Ramar Posted June 9, 2007 Posted June 9, 2007 Hmmm, let's see after a quick seach on BBC Sport: Football, I found these two articles from YESTERDAY, after 10 seconds of scanning... http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/london/6735761.stm - Corruption http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/internationals/6733867.stm - Spectator attacking the referee Article one is about money laundering, this can happen in any indsutry, I've seen reports of school head teachers doing it etc. Its a wide crime, so you can't really pin that on football. Second article, if you took time to read it, took place between Sweden and Denmark. Didn't happen in the UK, were the vast majority of games are well governed and policed. I voted football, I'm a passionate football fan. I don't mind whether you like Rugby more, but when you start using insults like football fans are simpletons, its not true and it offends me. So play fair ladies.
Ant-Shimmin Posted June 9, 2007 Posted June 9, 2007 Football is the beautiful game, anyone who doesn't like it, uses stereotypical views to judge their dislike of it. We had this argument of Football v Rugby in another thread, it's just stupid because those who hate football are narrow minded when it comes to the game. I don't have a problem with RUgby and occasionally watch St Helens on the box, but football is just amazing. I voted football, I'm a passionate football fan. I don't mind whether you like Rugby more, but when you start using insults like football fans are simpletons, its not true and it offends me. So play fair ladies. Amen to that
Fierce_LiNk Posted June 9, 2007 Posted June 9, 2007 Well, this thread is asking which is a better sport, so technically all these additional "Football is run by WHO-LEE-GUNZ" arguments should be used cautiously. It doesn't make the game itself bad, does it? Both sports have their merits. Football, as you all say, is simple. Except for the offside rule, which they change every season. Annoying as shit. Rugby is complex, and as such, has a much smaller fanbase, and it's harder for neutrals to get excited. However, for the hardcores out there, it's very satisfying. It's a proper game, you have to go backwards to go forwards. However, my heart lies with football. Even the nature of it. The highs, the lows, the wins, the losses, the Cup Finals, the last days in the season, the relegation dogfights, the scandals, the uproar. The controversy. I wouldn't change it for the world.
Ant-Shimmin Posted June 9, 2007 Posted June 9, 2007 . However, my heart lies with football. Even the nature of it. The highs, the lows, the wins, the losses, the Cup Finals, the last days in the season, the relegation dogfights, the scandals, the uproar. The controversy. I wouldn't change it for the world. Amen to that once more, You don't have to visit your local park or your Local Pub on a match day to realise that.
KKOB Posted June 9, 2007 Author Posted June 9, 2007 I'm looking at the game and the game alone. As in, would i enjoy watching some nobodies playing it as much. Rugby is the more enjoyable sport for me to watch since that is all i do due to my allergies to most sport. I can't say i hate football, just that it doesn't entertain me as much. Saying this i do LOVE Football Manager and have done since i was about 10.
Charlie Posted June 9, 2007 Posted June 9, 2007 I by far prefer the ethos of rugby to football, the players don't dive, they call the referee "Sir" and they're generally nice to each other. I much prefer watching football though.
Problematique Posted June 9, 2007 Posted June 9, 2007 Aussie rules is quite different to Gaelic actually! Different shape ball Different pitch dimensions Different tackling rules Different positions etc AFL is professional, GAA is amateur In fact every year there is a International Compromised Rules Tournament held alternately in Ireland/Australia using a hybrid of the two games! Imagine a Rugby/Soccer hybrid :p Yeah, but the essence of the game is the same. I was always puzzled by the fact that AFL is played on a cricket pitch all you do is churn up the wicket! :p I watched a bit of an International Rules game once. One of the Aussies clotheslined a GAA player. What a ****. Edit: I think Moria's got it spot on. Referees are respected by every man on the pitch in rugby. You can't really say the same thing for football.
motion Posted June 9, 2007 Posted June 9, 2007 Article one is about money laundering, this can happen in any indsutry, I've seen reports of school head teachers doing it etc. Its a wide crime, so you can't really pin that on football. Second article, if you took time to read it, took place between Sweden and Denmark. Didn't happen in the UK, were the vast majority of games are well governed and policed. It's happening in football and doesn't happen in rugby. Simple as that. Yes, football hooliganism is a worldwide problem. Those two articles were picked up from YESTERDAY after 10 seconds of searching on the BBC site. Football is the beautiful game, anyone who doesn't like it, uses stereotypical views to judge their dislike of it. I don't use stereotypical views at all. I find football mind numbingly boring to sit through, watching 22 pansies kick a ball to each other is not what I can entertainment. All the violence (+ thousand other problems with pro football) is an added bonus when it comes to my dislike.
