The fish Posted May 23, 2007 Posted May 23, 2007 Ok better run to my exam reaaal soon will answer your more complex moral points first but here goes. Personal antagonism Countless Revolutionary powers vs unrevolutionary powers French revolution Illgetimacy Persian vs Byzantine wars under Heraclius Order vs Disorder French intervention in Spain 1823 Different ideologies Cold war WW2 Nationalism WW1 Italian wars against Austria Failing domestic policy distraction Charles X expitidtion into Algeria 1830 Breaking status quo German British rivalry leading up to WW1 Touche... Oh, and good luck in your exam! For the record, this is not banning Scientology. This is denying Scientology religous status under the regulations of the charity organisation. Perfectly legit claim, considering it's a batshit fucking crazy cult started by a crazy bastard. Why doesn't atheism get this status? Surly the world's second/third largest belief group (depending on how you look at it) should get it too? Also, Ron Hubbard (the founder of Scientology) has since said that it's all made up. Which perfectly demonstrates why it's both ape-shit crazy and bat-fuck insane.
rokhed00 Posted May 23, 2007 Posted May 23, 2007 Signed, I'm anti religion all round, but starting a religion on the word of some burned out scifi writer is the pinacle of needlessness.
Haden Posted May 23, 2007 Posted May 23, 2007 Calm down, no need to be a victim right away. 'Banning of religions' is really different than 'religion persecutions'. Cube was obviously exaggerating, but it's just some people's opinion that religions do more bad than they do good.Scientology should be banned for the same reasons as drug use is banned. As a religion it makes less sense than most others, but the problem is that as it's a small group, it is really likely to absorb its members into itself - there's a great amount of brainwashing going on in it. It isn't just a religion in the sense that it offers sets of beliefs, it and its community force those beliefs upon you. If you take just a bit of it, it sucks you up and will seriously mess you up. How do you ban a religion without persecuting people? Touche... Oh, and good luck in your exam! Hehe thanks I had to talk about the church in it! Some of the laws were mental. Sorry I didnt mean to kinda be over the top with that list it just kinda frustrates me when people say religion causes all wars because if you really look at them it hardly ever does. Anyway back to tom cruise!
DCK Posted May 23, 2007 Posted May 23, 2007 How do you ban a religion without persecuting people?Not by going back to medieval witch hunting anyway. 'Banning' in this case should start with removing any authority religion has established.
4q2 Posted May 23, 2007 Posted May 23, 2007 What power/authority has religion established in the west ? I have never really been ruled by it and the closest I get to it these days is with threads like these. I hate religion, but comments about banning it is going down the route of stating that a person should not have their right to believe. As with the drugs comment....We have been down this avenue before (Myself via an agree to disagree basis on factual evidence....one could argue the brainwashing has been done via goverment sponsored 'drug education'). Not every person who touches them turns into a brainwashed mindless zombie destined for an early grave. Does every person who has a beer turn into an alcoholic ? I presume most Christians dont turn all fire and brimstone in the same sense.
Kurtle Squad Posted May 23, 2007 Posted May 23, 2007 I hate Scientology as much as the next guy, but as far as I'm aware, there is nothing in the scientology text that breaks any human rights, and I agree with the statement that everyone has the right to follow in what ever they want, so no. Extreme Brainwashing isnt against human rights? Oh yeah, they also harrass (sp?) people and all sorts What power/authority has religion established in the west ?I have never really been ruled by it and the closest I get to it these days is with threads like these. A lot, and, yes you are. I hate religion, but comments about banning it is going down the route of stating that a person should not have their right to believe.As with the drugs comment....We have been down this avenue before (Myself via an agree to disagree basis on factual evidence....one could argue the brainwashing has been done via goverment sponsored 'drug education'). Not every person who touches them turns into a brainwashed mindless zombie destined for an early grave. Does every person who has a beer turn into an alcoholic ? I presume most Christians dont turn all fire and brimstone in the same sense. You do realise it's a cult, dangerous, blah blah blah. People believe in a lot of things, you know, like the Holocaust, or do you think Hitler was fine in thinking all was well.....Didnt think so...
Shino Posted May 23, 2007 Posted May 23, 2007 I just don't get it, why should this be consider a religion? Why not Jedi?
Rummy Posted May 23, 2007 Posted May 23, 2007 I do not want this cult to be recognised or even associated with religion, and so I have signed it. Scientology is terrible from what I've seen of their own practitioners' actions, and a farce.
4q2 Posted May 23, 2007 Posted May 23, 2007 A lot, and, yes you are. Nice vague answer.... Now please point out where and how. I get up in the morning as I have done for almost 34 years, dont have to pray to any religion. It does not figure in any part of my daily activities. I am not imprisoned or persecuted for refusing to turn up at church each week in my sunday best to worship. I can be considered blasphemous on most days and I have not suffered one iota...Therefore I am not ruled by or made to follow any religion. I dont count the Queen 'owning' her government and being the head of the COE a valid point either. Where is the religion that rules me ? (Worship of the mighty pub beerpump isnt a valid point either even though Stella can be quite an unforgiving goddess). You do realise it's a cult, dangerous, blah blah blah.People believe in a lot of things, you know, like the Holocaust, or do you think Hitler was fine in thinking all was well.....Didnt think so... Scientology has never been a religion as stated, But I dont agree with the whole all religions banned thing...People should have their freedom to think and believe, but I do find them scientologists funny...Fuck em. I'm intelligent enough to not get involved even if Tom Cruise isnt. As far as my thoughts on Hitler goes....I wont even start. That is a whole new can of worms I could open debate wise
Haden Posted May 23, 2007 Posted May 23, 2007 Not by going back to medieval witch hunting anyway. 'Banning' in this case should start with removing any authority religion has established. What do you mean by removing authority?
eel Posted May 23, 2007 Posted May 23, 2007 Banning all religions would be heaven. (it is him isnt it?) Lol.
