The Star Wars Thread

[Ronnie]

Bit of a personal project of mine these past couple of years. I've created a set of Star Wars infographics, that show off exactly how long a particular location is on screen for. Been working on them on/off since Covid hit.

Here's the main one but if anyone's interested, check out the full set: www.locationscreentime.com 

[bob]

Interesting that ESB only had 4 locations (well, 3 really if you discount 'space').

[Ronnie]

On the one end of the scale you have the original trilogy, The Phantom Menace and The Last Jedi which make do with a small number of locations. On the other you have Revenge of the Sith and Rise of Skywalker that throw a million places at you. Especially the latter. 

[Ronnie]

New trailer for The Book of Boba Fett

I don't normally watch trailers beyond the first one but I figured this one wouldn't show too much, and so it proved 

[darksnowman]

The Book of Boba Fett should be solid enough if Mando is anything to go by. I'll be waiting a few weeks for the episodes to queue up before getting around to it. 

[Ronnie]

Good read by The Holywood Reporter: https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/tv/tv-features/robert-rodriguez-interview-book-of-boba-fett-star-wars-1235062364/

- Very few people knew the series was a thing before the reveal teaser at the end of the Mando S2 finale, including most at Disney+
- Showrunner/Director Robert Rodriguez not normally keen on doing established properties. "I’d rather go do something I’ve created so nobody can say, ‘Hey, that’s wrong because..." (sound familiar?), but pulled in by how little had been established about Boba before
- The trailers showed footage from the first half of the first episode. They couldn't show anything from the latter half of the opener because it would "give too much away"
- “Things turn up you don’t expect, you see things we couldn’t believe we got to do,” he says. “Every episode has big surprises.”
- “We’ve always dealt with the Empire and the Jedis; this was about these gangster families and has a rawness to it,” she says. “It’s quite different from The Mandalorian, which is more like a Western.”
- Production wasn't impacted by the pandemic in a practical sense, but Rodriguez took every day as if it could be the last before shutting down.
- Lucasfilm worked with him instead of telling him what he could and couldn't do.
- Potential more seasons if people like it

[Julius]

Just finished the first episode of The Book of Boba Fett. Scattered thoughts:

Spoiler

Unsurprisingly the show looks great, a couple of weird shots and moments where the CG seems a bit off (the focus - or lack thereof on the Massiff - in one particular shot caught my eye), but they were neither here nor there. 

Wasn't expecting a 10 minute prologue at the start going into this (much less one with no dialogue?), so was pleasantly surprised to see us already start getting answers on how far back this show could go with it showing the Geonosian colosseum shot of Boba clutching Jango's head/helmet from Attack of the Clones (seriously great job on the new shots there, they made it feel like there was leftover footage from AOTC - think I spotted that a kid Boba body double was credited?), and of course it was cool to immediately get answers on how Boba escaped the Sarlacc Pit. Also wasn't expecting Tusken Raiders to be somewhat central to this episode, much less come out caring about this Tusken Raider kid prison guard (a true nightmare!), but I'm glad we get to see something of a different side to them once again -- hope they pop back up in present day at some point down the road. Got to imagine so, think his treatment (the kid taking the credit but the chieftain sharing water with Boba, implying he knew it was him, so he's now somewhat respected rather than just viewed as a slave?) might be one of the things that pushes his whole "Respect over fear" campaign promise. Their get-ups are very Lawrence of Arabia, wouldn't be surprised if they all turned up in a moment of crisis to lend Boba a hand on present day. 

Far as I'm aware that six-limbed beast (which I feel like everyone, myself included, was going to be a Krayt Dragon at first? And then when an arm came out I was like -- "wait, a rancor?") is brand new, love how they made it look stop motion (reminded me of some of the Holochess pieces), though it did seem a bit like a 60's sci-fi alien of the week. 

A lot of focus on the past in this episode, which I thought was honestly far more interesting than everything going on in present day -- well, save for a Trandoshan dropping off a Wookiee pelt as an offering to Boba! Oh, and the Gamorrean Guards pledging their allegiance and actually proving that they can be useful. And obviously the return of the champion that is Max Reno -- the little blue guy made it! I think playing a remix of some Cantina Band music? 

Also -- were those the Boston Dynamics robots? They stuck out like a sore thumb, took me out of it a bit. Looking forward to seeing that Fennec drives a Tesla next week 

Still don't particularly care for Fennec, the action sequence was a bit dull against the Tatooine Power Rangers, so yeah, the present day stuff was pretty meh. I'm curious to see just how much flashback stuff we get this season, considering that it's supposedly going to bridge the gap to the third season of Mando. 

Also, we've got to mention this:

The main title theme for the show is great, feels very fresh but also very much in keeping with Mando's theme. Shame Göransson isn't on this full-time, but I'm curious and hopeful to see what Joe Shirley does given the opportunity he has here (think he's been working with Göransson and essentially his protégé since, what, Creed?). 

Overall, a solid but subdued opening episode, hopeful for next week! 

[Ronnie]

Just watched Chapter 1 too, Loved it. Very much left me wanting more though, a much more subdued opening than I was expecting but I don't think that's a bad thing. Seeing where Fett came from since ROTJ is pretty much necessary for the show to succeed. 

My biggest worry going into this show was that it would take itself too seriously and that Fett and Fennec would have almost zero personality to speak of. Thankfully that wasn't the case pretty early on with Fett's "Did you catch any of that?" line and a few others dotted around. I've never been the biggest fan of Fennec but she seemed a tad more laid back here so hopefully her character will continue to grow on me.