mcj metroid Posted June 9, 2007 Posted June 9, 2007 yamn rugby is the better sport. Soccer is too popular i can't stand it. I don't use stereotypical views at all. I find football mind numbingly boring to sit through, watching 22 pansies kick a ball to each other is not what I can entertainment. All the violence (+ thousand other problems with pro football) is an added bonus when it comes to my dislike. I agree with this.
Problematique Posted June 9, 2007 Posted June 9, 2007 All the violence (+ thousand other problems with pro football) is an added bonus when it comes to my dislike. In game violence or fan violence?
Fierce_LiNk Posted June 9, 2007 Posted June 9, 2007 I by far prefer the ethos of rugby to football, the players don't dive, they call the referee "Sir" and they're generally nice to each other. I much prefer watching football though. Is there a particular reason why you prefer to watch football? I love watching Rugby, but I have to say I find football much more entertaining. Rugby seems a bit too...structured, in a way, whereas in football absolutely anything can happen. The ethos does need to change though, and we have seen far less diving this season than last, especially with players like Drogba and Ronaldo. Actually, both players have had a fantastic season, so maybe they'll take the hint.
motion Posted June 9, 2007 Posted June 9, 2007 In game violence or fan violence? Both but mostly the latter. Brawls, stabbings, clashes with police etc... What did I hear about Spurs and Chelsea I think it was fans clashing in the street armed with baseball bats with nails attached? Rugby seems a bit too...structured, in a way, whereas in football absolutely anything can happen. I'd argue with this point. There are so many different things that can happen in a rugby match than in a football match. I've just struggling to see what excitement can happen on a football pitch apart from a player beating a couple of defenders, kicking the ball to someone who head-buts it into goal or something like that. In rugby there is a constant stream of points throughout the game, accumulated by tries (converted and not), penalties, drop goals. Sin binnings can affect a game, as can how the scrum and lineout functions. Do teams play expansive rugby getting the ball out wide and running with it or do they play forward dominated rugby (yes please!) and stick it 'up the jumper'. It's far more complicated than football rule wise and as people have said that's probably the reason for it's lower fanbase. Fierce, I thought you were Welsh. You're supposed to eat breathe and sleep rugby!
Fierce_LiNk Posted June 9, 2007 Posted June 9, 2007 Both but mostly the latter. Brawls, stabbings, clashes with police etc... What did I hear about Spurs and Chelsea I think it was fans clashing in the street armed with baseball bats with nails attached? But nobody likes that in any sport, and is the fault of the fans, not to do with the game itself. I'd argue with this point. There are so many different things that can happen in a rugby match than in a football match. I've just struggling to see what excitement can happen on a football pitch apart from a player beating a couple of defenders, kicking the ball to someone who head-buts it into goal or something like that.[/Quote] That is pretty exciting though, and it'd be exactly the same for Rugby. Somebody starting off in their own half, taking on all the team and scoring a magnificent goal. But, it's not just about how you score, but also about WHEN you score. Think back to the Champions League Final of 99, where United scored 2 goals in the last 3 minutes to take the trophey home. We were going out of the competition, and then.....it was so bluddy magical! Think about that in context with Rugby. Somebody scoring a last gasp try. In rugby there is a constant stream of points throughout the game, accumulated by tries (converted and not), penalties, drop goals. Sin binnings can affect a game, as can how the scrum and lineout functions. Do teams play expansive rugby getting the ball out wide and running with it or do they play forward dominated rugby (yes please!) and stick it 'up the jumper'. It's far more complicated than football rule wise and as people have said that's probably the reason for it's lower fanbase. A lot can happen in rugby, there's no doubt about that. However, with regards to sin binnings, what about sending offs in football? That changes the game. Scrum and lineouts? Ok, what about corners, freekicks and penalties? It's really not that different. They're all set pieces. It is complicated, and you're right, that's probably why it's not as accessible to neutrals. I'd dread trying to explain the rules to somebody who didn't have a clue. Fierce, I thought you were Welsh. You're supposed to eat breathe and sleep rugby! Haha. I am Welsh, and I do love Rugby. But, I think Football has a special place in my heart. 1 name: Ryan Giggs.