Mundi Posted May 24, 2007 Posted May 24, 2007 What do you mean by removing authority? I think he´s meaning it as in: Cut off a snakes heads to kill the body. Bur forgets the part where the snake grows a more "extreme" head
McPhee Posted May 24, 2007 Posted May 24, 2007 How many wars have been started due to reasons other than religious-based one? Has there ever been a religious war? I got the impression they were all about furthering the power of men than defending the honour of the Gods Religion, when used correctly, does a lot of good in the world. Its people trying to exploit religion that causes the problems On the Scientology front; i don't really care if it does become a religion. I don't believe in it and therefore it doesn't affect me
Shino Posted May 24, 2007 Posted May 24, 2007 Has there ever been a religious war? I got the impression they were all about furthering the power of men than defending the honour of the Gods Religion, when used correctly, does a lot of good in the world. Its people trying to exploit religion that causes the problems Has there ever been any religious good? I thought we helped other people because they need help, not because it expands a belief system, and if we do it to achieve that, we're just helping those with power using religion as a weapon. I think both you and I are correct, so I suppose we can assume that religion is no longer needed. On the Scientology front; i don't really care if it does become a religion. I don't believe in it and therefore it doesn't affect me I don't know how it works there, but here religions have some benefits, as lower taxes on their infrastructure and such.
Twozzok Posted May 24, 2007 Posted May 24, 2007 1. The Digg Link Here 2. A another crosspost which I think explains quite a bit (at least the links do) Everything they do is to contain, surround, erect totems to warn people off, and lie to prevent public understanding that it is a naziesque moneygrubbing scam that chews up innocents and spits out dead bodies, lawsuits,psychopaths and criminals. 3. Yet another good post. Why are people still making the "it's like any other religion" argument? Stop. It's retarded. Other religions do not: -Have an exact monetary value for salvation -Hire PR firms in order to defend themselves from regular journalistic investigation -Make people sign billion year contracts -Promise magic powers -Disconnect people from families -Claim cheap lie detectors can be used to determine how unhappy you are -Advocate the genocide of an entire profession -Claim vitamins can cure mental illness And the ones who do share one or more of those traits are considered cults or very extreme.
DCK Posted May 24, 2007 Posted May 24, 2007 What do you mean by removing authority? Governments view religion as a means of seperation, there are Christian schools, Islamic schools; banning of religious attributes such as veils or kippahs is not allowed; and there are governments with Christian parties that actually feel the state should believe in God. Governments should become 100% atheistic. Religion should be compromised to private practice and not a public affair. I admit that 'banning' of religion is something that is near impossible, but it's something that the world should strive to.
Haden Posted May 24, 2007 Posted May 24, 2007 Governments view religion as a means of seperation, there are Christian schools, Islamic schools; banning of religious attributes such as veils or kippahs is not allowed; and there are governments with Christian parties that actually feel the state should believe in God. Governments should become 100% atheistic. Religion should be compromised to private practice and not a public affair. I admit that 'banning' of religion is something that is near impossible, but it's something that the world should strive to. 100% atheistic? 100% liberal neutral would be much more advisable.
triforce_keeper Posted May 24, 2007 Posted May 24, 2007 I have never heard of Scientology Anyone care to explain?
DCK Posted May 24, 2007 Posted May 24, 2007 100% atheistic? 100% liberal neutral would be much more advisable.Sorry, wrong wording. You're right, they should be neutral and not regard any beliefs as special. In fact, they shouldn't regard them at all.
martinist Posted May 24, 2007 Posted May 24, 2007 I have never heard of Scientology Anyone care to explain? an organization made of pure evil (and Tom Cruse)
Twozzok Posted May 24, 2007 Posted May 24, 2007 I have never heard of Scientology Anyone care to explain? Read some of what I posted above, gives a general Idea :p
The fish Posted May 24, 2007 Posted May 24, 2007 100% atheistic? 100% liberal neutral would be much more advisable. I second that! How about adding "Secular" to that?
4q2 Posted May 24, 2007 Posted May 24, 2007 Governments should become 100% atheistic. Religion should be compromised to private practice and not a public affair.I admit that 'banning' of religion is something that is near impossible, but it's something that the world should strive to. In a perfect world Governments should be a lot of things, but the fact is we the people vote for the showers of shite in power (Unless you are of the Illuminati / Masons / Bildeburg / Skull and Bones conspiracy David Icke frame of mind type in which case we are all cattle powerless to control our own destinies). Religion will not die any time soon due to certain people needing reason for their very existence and until someone can put some reason or solid science to it all everybodies beliefs here are no better than any other individuals.
Haden Posted May 24, 2007 Posted May 24, 2007 I second that!How about adding "Secular" to that? Hmm almost certianly, I think all religions should be taught to allow freedom of thought, if that fits in secular then that should be fine.
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