Spoiler

The show looks incredible, no surprise. Visuals and cinematography. I like Fett's theme but the overall main title theme might have to grow on me. 

The title cards and end credits seemed to position this very much like a sibling show of Mando, which I know is obvious, but still cool.

Also for a second I thought that was Cobb Vanth the Nikkto's were attacking! Probably not though. Don't think we've seen the mark they drew on the wall but I could be wrong.

4 hours ago, Julius said:

the kid taking the credit but the chieftain sharing water with Boba, implying he knew it was him, so he's now somewhat respected rather than just viewed as a slave?) might be one of the things that pushes his whole "Respect over fear" campaign promise.

That's the major takeaway I got from the flashback scene too. Nice ending, and yes the stop motion monster felt incredibly cheesy and yet incredibly Star Wars haha.

4 hours ago, Julius said:

A lot of focus on the past in this episode, which I thought was honestly far more interesting than everything going on in present day

I'm actually the opposite I think. I enjoyed the present day stuff more than the flashbacks, but both were good imo.

As a random aside, so those pesky Jawas still have Fett's helmet?? Maybe that's what present day Chapter 2 will be about haha. 

Loved the Gamorreans. 

I see a couple of reviews online calling the episode boring. *rolls eyes*. That's what TikTok and modern day action series and films have taught us to expect, explosions or action every two seconds. Those reviewers might want to watch the opening twenty minutes of A New Hope as a reminder of what Star Wars started out as.

My only slight concern is that the show seems to be positioning itself as a lot less episodic than Mando, which I'm sure some people will prefer but personally I liked the old school adventure of the week type deal we've gotten used to in the other show. Then again I need to remember to stop letting expectation cloud my judgement and stop me from enjoying Star Wars to the full. It's a sentiment I think a lot of fans should pay attention to, the fandom would be a much happier place. 

Anyway, overall great stuff, I groaned when the end credits appeared, instantly wanting to see more.

God it feels good to have live action Star Wars again. It feels like years since Mando season 2, and all it's been is 12 months.

Edited December 30, 2021 by Ronnie

[Ronnie]

Blown away by Chapter 2. Absolutely fantastic. Much as I loved last week, it definitely felt more like a prologue of sorts, things definitely went up a notch here, at least in the flashback part of the episode.

Spoiler

It's interesting that the past is where the meat of the story appears to be, because everything happening in the present, much as I'm enjoying it, is paced pretty glacially. Not that it's boring, just that what happens seems to take place over the course of an afternoon 

What they're doing with the Tuskans is absolutely fantastic. Brilliant idea to flesh them out.

When Boba suggested taking down the train (what a cool concept for the episode btw), I figured it might be a season finale type setpiece, but nah they went straight into it. Awesome action scene, stunning visuals (although anything with speeder bikes on a wide open space always looks a little dodgy, here and when it happened in Mando).

As for the present... the Ithorian mayor was cool af.

So glad they're injecting a bit of humour into the show too, I was totally wrong this show would take itself too seriously.

Oh and I don't collect action figures, but even I want Black Series ones of the two Gamorreans. Love them.

 I was a bit sceptical about this show but it's proving me totally wrong, couldn't take my eyes off this episode and kept hoping there was plenty of run-time left.

[Ronnie]

Some really great bits in Chapter 3 and one glaringly awful bit!

Spoiler

I love how this show is re-contextualising familiar things.

The interwoven storylines with the Tuskans and the present one of Boba building his own tribe is really well done. We've seen over and over how Mos Espa is pushing back against the way Fett wants to do things but his newfound compassion and respect for people comes back to save him over and over, the Gamorreans in Chap 1 and now the cyberpunk-y street gang in Chap 3, I assume Krrsantan will pop up again later too after being released).

I loved the Rancor bonding scene, and the fight scene with Krrsantan. The gang are pretty fun too, definite parallels to American Graffiti there.

The speeder chase scene was just terrible. Plain and simple. I appreciate it must be tough to do something like that in The Volume, but still. I can't believe they put that out when the quality of production has so far been top notch in pretty much all Disney Star Wars. And Fennec continues to have zero personality, it's a real shame they're not really developing her much, if any.

The plot kind of meandered a little bit, and the episode did feel a bit like table arranging for the final four chapters, putting all the pieces in play and setting the stage for the rest of the season, but it was still fun to watch. I wonder if we'll visit Oba Diah in a future episode, maybe even the finale. It was name-checked so it wouldn't surprise me. The Slave I has to get some action surely!

Excited for next week!

Edited January 13, 2022 by Ronnie

[Ronnie]

Chapter 4 was great. Loads of great bits in both past and present.

Spoiler

Even though I still think Fennec is bland af, the episode gave us some much needed backstory on their relationship and it was fun to see their chemistry develop.

Loved them breaking into Jabba's palace, and the little drone thing. Plus the antics in the kitchen 

Boba's ship tearing through those bikers was a stunning visual.

Feels like the flashbacks are done with, in terms of major story-telling. People will be happy about that I guess. It does feel like all the pieces are in place for a the last few episodes now. Well I say all the pieces...

Holy fuck, Mando is coming! That end of episode tease had me grinning from ear to ear.  

 

[Julius]

EA have announced three upcoming titles from Respawn (well, two? We already knew about The Sequel to Star Wars Jedi: Fallen Order ).

