just kept everything simple and functional, just like a Wii game should be I think.

[...]

http://www.invensense.com/support/library.html#motionsensing

 

Still, explain to me how rotating the wiimote makes Mario turn when you're riding the manta ray, even with the camera covered or with the wiimote pointing away from the sensor bar. Or the rollgoal which I mentioned earlier. It senses rotation without it being through the IR.

[dwarf]

I think a quality use of the Wii-Mote was shown in Wii Sports bowling - It showed that the remote could reliably detect speed, angle and tilt. The challenges where you had to spin past the obstacles was very fun, I managed to complete it and it was very satisfying. When the ball did what i wanted it to that was rewarding. Aiming in Prime was good too.

I maintain that a Timesplitters game on Wii would be perfect.

[K-project]

I won't go over the stuff you've already mentioned in this thread - OK I will - PES, Metroid, Wii Sports, Excite Truck, Resi 4 and Mario Galaxy all feature wonderful motion controls that I can't imagine gaming without now. The one I would add to the list of my own is No More Heroes. It's a love it or hate it game (I adore it), but you can't deny either way just how much fun the combat is with the remote. Plus not only that, but the absolutely fantastic way Travis has to charge up the beam sword deserves a mention in the list on it's own!

 

Gamers are sniffy about the Wii, but I wouldn't swap these games for anything else.

[Dog-amoto]

The Wii remote can detect rotation sans IR. Look at the meat cooking mini game on Wario Ware. You are holding the Wii remote to the side