Ant-Shimmin Posted June 9, 2007 Posted June 9, 2007 I really don't know what to say that hasn't been said already, Football is the most popular sport in the world, take away all the violence etc. It has been and it always will be. Hence the name "the beautiful game". Some people find it boring, I find it gripping. I don't think it is "22 Pansies" I think it is 22 players trying to put the ball in the net, you don't like it fair enough. However, you bring up these homophobic elements, racism etc when they are in their minority, I am not denying it is a problem, yet those who go the match on a regular basis knows this is is the case. I have not been to a match where I have not enjoyed myself, both during the match and pre-post match experience. I don't have a problem with Rugby I can see why people like it, but I resent people when they call football "Chavball" or what ever you call it. It is far from, I have met some chavs that follow Rugby, shall I call that something similar, No I shouldn't. Like in all sports all walks of life follow sports, wether it be football, rugby, cricket. With football being the more followed sport you are going to pick up a few bad seeds of society along the way. If you don't like football, fair enough but get off your high horses and stop stereotyping those who follow football and placing us as lower members of society, we know it has it's problems but that doesn't apply to each and every single one of us. Football for me, isn't just a game, it's my life
motion Posted June 9, 2007 Posted June 9, 2007 But nobody likes that in any sport, and is the fault of the fans, not to do with the game itself. But why are those things present in football not rugby? I'll come back to the point that a football fixture with 15,000 supporters in Leicester needs 600 police officers. a rugby fixture with 15,000 supporters in Leicester needs 6. You can't compare it more perfectly than that! And that by the way is with rugby fans mixing with opposition supporters in the stands/seating. If football fans were mixed (why aren't they by the way?) you'd need 6000 police officers! Think back to the Champions League Final of 99, where United scored 2 goals in the last 3 minutes to take the trophey home. We were going out of the competition, and then.....it was so bluddy magical! Ahhhh yes I remember it well Speaking of last gasp tries, the Aussie one v Wales last week and the French one v Ireland in the 6N were awesome!! (sorry Conzer) Haha. I am Welsh, and I do love Rugby. But, I think Football has a special place in my heart. 1 name: Ryan Giggs. Hmmm, I'll let you off then.
Daft Posted June 9, 2007 Posted June 9, 2007 The ethos does need to change though, and we have seen far less diving this season than last, especially with players like Drogba and Ronaldo. Actually, both players have had a fantastic season, so maybe they'll take the hint. We can pray!
motion Posted June 9, 2007 Posted June 9, 2007 However, you bring up these homophobic elements, racism etc when they are in their minority, I am not denying it is a problem, yet those who go the match on a regular basis knows this is is the case. They shouldn't be present at all! There shouldn't be fights every week somewhere around the country at a pro football game. If you don't like football, fair enough but get off your high horses and stop stereotyping those who follow football and placing us as lower members of society, we know it has it's problems but that doesn't apply to each and every single one of us. Once again I'm not stereotyping people. You for example, I'm sure you don't go around kicking opposing fan's heads using racist or homophobic remarks. I'm just saying it DOES happen, even if it's a minority, it happens pretty much every week. Rugby doesn't 'do' fighting/racism etc... Football for me, isn't just a game, it's my life Glad to hear it. Rugby is my life as well. Live, breath, sleep it.
Ant-Shimmin Posted June 9, 2007 Posted June 9, 2007 They shouldn't be present at all! There shouldn't be fights every week somewhere around the country at a pro football game. Once again I'm not stereotyping people. You for example, I'm sure you don't go around kicking opposing fan's heads using racist or homophobic remarks. I'm just saying it DOES happen, even if it's a minority, it happens pretty much every week. Rugby doesn't 'do' fighting/racism etc... I'm not bothered if Rugby doesn't do Fighting/Racism, If it doesn't great but that doesn't mean I'm going to burst my football and pick up the rugby. I just feel sorry for you that your perceptions of the sport are altered by the Minority. Football is the most followed sport in the world, not because of the small amount of violence, but because it is what it is. I can't think of a better time of the year than World Cup in the summer, incredible.... I see I'm not going to convince you otherwise.