From their press release:

Quote

Electronic Arts Inc. (NASDAQ:EA) and Lucasfilm Games  are joining forces to continue delivering all-new, world-class gaming experiences set within the beloved Star Wars galaxy.  

Respawn Entertainment, best known for their work on Apex Legends™, Titanfall™ and Star Wars Jedi: Fallen Order™, is leading the development and production of these new projects.  Vince Zampella, Group GM and Founder of Respawn, will oversee this new phase of EA’s relationship with Lucasfilm, building on Respawn’s award-winning history in game development and expertise in telling compelling Star Wars stories.  

Game Director Stig Asmussen and his team at the studio are already working on the next game in the action adventure Star Wars Jedi series, and are joined by two new teams working to deliver additional unique Star Wars gameplay experiences across multiple genres. Leading the development of Respawn’s all-new Star Wars first-person shooter game is Peter Hirschmann, Game Director at Respawn, who has a long and accomplished history with the Star Wars franchise. The third title is a Star Wars strategy game developed through a production collaboration with the newly formed studio Bit Reactor, helmed by games industry veteran Greg Foerstch. Respawn will produce the new Star Wars strategy game while Bit Reactor leads on the development of the title. 

“We are excited to continue working with the superbly talented developers at Respawn,” said Douglas Reilly, VP, Lucasfilm Games. “They have demonstrated excellence in telling epic Star Wars stories along with best-in-class gameplay across different genres and we are looking forward to bringing more amazing experiences to the galaxy far, far away.” 

“Building on the previous successes of our EA relationship, this new collaboration highlights the trust and mutual respect shared between the world-class teams at EA, Respawn and Lucasfilm Games,” said Sean Shoptaw, SVP, Walt Disney Games. “Fostered by the expertise and passion within each team, we will create thrilling original games for diverse audiences across the Star Wars galaxy.” 

“Working with Lucasfilm Games on a new FPS in the Star Wars galaxy is a dream come true for me, as this is a story I have always wanted to tell,” said Peter Hirschmann, game director at Respawn. Peter previously worked as VP of development at LucasArts, and was executive producer on the original Star Wars Battlefront games. Hirschmann and the team at Respawn have just begun work on the title. 

We know so little about them that I didn't know if it was worth making dedicated threads for the games, so here we are  I've got to imagine they're getting this out of the way in anticipation of their exclusivity deal ending next year, so hopefully this opens up the floor to even more projects being announced. 

Would love for that FPS to be a Republic Commando reboot/sequel/-like game, and interesting that Hirschmann is leasing development on it - he has ties to producing Star Wars video games dating back to the original Battlefront, as well as a bunch of LEGO games. Worth noting that Bit Reactor are a newly formed studio (I mean, they were revealed last week) comprised of XCOM and Civilization veterans from Firaxis, so very much looking forward to seeing what they turn out too.

Edited January 25, 2022 by Julius

[Cube]

57 minutes ago, Julius said:

I've got to imagine they're getting this out of the way in anticipation of their exclusivity deal ending next year, so hopefully this opens up the floor to even more projects being announced. 

Other publishers have already announced Star Wars projects. Ubisoft's Massive Entertainment (The Division) are making one, and Aspyr are remaking Knights of the Old Republic.

[Julius]

10 minutes ago, Cube said:

Other publishers have already announced Star Wars projects. Ubisoft's Massive Entertainment (The Division) are making one, and Aspyr are remaking Knights of the Old Republic.

Yeah I'm well aware, that's why I said "even more"  and Eclipse, too. 

EA winding down and announcing titles that are likely the last to be announced under their current exclusivity deal in such a matter-of-fact way over a year before the deal ends makes me think that we could see further projects announced (in addition to those already announced) throughout the rest of the year. The titles announced and revealed by other publishers so far is likely Lucasfilm Games wanting things lined up and ready to go for when that EA deal ends. 

[Ronnie]

Chapter 5 was fucking. outstanding. I don't think I've ever shouted at the tv when the end credits popped up, simply wanting MORE.

Spoiler

It might as well have been the opening episode of season 3 of The Mandalorian. That's exactly how it was structured.

Obviously comparisons to the The Book of Boba Fett will be made and how unflattering the contrast seems between the two shows at first. But of course, we've had 16 episodes to grow to love Mando, and just 4 with Boba, so it's probably not the fairest comparison. 

Everything was pretty much perfect, and a huge round of applause for Bryce Dallas Howard. More top tier Star Wars from her. The visuals too, amazing (those X-wing shots towards the end and the low angle view of Mando in his N-1 (!!) starfighter .

Seeing the armourer and moving that plot-point along was unexpected but awesome. Loved the station thing they were on.

For an episode without a ton of action, it was absolutely thrilling.

This Mandoverse that Favreau and Filoni are creating, sign me the fuck up, so exciting.

10/10, which seems to be exactly what its Rotten Tomatoes score is.

[Ronnie]

Fair play, they aren't half-arsing the Favreau/Filoni-verse! Chapter 6 was quite something.

Spoiler

Much as I absolutely adored the previous episode as an interlude of sorts that serviced the main plot of the show, I struggled with this one a bit. I get that the themes are similar but the Luke/Grogu stuff, as great as it was seemed a very jarring fit in a series about Boba Fett. I think I just need to alter my perception of what this show is, relax and I'd be able to enjoy it a lot more. It just seemed quite jarring, even though the CG with Luke was nothing short of astounding. Incredible work by the wizards at ILM.

Tons of references and easter eggs, as is to be expected from a Filoni episode. Nice to see Cobb Vanth back, and Cad Bane was pure nightmare fuel. Brilliantly realised into live action. 

