c0Zm1c Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 I don't think the Wii has the processing power to do a game like GRAW justice. I can't speak for Fight Night as I haven't played it and it's not my sort of thing. Dead Rising might have been a good game if the frequent and lengthy load screens hadn't spoilt it for me. I didn't play much of it because of that. To be honest, there isn't anything on the 360 and PS3 that I would like to see come to the Wii. There's a few I would like to see come to the PC though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phube Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 The problem is, Super Mario Galaxy took two and a half years to make... Most of the 3rd party studios won't ever spend that much time fine tuning a game to make it that good! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurtle Squad Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 Dead Rising might have been a good game if the frequent and lengthy load screens hadn't spoilt it for me. I didn't play much of it because of that. Lengthy?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c0Zm1c Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 Yes, lengthy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emasher Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 The problem is, Super Mario Galaxy took two and a half years to make... Most of the 3rd party studios won't ever spend that much time fine tuning a game to make it that good! That would be because Nintendo knows a Mario game will be known and therefore they spend more time on it to make it good so more people will buy it. 3rd parties don't spend that time on games because 3rd party games are never as well know so even if the game is amazing many people won't buy it because they don't know about it, or would rather spend their money on mario or metroid ect. A good example of this is Tales of Symphonia, it was the best game I ever played but it didn't sell nearly as well as it deserved to because the Tales series just isn't that well known. The only reason it came out in north america and europe was because Nintendo saw that it was a quality game and they did the localization themselves. Also, many smaller developers can't spend that much time on their games simply because they don't have the money to do so as they are too small and need to keep putting out minor games just to survive. I think an example of this would be dragon blade wrath of fire. the game was great but it was missing that little something that could have been gained by putting in more effort. For instance they could have hired someone to compose the sound track rather than buying the rights to "the tiger pyramid" from Paul Jennings (the tiger pyramid is used as the main theme of the game). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tellyn Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 It's not. And thats been my point from the start, the Wii should be churning out games as good as those on Xbox 360 and PS3, with the bonus of Wii controls on top of that. It isn't, it's churning out inferior games that are brought up to standard by the novelty of a new control system (im not counting all Wii games in this). I see no reason why the Wii shouldn't have titles as good as GRAW, Fight Night and Dead Rising to accompany Mario/Metroid/Zelda. Heck, to those of you who love the Wiimote the games should be better than those just stated. That's kind of the reason why a lot of people stick to 1st party games on the Wii, they tend to have the best controls, graphics and gameplay. A lot of third party games are terrible. The difference between the Wii and 360/PS3 is that third parties put effort into their games on 360/PS3. Capcom are the only 3rd party to have fully utilised the Wii controls, most reviews have said that it feels like a Nintendo game. Then we move onto Ubisoft. Assassin's Creed, highly acclaimed game on the 360/PS3. Funded by shitty minigame compilations on the Wii and DS, publicly admitted to by a major player in Ubisoft. Third parties need to be sorted out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fierce_LiNk Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 That's kind of the reason why a lot of people stick to 1st party games on the Wii, they tend to have the best controls, graphics and gameplay. A lot of third party games are terrible. The difference between the Wii and 360/PS3 is that third parties put effort into their games on 360/PS3. Capcom are the only 3rd party to have fully utilised the Wii controls, most reviews have said that it feels like a Nintendo game. Then we move onto Ubisoft. Assassin's Creed, highly acclaimed game on the 360/PS3. Funded by shitty minigame compilations on the Wii and DS, publicly admitted to by a major player in Ubisoft. Third parties need to be sorted out. Word. The Wii is not as powerful as the 360 or PS3, but developers were making quality games on the old hardware, so why can't they do so on the Wii? I'm thinking time-frames is the problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McPhee Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 That's kind of the reason why a lot of people stick to 1st party games on the Wii, they tend to have the best controls, graphics and gameplay. A lot of third party games are terrible. The difference between the Wii and 360/PS3 is that third parties put effort into their games on 360/PS3. Capcom are the only 3rd party to have fully utilised the Wii controls, most reviews have said that it feels like a Nintendo game. Then we move onto Ubisoft. Assassin's Creed, highly acclaimed game on the 360/PS3. Funded by shitty minigame compilations on the Wii and DS, publicly admitted to by a major player in Ubisoft. Third parties need to be sorted out. Exactly the problem, 3rd parties can't be arsed. I suspect this might be down to Nintendo though. They've scuppered the chances of multiformat games appearing on Wii by nerfing it's power and as a result need to start paying 3rd Parties to make exclusive games for they're system. At the moment they seem to do this very rarely, whereas it's commonplace for Microsoft and Sony. It would also help if they kept 1st and 2nd party IPs out of 3rd party games, not every good exclusive has to feature Mario... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tellyn Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 I don't understand it though, 3rd parties shouldn't be PAID or MADE to make good games. Surely in the development process, someone must be thinking, "Hmm, this game is terrible, let's make a good one instead!" Seriously, you'd think the Wii was running on Mode7... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jammy2211 Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 Exactly the problem, 3rd parties can't be arsed. 3rd parties are in it for the money, if they see the potential for profit they'll take it. Making profit doesn't need a game to be good, but it can help. I suspect this might be down to Nintendo though. They've scuppered the chances of multiformat games appearing on Wii by nerfing it's power and as a result need to start paying 3rd Parties to make exclusive games for they're system. On the other hand, by keeping the consoles power so low they've managed to make developement costs on the Wii at about a third of the price of the other two consoles. We're missing out on alot of the HD projects which started developement long before the Wii was released, but from what I've seen companies can dedicate resources exclusively to the Wii now that it's the most profitable current-gen machine on the market. Nintendo don't need to pay anyone, you can't ignore the fact that companies are much more likely to see green figures if they keep their releases on the Wii. Obviously there are exceptions, where companies like Epic Games obviously suit the HD consoles more, but equally there are smaller developement teams who pretty much can't afford to develope for anything but the Wii. At the moment they seem to do this very rarely, whereas it's commonplace for Microsoft and Sony. It would also help if they kept 1st and 2nd party IPs out of 3rd party games, not every good exclusive has to feature Mario... It's not particually common with Microsoft and Sony, and even when it is it's not always going to guarentee a good product in the end. In all honesty we don't have a clue what goes on behind the scenes so I don't see how you can comment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tapedeck Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 Imagine if something like Beyond Good and Evil got a sequel on Wii. But the clever thing would be keeping the graphics similar to it's predecessor. Thus creating a clever "consistency" thus mkaing the series have a look that would be the same. When Nintendo made the Wind Waker "Celda" decision I felt they had to, to change an ideal that a sequel must look the same. Subsequently they've gon back to what many people expect from the series yet the great "celda" decision showed (to me) taht a t least Nintendo have balls. Giant cell-shaded balls. The gaming industry is a brothel of graphic whores pouncing on the "next great shader" rather than pouncing on the next great idea. There are too many programmers feeding on the notion of being a computer boffin and a great programmer. Not an artist or a designer. The film industry finds similar identities in the face of camera angles and "techniques" (Look at the whoring of Bullet Time since The Matrix). Yet it is time game developers started to look at artistic values and made choices of their own rather than just copy ideals. Faggots. Utter faggots. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owen Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 Yes, lengthy. forget the loading screens, what about the stupid save system! That was my problem with it! Oh and the fact you literally had to zoom around the bloody mall! Other then that, superb game! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c0Zm1c Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 I didn't get to use the save system much, or zoom around the mall to keep up with events critical to the story (I read about that in the reviews) because the loading deterred me from playing the game for more than a couple of hours. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hellfire Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 In my opinion there are 3 problems: 1)The devs wanted to focus on the remote, so they couldn't be arsed with putting any effort in anything else. Which isn't saying much really, since very few 3rd parties did a good job with the remote. 2)The Wii was a risk, so investing a lot without seeing how it plays out for a while would be dumb. 3)PS2 games are still being developed, seeing that Wii uses the GC architecture and devs already knew how to port PS2 to GC, they take the chance to make some extra money and port the games to Wii. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McPhee Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 On the other hand, by keeping the consoles power so low they've managed to make developement costs on the Wii at about a third of the price of the other two consoles. We're missing out on alot of the HD projects which started developement long before the Wii was released, but from what I've seen companies can dedicate resources exclusively to the Wii now that it's the most profitable current-gen machine on the market. Nintendo don't need to pay anyone, you can't ignore the fact that companies are much more likely to see green figures if they keep their releases on the Wii. Obviously there are exceptions, where companies like Epic Games obviously suit the HD consoles more, but equally there are smaller developement teams who pretty much can't afford to develope for anything but the Wii. The Wii didn't need to be HD, if it could run multi format titles at a lower resolution then it would still have gained a lot more games. Also, Nintendo do need to pay people. You said it yourself, a game doesn't need to be good to make money. If mini game compilations sell well then why would publishers spend more money making a good shooter/rpg/platformer? If PS2 ports sell well then why bother making a Wii exclusive? There needs to be some incentive. Obviously good 3rd party games will come regardless of any financial incentive from Nintendo, but they will be fewer in number. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jammy2211 Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 The Wii didn't need to be HD, if it could run multi format titles at a lower resolution then it would still have gained a lot more games. But if they did that then they'd need to match the specs on the PS3 and 360 anyway, and thus have developement costs sky rocket to what they are on those systems. It's simply not possible 0_o. Also, Nintendo do need to pay people. You said it yourself, a game doesn't need to be good to make money. If mini game compilations sell well then why would publishers spend more money making a good shooter/rpg/platformer? If PS2 ports sell well then why bother making a Wii exclusive? There needs to be some incentive. Firstly there is market saturation, the console can only have so many mini game compilations until they stop selling. Companies will also develope exclusive to the Wii to try get a step up on the competition, the Wii has more exclusives announced for it then the 360 or PS3 so I don't really see this as an evident problem yet. All I ever see is bigger and more ambitious exclusive titles being announced every week for the Wii. Companies will want to make good games, because if they can be one of the first to establish a well-known and successful franchise on the console then they're set for huge sales the whole generation and beyond. Obviously good 3rd party games will come regardless of any financial incentive from Nintendo, but they will be fewer in number. As I said, we don't have a clue what Nintendo do to encourage third parties. I'd imagine they're trying hard though, Capcom would be making Monster Hunter 3 a Wii exclusive if Nintendo didn't drop the royalties on some of their games or offer another incentive, surely? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Falcon_BlizZACK Posted December 3, 2007 Author Share Posted December 3, 2007 Jammy, I understand your lower development costs = more developer accessibility ideal, but that doesn't exactly solve the problem in fact it probably enhances it. The developers with the low budgets are the ones creating games like; 'The Ninjabread Man', 'Anubis II', 'Spy games' and all that crap. And they aren't taking gaming into new heights of creativity with this garbage either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jammy2211 Posted December 3, 2007 Share Posted December 3, 2007 Jammy, I understand your lower development costs = more developer accessibility ideal, but that doesn't exactly solve the problem in fact it probably enhances it. The developers with the low budgets are the ones creating games like; 'The Ninjabread Man', 'Anubis II', 'Spy games' and all that crap. And they aren't taking gaming into new heights of creativity with this garbage either. There are tons of developers, some make that sort of junk, but equally there are tons of innovative and creative developers out there moving more and more resources to the Wii. It's impossible to manage it so you only get the good stuff and turn away the crap stuff, and seeing as you choose what you buy, whats the problem? I don't see how having more games is a problem anyway, fair enough all that popcorn games stuff is horrific, but some of what we class as junk is going to be popular amonst some sections of Wii owners. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zechs Merquise Posted December 3, 2007 Share Posted December 3, 2007 Jammy, I understand your lower development costs = more developer accessibility ideal, but that doesn't exactly solve the problem in fact it probably enhances it. The developers with the low budgets are the ones creating games like; 'The Ninjabread Man', 'Anubis II', 'Spy games' and all that crap. And they aren't taking gaming into new heights of creativity with this garbage either. Yes, but historically successful systems are full of Junk. They always have outstanding titles in their lifespan, but the the greats are always surrounded by shelf fillers. The Wii's popularity caught people off guard. Third parties experimented with the Wii in it's first year and were basically dipping their toes in the water to 'check it out'. Now the Wii is a success and developers know there is money to be made through lower costs and a larger market share, we'll see better games. It was the same with the DS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue_Ninja0 Posted December 3, 2007 Share Posted December 3, 2007 The Wii's popularity caught people off guard. Third parties experimented with the Wii in it's first year and were basically dipping their toes in the water to 'check it out'. Now the Wii is a success and developers know there is money to be made through lower costs and a larger market share, we'll see better games. It was the same with the DS. Very well said. We'll still have truckloads of crappy software but among the filler there will always be those gems that remind me why i bought a nintendo system. To bad sometimes we have to wait an eternity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Falcon_BlizZACK Posted November 24, 2008 Author Share Posted November 24, 2008 Sorry for the bump, but another year has passed and I would like to see if opinions have changed/remain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dazzybee Posted November 24, 2008 Share Posted November 24, 2008 Zack and Wicki, Smash, Mario Kart, Wii Fit, pro Evo, Boom Blox, De Blob, OKami, No More Heroes, Guitar Hero, Call of Duty, Wario Land, Tiger Woods 09, Wii Music.... I've been more than happy personally! But admittedly, the last 3 months of 08 are pretty disappointing, I'll admit that. But 09 looks amazing already, and wiimotionplus is about to shake up the industry again! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ren of Heavens Posted November 24, 2008 Share Posted November 24, 2008 No really good games since Smash Bros. Brawl and Okami in June. Cod: World At War, deBlob and Tiger Woods 09 are decent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aalborg Posted November 24, 2008 Share Posted November 24, 2008 only one I bought since Smash B. is de Blob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Falcon_BlizZACK Posted November 24, 2008 Author Share Posted November 24, 2008 I'm aware that there are some more decent games on the Wii... But I was still kind of 'held back' by the thought of buying mediocre to shitty games at full price. I'm still kind of traumatised by my old N64 and GC purchases. I remember having to think long and hard in the shop before securing a purchase. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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