motion Posted June 9, 2007 Posted June 9, 2007 I'm not bothered if Rugby doesn't do Fighting/Racism, If it doesn't great but that doesn't mean I'm going to burst my football and pick up the rugby. I just feel sorry for you that your perceptions of the sport are altered by the Minority. Football is the most followed sport in the world, not because of the small amount of violence, but because it is what it is. I can't think of a better time of the year than World Cup in the summer, incredible.... I see I'm not going to convince you otherwise. The SPORT itself I have no problem with. I may find it boring and dull but I'm happy that many people like it. My problem is the ethos of professional football, and all the problems associated with it that you don't find in rugby. Shall I list them again? - Segregation of fans. Why does this happen in football by the way? - Over-payed prima-donnas playing it - Abuse shouted at ref - Diving - Corruption - Dull 0-0 or 1-0 scorelines - Many players are thugs off the pitch - Violence and racism - Abuse towards opposition players/managers - Hostile atmosphere THAT is my problem with pro football, and most of those things are certainly not 'in the minority'. I'm proud to be a rugby man. Where you can have the best banter pre/post match with guys supporting the other team. Asking the question again about segregation of fans in football... why does this happen? Is it to keep the injury/death count low?
Problematique Posted June 9, 2007 Posted June 9, 2007 I love watching Rugby, but I have to say I find football much more entertaining. Rugby seems a bit too...structured, in a way, whereas in football absolutely anything can happen. Rugby is structured, yes, but then broken play makes up a lot of a game as well. To be honest though I do prefer the structured, more forwards orientated Northern Hemisphere game to the faster paced, running Southern Hemisphere game. Mostly because I was brought up on it as well as the fact that there's an appalling number of missed tackles in the Super 14 (and here the ethos is to make every tackle count). Anyway, my point is there is nothing more satisfying than going through 15 phases to score a try in a rugby match. Because you know that every forward has done their bit to get there. Team spirit in rugby - as far as I have seen - is much more prevalent. Especially in the forwards, but also in the backs to keep the shape. Football is also a team sport but not to the same extent as rugby I guess. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T126TYBorhA
Ant-Shimmin Posted June 9, 2007 Posted June 9, 2007 - Segregation of fans. Why does this happen in football by the way? - Over-payed prima-donnas playing it - Abuse shouted at ref - Diving - Corruption - Dull 0-0 or 1-0 scorelines - Many players are thugs off the pitch - Violence and racism - Abuse towards opposition players/managers - Hostile atmosphere I'm proud to be a rugby man. Where you can have the best banter pre/post match with guys supporting the other team. You've answered them questions in all of your posts, I don't know what I can say to make you realise that isn't what Football is about. All I'm going to say Is I think you are implying your posts about the people who follow football are below those that follow Rugby.
motion Posted June 9, 2007 Posted June 9, 2007 Agree, in football players play for themselves whereas in rugby it's far more about team spirit. Good try. How about this clip: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EOxpIKT5Y7I You've answered them questions in all of your posts, I don't know what I can say to make you realise that isn't what Football is about. What do you mean it's not what football is about? It's what happens in football, maybe some of those things didn't happen 30-40 years ago but they are part of the sport NOW and are tarnishing the sport's image. Again, why do you get segregation of fans in football? All I'm going to say Is I think you are implying your posts about the people who follow football are below those that follow Rugby. Not at all.
Ant-Shimmin Posted June 9, 2007 Posted June 9, 2007 Agree, in football players play for themselves whereas in rugby it's far more about team spirit. Good try. How about this clip: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EOxpIKT5Y7I Thats a matter of Opinion Agree, in football players play for themselves whereas in rugby it's far more about team spirit. Good try. How about this clip: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EOxpIKT5Y7I What do you mean it's not what football is about? It's what happens in football, maybe some of those things didn't happen 30-40 years ago but they are part of the sport NOW and are tarnishing the sport's image. Again, why do you get segregation of fans in football? All I'm going to say Is I think you are implying your posts about the people who follow football are below those that follow Rugby. Not at all. You are though, your use of the word "Chavball" highlights this, You get segregations of fans in football so each set of supporters have a designated spot to sit and support. They can't mix because football has intense rivalry, which I think is a good thing.
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