I'm very glad they held off on Mando's reunion with Grogu, it would have taken a lot of the impact out of the Mando S2 finale if they met again. Beautiful scenes on that planet though, loved the lifting the frogs bit and the droid building Luke's temple, great stuff. 

This episode really drove home my only problem with these two live action shows. The dialogue is so incredibly stiff most of the time. I often ask myself, can these people just talk normally for once. Ahsoka, Luke, Boba, Fennec, Garsa, Cobb Vanth. It's the polar opposite of something like Rebels that was so much more personality-driven. I'm 100% putting this down to Favreau's writing. It's something that really winds me up tbh, that's why characters like Peli or Mayfeld are a rare highlight.

Anyway, great episode, even if I'm struggling to wrap my head around it belonging in this show.

Delighted to see people online loving it though. Another 100% on RT.

Edited February 3, 2022 by Ronnie

[Julius]

Just finished catching up on Chapters 4 to 6 of The Book of Boba Fett, fell behind firstly due to being ill and then realising that I wasn't totally in love with it anyways. And Chapter 3 kind of sucked with the Power Rangers, but anyways...

Spoiler

Chapter 4

Yeah, this one was a bit of a mixed bag too. Not as bad as I thought Chapter 3 was at times, but I'm so happy we moved on from Boba Fett and Fennec after this, and the Mando tease at the end of the episode with his theme kicking in was great. 

What I will say is that while I enjoyed much of the flashback stuff with Boba (it was much more interesting than present day for me), once we caught up to The Mandalorian I was instantly less interested. I also think they did a pretty terrible job of making the flashbacks feel like they take place over several years across this episode and the ones preceding it. 

Chapter 5

Now this is more like it. Mando returning, dealing with the fact that there's a living Vizsla and Darksaber in the same room, an N-1 Starfighter (!!!) turning up and flying through Beggar's Canyon for a podracing throwback, and then Mando climbing out after saying it was "wizard"? There's too much fan service, and then there's this: reverence for what came before without the incessant winking and nodding. Some beautiful shots, really well directed episode by Bryce Dallas Howard - I do question if she lucked out getting such great stuff to direct in the first place, but still, she's been doing a splendid job. Also, considering we only got a Star Wars 1313 leak with them in a week or so ago, was really surprised to see the frozen Tauntaun carcasses in the meatshop. Love the inclusion of a BD unit, by the way, let's see those hanging with Grogu so we can all die peacefully. 

They also went straight up Nausicäa during the Night of a Thousand Tears sequence, which I'm going to guess was Filoni's influence being thrown into the mix somewhere:

You can say it's a coincidence and has been done elsewhere a whole lot, but there are definitely some parallels to draw beyond the visuals, and also the fact that Filoni straight up tried to make live-action Princess Mononoke when Ahsoka first turned up in Mando. 

Both The Clone Wars and Rebels in my opinion got much stronger when they started doing standalone episodes and side stories parallel to the core story of their casts, and so hopefully this is a sign of things to come - we're now at the stage where live-action shows set in this period really start to run away in quality - rather than realising there wasn't much of a story to tell focusing on Boba in the first place. Or rather, at least not in the way they've gone about it.

My only concern is that in a show called The Book of Boba Fett...we haven't had much to really hook us on his story, and I feel like it's been a huge missed opportunity in that regard. 

Chapter 6

Take a bow ILM, because the work put into Luke's appearance since the pretty vocal feedback from Mando S2's finale is clear to see. Holy hell, they knocked it out of the park...for like 90% of the time he was on-screen, which is leaps and bounds better than before. Thought he looked best in the opening meditation scene and when running through the forest, a bit rough during his walk with Grogu, but back to being great again back in the hut. Nice to see his interactions with Ahsoka, hopefully we see more of that in her spin-off. It was a bit distracting to go back and forth between this and Mando's story, and the little stuff relating directly to Boba that we got, but it was once again a big step up in direction from Dave Filoni. 

Seeing Cobb Vanth again was great, like what they did with the character, and loved Cad Bane turning back up for a second time within 12 months. Dude is basically Terminator. Wasn't too keen on the top half of his face, or his hat feeling too small in comparison to his head, or that he was too pale (I can put this down to age, but my issue is that he looked super washed out as a result because of the sky behind him during the standoff). It was obvious where the standoff was going, and it leaves me wondering if this show now gets the chance to end on the Boba v. Cad Bane standoff we were supposed to see in Clone Wars. I hope not, because I feel we know how that will go. 

This episode was also one which highlighted to me just how much more these show soundtracks make me appreciate John Williams' original score even more than I already did, what with Yoda's Theme and the Force Theme turning up at different points. It's not that the shows have bad music by comparison - not at all, I love their OST's! - but it just gives them even great emphasis when they do turn up. 

And, lastly: first live-action clone troopers in, what, nearly 17 years since Revenge of the Sith? Okay, I'm not sure if they're actually live-action, but you know what I mean. And 501st, no less. 

Chapters 5 and 6 felt like prequel pandering, and I'm here for it. 

Overall, really looking forward to the finale on Wednesday. Happy coincidence I caught up today, because I forgot we were only getting the 7 episodes! 

Also, @Ronnie, considering what we've had so far in the show, and especially in the last two episodes, want to get your thoughts on...

Spoiler

...what you think the tease at the end, assuming we get one, might be? 

Considering we've had such a ridiculous amount of references to clones across the multitude of Star Wars shows the last couple of years, I do wonder if they tease Snoke showing up at all? 

Besides Plagueis, during the release of the sequels, I always thought the coolest thing they could do would be have Snoke as an ancient Jedi that was imprisoned and then found by Luke and Ben, but as part of a search led by Ben (Snoke calling to him since birth, etc.). Then have Snoke slowly manipulate Ben and Luke against each other, before things come to a head with what we get in TLJ, and Ben turning to Snoke for guidance, leading him down the path he ended up walking. 

I also thought that a really cool way to open Episode IX would be something of a prologue, where Thrawn locates Palpatine (and before IX, I figured this would be Snoke). 

If they do have Snoke included at all, I hope they're smart about it, obviously, but having him be found by Thrawn would be a great way to probably hint at where they want to go with Ahsoka and beyond, and to also start us down the path to Luke and Snoke eventually meeting. I don't think it'll go down as I speculated years ago, but I could totally see them making him something of a C'Baoth character from the old EU Thrawn Trilogy. Heck, maybe Luke actually catches on eventually and cuts down proto-Snoke, only to then realise to some extent what was really going on. 

Anyways, that's probably the dream scenario for me I guess, but I don't think it would happen, and more importantly think it's an actively bad idea because it doesn't suit capping a show called The Book of Boba Fett. So, at the very best, I'm expecting Han Solo and kid Ben cameo. 

Right then, roll on Wednesday! 

[Ronnie]

Firstly, hope things are better with you @Julius these days compared to when you fell behind on the show.

I thought Chapter 3 was the weakest one but the space vespas didn't bother me at all. I feel like Star Wars is so obsessed with giving us cameos or spins on things we've seen a hundred times before I thought it was really cool to see something legitimately new in the universe. Getting the backstory on Fennec in Chapter 4 was much needed and really well done too. I'd never been a fan of hers but Chapter 4 started to change that for me. I enjoyed that one a lot. But man, Chapter 5 made me feel like a kid again. I must have watched that episode like five or six times by now, just incredible from start to finish. Possibly my favourite live action episode ever. Plus, X-wings. Automatic win.

Chapter 7 has a TON to do if it's going to put a positive spin on the show in the mainstream, even if I've personally been loving it so far. Hoping for a nice long episode, lots of action, and lots of Boba. I hope they leave Grogu out of it until Mando season 3.

Spoiler

Whilst I definitely think they're trying to flesh out the sequel era story-telling in the same way TCW did for the prequels, I can't see Snoke being a big reveal, at least not at this early stage. It would just seem completely out of the blue for the show and its themes. I could definitely see it down the line and potentially tie in with Thrawn like you suggest.

Your Snoke turning Ben against Luke idea sounds cool but wouldn't that just be retreading what happened in the prequels with Palpatine turning Anakin against Obi Wan? There was a Rise of Kylo Ren comic, apparently really beloved, that delved into Snoke's past.

As for what I think the tease at the end might be... I don't think we're wrapping up the whole crime underworld storyline in 50 minutes, so I think it might point to a larger story, possibly involving Crimson Dawn, and yes, Qi'ra. I think she might be the tease. One caveat though is that I haven't read the War of the Bounty Hunters comic series, and her story might have been wrapped up in that, as I vaguely remember hearing it had been.

 

[Julius]

8 hours ago, Ronnie said:

Firstly, hope things are better with you @Julius these days compared to when you fell behind on the show.

Doing a lot better now, thanks! 

8 hours ago, Ronnie said:

I thought Chapter 3 was the weakest one but the space vespas didn't bother me at all. I feel like Star Wars is so obsessed with giving us cameos or spins on things we've seen a hundred times before I thought it was really cool to see something legitimately new in the universe. Getting the backstory on Fennec in Chapter 4 was much needed and really well done too. I'd never been a fan of hers but Chapter 4 started to change that for me. I enjoyed that one a lot. But man, Chapter 5 made me feel like a kid again. I must have watched that episode like five or six times by now, just incredible from start to finish. Possibly my favourite live action episode ever. Plus, X-wings. Automatic win.

Yeah, it wasn't so much the Vespas (well, I did find the colours a bit ostentatious, just considering the locale) but rather the people sitting on them. I thought these IKEA models dressed as cyberpunk characters were just a bit too distracting, and don't even get me started on the fact that of all of the places in the galaxy that they went with body-mods, they went to Tatooine. Do they not know what heat does to tech?! 

I do agree it was cool seeing new stuff, though, because yeah, Star Wars definitely does get a bit too self-indulgent at times. Would much rather we get that and competent directing with a plan than how the sequels fizzled out, though. 

Quote

Chapter 7 has a TON to do if it's going to put a positive spin on the show in the mainstream, even if I've personally been loving it so far. Hoping for a nice long episode, lots of action, and lots of Boba. I hope they leave Grogu out of it until Mando season 3.

  Reveal hidden contents

Whilst I definitely think they're trying to flesh out the sequel era story-telling in the same way TCW did for the prequels, I can't see Snoke being a big reveal, at least not at this early stage. It would just seem completely out of the blue for the show and its themes. I could definitely see it down the line and potentially tie in with Thrawn like you suggest.

Your Snoke turning Ben against Luke idea sounds cool but wouldn't that just be retreading what happened in the prequels with Palpatine turning Anakin against Obi Wan? There was a Rise of Kylo Ren comic, apparently really beloved, that delved into Snoke's past.

As for what I think the tease at the end might be... I don't think we're wrapping up the whole crime underworld storyline in 50 minutes, so I think it might point to a larger story, possibly involving Crimson Dawn, and yes, Qi'ra. I think she might be the tease. One caveat though is that I haven't read the War of the Bounty Hunters comic series, and her story might have been wrapped up in that, as I vaguely remember hearing it had been.

 

Spoiler

Yeah, agreed that there's a hell of a lot to do in Chapter 7.

Chapters 5 and 6 did a lot of heavy lifting for me in terms of making the show better in terms of content, as I was much more interested, but it wasn't exactly better in the context of making a Boba Fett-centric show. 

I also agree with you that they need to leave Grogu alone now until Mando S3 -- that decision at the end of Chapter 6 was the tease, and I expect the show to start with him making the choice to go back to Mando. They could be purposefully faking us out, but having a space for him in the N-1 to replace the astromech housing is definitely trying to make us think that way. I personally don't like the idea that he ever crosses paths with Ben directly either, so I actively don't want him to stick with Luke. As great as it obviously has been seeing Luke again in live-action in some form, having him take Grogu away and then Grogu being given back shortly after with so little training and insight into his past is just an odd one for me -- I wanted, and kind of expected, him to be gone longer? 

I do hope you're right about Snoke not being a big reveal. Honestly, how Snoke has been handled in its entirety - the sequels and thereafter in the comics, like you mention - has just been so damn wishy-washy, it feels like there's a retcon everywhere you look, and the next thing is then trying to explain that retcon, etc. I'd argue he's the messiest handling of an individual character in Star Wars history, and especially one of his stature (in both a literal and storytelling sense!). 

My idea probably would be a bit similar to the prequels (then again, it's like poetry! And of all of the things the sequels did right, they did manage to squeeze some of that there GL poetry in there, that's for sure), though at that point back then when I was on Star Wars forums speculating about it with other people, it was more based on the very little we knew about him from The Force Awakens: seen the rise and fall of the old Republic, had some sort of history with Luke already, etc. Ideally I would've been speculating more about him before TFA, but it was a bit too open at that point, especially with "Snoke is Plagueis" being the runaway favourite! So my ideas have always been more of a "okay, how could you fix this/make this interesting" when looking back at the films. There's so much untapped stuff from The Force Awakens alone! 

Don't get me started on how they handled Carrie's unfortunate passing...man that film left a bitter taste! 

Anyways, back on topic: Crimson Dawn would be a great shout, I would love to see Q'ira again. Given how the First Order also backed a lot of underworld activity in order to stifle the Resistance/New Republic, you could also then easily link that at some point in the future to some more First Order teases. 

Really hope Chapter 7 does end on a high.

I was talking to a friend the other day, and maybe someone can point me towards some examples if I'm wrong, but shows and movies just lack a timelessness to them these days that I quite can't put my finger on. Don't get me wrong, there's a lot of great stuff still, and I enjoy a lot of them in the moment, but the further removed I am from new content these days, the weaker the show or film becomes in retrospect, which I can't say is the case for a lot of my own personal favourite shows and films. 

Edited February 7, 2022 by Julius

[Ronnie]

Spoiler

10 minutes ago, Julius said:

Chapters 5 and 6 did a lot of heavy lifting for me in terms of making the show better in terms of content, as I was much more interested, but it wasn't exactly better in the context of making a Boba Fett-centric show. 

It isn't a flattering comparison and puts into sharp contrast how fantastic The Mandalorian is. But then again we've had 16 episodes of that show (arguably 18 now), and only 4/6 of Boba so maybe it's an unfair comparison. Personally I thought Chapter 2 was outstanding and 4 not far behind. If 7 is up to that quality and they tease an exciting development for season 2 then I'll look at this show as a success.

13 minutes ago, Julius said:

As great as it obviously has been seeing Luke again in live-action in some form, having him take Grogu away and then Grogu being given back shortly after with so little training and insight into his past is just an odd one for me -- I wanted, and kind of expected, him to be gone longer? 

Luke tells Ahsoka he wonders if Grogu's heart is really in it. Hence the potential early exit. If he's not set on being a Jedi then let him go back to Din. I expected him to miss out all of season 3 as well but to be honest, his relationship with Din is pretty much the core of the series so I'm not too surprised. Who knows when he'll show up in S3 anyway.

16 minutes ago, Julius said:

I do hope you're right about Snoke not being a big reveal. Honestly, how Snoke has been handled in its entirety - the sequels and thereafter in the comics, like you mention - has just been so damn wishy-washy

I blame the fanbase for that, a fanbase obsessed with having every single question answered. "Who are Rey's parents??!", "Where did Snoke come from?!?". Honestly, we knew next to nothing about Palpatine in the OT, and that worked out fine. It's ok to have some mystery in the SW world.

19 minutes ago, Julius said:

Don't get me started on how they handled Carrie's unfortunate passing...man that film left a bitter taste! 

It was genuinely an impossible task. I fully believe they did the best they could have. It must have been so difficult to write a storyline with one hand tied behind their back.

 

21 minutes ago, Julius said:

I still haven't been able to bring myself to watch a Star Wars film since

Not to tell you how to live your life but you really shouldn't let one film hamper your enjoyment of stuff you previously did enjoy. It reminds me of my brother, he came out of The Force Awakens and The Last Jedi glowing with praise, he loved them. Then he started watching YouTube videos, especially from those utter morons Red Letter Media and suddenly he did a complete 180 and now hates stuff he previously enjoyed, all because of the loudmouth internet narrative telling him how to think. When it comes to Star Wars, I try and live by the excellent Force Centre Podcast mantra 'Engage with the story presented, not the story you wanted or expected to see'. I found TROS convoluted and far too fast-paced, but it moved me and made me tear up on multiple occasions. Rey and Kylo's lightsaber transfer is in my top 5 coolest Star Wars moments ever. If you didn't like the film, fair enough, but you should try and not let it diminish all the stuff you do like.

 

28 minutes ago, Julius said:

Anyways, back on topic: Crimson Dawn would be a great shout, I would love to see Q'ira again

Star Wars Explained (another must watch bit of SW content) seemed to suggest the way things ended with Qi'ra in the recent comic series would make her showing up unlikely. I could be mis-remembering though, I've not read it. If ever a show would delve into Crimson Dawn though, this is it.

 

[Julius]

Spoiler

10 hours ago, Ronnie said:

It isn't a flattering comparison and puts into sharp contrast how fantastic The Mandalorian is. But then again we've had 16 episodes of that show (arguably 18 now), and only 4/6 of Boba so maybe it's an unfair comparison. Personally I thought Chapter 2 was outstanding and 4 not far behind. If 7 is up to that quality and they tease an exciting development for season 2 then I'll look at this show as a success.

Oh yeah, that's totally fair. The thing with Book of Boba Fett for me is that it basically has turned out as a Mando Season 2.5 -- while it's great seeing the wider cast again, I thought this show was a great opportunity to really give some context to the state of the criminal underworld in the wider galaxy, zeroing in on Boba, and showing how much of a badass he is. Instead, he's been upstaged by Mando already when it comes to action set-pieces, and we've got context for little else beyond the state of Tatooine in terms of the criminal underworld (which is fine, but it's also a really shallow look at the state of Tatooine), so I hope this last episode rectifies that all a bit. I still think it can go out with a bang. 

10 hours ago, Ronnie said:

I blame the fanbase for that, a fanbase obsessed with having every single question answered. "Who are Rey's parents??!", "Where did Snoke come from?!?". Honestly, we knew next to nothing about Palpatine in the OT, and that worked out fine. It's ok to have some mystery in the SW world.

See, while I agree with where you're coming from and do think the Star Wars fanbase (and let's be honest, every fanbase) can get carried away with wanting a full wiki breakdown of every character, as the storyteller setting the stage for this trilogy, I think Abrams and many of the staff involved with The Force Awakens from a narrative-building perspective are ultimately responsible for this being as much of a frenzy as it was.

An important part of telling a story on an epic scale is knowing your audience and knowing the message that you are trying to convey to that audience: the original trilogy was ultimately a story about hope and redemption, whereas the prequels were a cautionary tale of holding unfaltering beliefs and the dangers of forbidding one of the most fundamental feelings, love. The sequels at the best of times repeat the exact same message as the original trilogy, which I think is their biggest issue: a lack of identity. They're clearly Star Wars influenced too much by Star Wars.

Personally, rather than have the redemption story repeat again (and, you know, killing off the best character in the trilogy), I think the ending should have been about consequence. I think I've mentioned it before, but imagine if the film ended with Kylo being arrested by the Resistance for everything that happened, and him having to deal with the consequence of his actions. It also fits the idea of having the sequel trilogy in the first place. 

Which is where I think you run into those questions being raised quite naturally by the audience as a response to Abrams and his mystery box. I enjoy The Force Awakens, but there's no denying the similarities to A New Hope in overall structure, characters, etc., and so I think even more so than would be typical, the audience are sent looking deeper for answers to questions raised in the film that, at the time, Abrams and co. had zero intention of answering, because they simply hadn't thought about it.

I think it's totally natural to question where Snoke came from and who he is given that in the film he states that he's seen the rise and fall of the old Republic, because without the context we get much later on that he's a Palpatine sock puppet, this means he's been around just as long as Palpatine, so where the hell was he? And not to mention that this is a trilogy of trilogies, so the natural escalation is going to be that this trilogy's Big Bad must be bigger and badder than the last one's.

I also think it's totally naturally to question where Rey came from and who she is in relation to the other characters, because Star Wars is ultimately a space opera, and family is integral to the story at large. The Skywalker Saga tells us in the prequels that love is forbidden for Jedi, etc., and then the only Jedi to have children in these films has a son who is the hero of the original trilogy and who himself is the Chosen One. When the last two protagonists have been related and naturally very attuned to the Force, I think it's natural for the conversation to start about who Rey is and where she comes from. 

The guys working on Rey's backstory would have been fully aware that, but I think it was handled terribly. Even before the film released, they were trying to mislead the audience into thinking that Finn was the protagonist and would become a Jedi, something I remember many people thinking going into the film, and kept Rey on the back burner somewhat. They also did something similar with Kylo, and I also remember many thinking that he wouldn't be the son of Han and Leia. And the thing is, it's clear that Abrams and co. were totally capable of delivering answers, because look at how nonchalantly Kylo is revealed to be Ben, the son of Han and Leia, in The Force Awakens. It's said offhand by Snoke and is not built up as a big deal, whereas if anything, the Forceback scene and voices only serve to emphasise further that something has to be up with Rey. 

So, while I agree with you that fans looked too deep for answers, and that mystery in Star Wars is great, ultimately I think it lies with Abrams and the others who wrote the story. And the thing is, I actually think in this day and age, stoking those fires for fans to debate and discuss is smart as a storyteller telling a story of this scale, because beyond budget and scale it promotes discussion beyond simple viewership -- but if you're going to do that, you have to have answers ready to go. 

10 hours ago, Ronnie said:

It was genuinely an impossible task. I fully believe they did the best they could have. It must have been so difficult to write a storyline with one hand tied behind their back.

While I do agree that it's a difficult decision to make, I don't think it's nearly as impossible as you think to write yourself out of a corner like that, so I would have to respectfully disagree that that's the best they could do: I think the decision was ultimately rushed, and that they put the PR of using unused footage of a now deceased actress in a new film above the story, because they totally misinterpreted that that was something fans would want to see. 

I think the best thing they could and really should have done is write Leia pass away between the events of The Last Jedi and The Rise of Skywalker and have the story react somewhat to that. I saw a number of ideas online for how it could have been handled well in the three years between Carrie's passing and the release of The Rise of Skywalker, so there was definitely potential for it to be handled much better than it was. 

Plus, I think The Last Jedi already gave us the perfect goodbye to Carrie and Leia. 

It's just as much Luke saying goodbye to Leia as it is Mark and the audience saying goodbye to Carrie. It was also great to hear Luke and Leia finally used in the way John Williams always wanted (it was supposed to be a much more frequently occuring track in Return of the Jedi originally, so it's unsurprising that Marion's Theme in Indiana Jones is so similar). 

10 hours ago, Ronnie said:

Not to tell you how to live your life but you really shouldn't let one film hamper your enjoyment of stuff you previously did enjoy. It reminds me of my brother, he came out of The Force Awakens and The Last Jedi glowing with praise, he loved them. Then he started watching YouTube videos, especially from those utter morons Red Letter Media and suddenly he did a complete 180 and now hates stuff he previously enjoyed, all because of the loudmouth internet narrative telling him how to think. When it comes to Star Wars, I try and live by the excellent Force Centre Podcast mantra 'Engage with the story presented, not the story you wanted or expected to see'. I found TROS convoluted and far too fast-paced, but it moved me and made me tear up on multiple occasions. Rey and Kylo's lightsaber transfer is in my top 5 coolest Star Wars moments ever. If you didn't like the film, fair enough, but you should try and not let it diminish all the stuff you do like.

Yeah, I appreciate the sentiment of where you're coming from. Don't get me wrong, I still love Star Wars and am surprised at how much I remember about the films having not seen them in a good while, it just sucks that the sequel trilogy ended up rushed out and being something to help solidify Iger's name in the Disney archives rather than being given the time I felt it deserved. It's tough because in a trilogy of trilogies where you need to create a finale that stands up to ROTJ, it's a near impossible task anyways, but I don't think they even came close. And yeah, there are definitely some great individual parts or sequences in the sequel trilogy. 

For me, I'm just glad I came to my own conclusions on The Rise of Skywalker myself. I was absolutely one of those fans in the trenches for the lead up to both TFA and TLJ, and while that was still the case with TROS to an extent with speculation and such, the lesson I learned from TLJ and the divide it brought in the fanbase is that I no longer have any real stake in how well movies end up being reviewed. I have my own opinions which I'll form over time and just respectfully share when talking with people like yourself, but at the end of the day, these are only movies, and I say that as a huge Star Wars fan.

I guess that's the part about the sequels that hurts the most for me, which I imagine was the case for fans of the original trilogy when the prequels rolled around: the films just lost that bit of lustre for me that there was before. But it is what it is, and like you quoted, we can only try to find joy in what's presented to us. 

I find it hard to imagine that I won't get back around to them before Kenobi comes out, though! 

10 hours ago, Ronnie said:

Star Wars Explained (another must watch bit of SW content) seemed to suggest the way things ended with Qi'ra in the recent comic series would make her showing up unlikely. I could be mis-remembering though, I've not read it. If ever a show would delve into Crimson Dawn though, this is it.

Yeah, SWE puts great stuff out! I've been watching him since before Celebration 2015, though, admittedly, not much in the last year or two. 

I guess they could also dive into Crimson Dawn in some way in Andor, albeit pre-Solo, which isn't what I want. We'll have to wait and see, but I think something of that scale - if not necessarily that character and group - would be more appropriate for BOBF's ending. 

Edited February 7, 2022 by Julius

[Ronnie]

52 minutes ago, Julius said:

I guess they could also dive into Crimson Dawn in some way in Andor, albeit pre-Solo, which isn't what I want.

Maybe I’m misunderstanding your point but Andor is post-Solo.

[Julius]

1 minute ago, Ronnie said:

Maybe I’m misunderstanding your point but Andor is post-Solo.

That's my bad, got them all mixed up in my head a bit there  that would work fine then, I guess we could see some Crimson Dawn crop up in Andor instead, though the little I've heard about them in the comics makes me want to know what, if anything, is going on with them in the current "present day" of the Disney+ shows in Mando and Book of Boba.

Guess we'll just have to wait and see! 

[FalcoLombardi]

I saw this posted on a different site a while ago. But do you all think this was meant to be Boba Fett as a background character in Solo?:

Spoiler

 

I know the helmet and armor is different, but it could've been pre-wearing-his-dead-dad's armor and pre-getting-a-new-Mandalorian-helmet.

 

 

Edited February 7, 2022 by FalcoLombardi
typo

[bob]

I think it's just a person in a helmet. Not every background character has to be a cameo, or a nod, or a reference. Sometimes they're just new characters, or extras.