General Switch Discussion

[Julius]

14 hours ago, Dcubed said:

You say that, but the hybrid form-factor isn't going to be much of a distinct USP over the next generation as the likes of Valve continue to encroach on their space with the Steam Deck...

For the casual audience who makes up the vast majority of people responsible for the Switch sailing by that 100 million sales mark and still going strong, the Steam Deck is a total non-factor. It is a niche even in the console space (as is pretty much every other, besides Nintendo's, currently); it is limited in supply; and has next to no marketing that the casual audience will have visibility of. 

Now, if we get reports of Steam upping their manufacturing numbers into the 10s of millions when the Steam Deck 2 gets announced, and throw a massive marketing budget behind it, with TV commercials, brand deals, celebrity sign-ons and such? I'll totally agree.

Until then, Nintendo don't have any reason to think about the Steam Deck. I agree with @Hero-of-Time in that the Portal isn't in this conversation (I know you didn't bring it up but that's one of the weirdest products that'll be a brick in a couple of years that I've seen since I got into games, more so than the Vita), and so the only real question, which I think you kind of touch in, is whether Xbox are thinking of doing something similar; I don't know if they will, but well, I think they certainly should be. Xbox adapting the OS approach of Steam and it's stored and making a dedicated handheld to house it which doesn't depend on streaming and can download games, basically their take on the Steam Deck, is a truly scary proposition when you throw some marketing behind it and couple it with Game Pass. 

But do Xbox even have the balls to do that? 

12 minutes ago, lostmario said:

Gamers have shown with their wallets that the hybrid console is what they want from Nintendo. Best of both worlds, portable and home console. It works, why reinvent the wheel just for sake of it.

If not the hybrid form-factor, then what? Nintendo won't go back to developing for two separate platforms now and I doubt Nintendo are worried about the portable PC space.

Absolutely agree. 

I'm all for new ideas and new control schemes, but doing it completely for the sake of it seems like a very bad idea, in that it opens them up to unnecessary risk factors like, well...no-one liking whatever they come up with? The Wii motion controls were completely played out by the second half of that console's life, even if it did open them up to a much wider and new gaming audience. 

15 minutes ago, lostmario said:

I'm not sure what gimmick they could add to the current switch model that would add to the gaming experience. What if their developers just want more powerful hardware to showcase their vision better without the hassle of adding unnecessary gimmicks to it.

I'm not sure either. There are things which sounds interesting conceptually (3D, foldable screens, etc.) which would be great differentiators – but I'm not convinced that they will improve the system in any meaningful way, from a consumer or developer perspective. 

The main risks I foresee with a Switch 2 being focused on being a more powerful Switch is that they end up bottling the messaging around it (which, well, they've been much better at this last gen with the Switch, and a simply "2" or "Super" added to the name seems more than sufficient; that initial reveal trailer for the Switch has to be one of the most clear and effective "here's our concept, come join us" videos in a long while) or that they simply don't make the hardware powerful enough to last the entire gen. If this gen is anything to go by, they don't really seem all that interested in mid-gen upgrades, so yeah, just make it beefy enough for developers and consumers alike to get a gen of play out of the thing. 

15 minutes ago, Hero-of-Time said:

Gotta imagine a 3D Mario and hopefully a new Mario Kart will be in that window.

Super Mario Odyssey DX and Mario Kart 8 Deluxest inbound 

[Hero-of-Time]

Details have surfaced of a cancelled DK game.

Man, what could have been if not for Activision's obession with turning all their studios into CoD/Destiny factories (completely forgot their connection with Destiny). I guess this is where all the rumours of a new 3D DK game came from a few years back.

Edited January 31 by Hero-of-Time

[Dcubed]

Damn shame that it didn’t pan out.  I guess Velan Studios (the staff from Vicarious Visions that splintered off after working on this cancelled DK game) was too small a team to be working on a game like this though, so I guess that’s how they got the Mario Kart Live gig following this then?

Hope that rumour about EPD Tokyo working on a 3D DK game turns out to be true… they’ve been radio silent since they released Mario Odyssey in 2017; and I can’t imagine that they’ve been working on nothing but 3D Mario for Switch 2 for the past 7 years…

[Sheikah]

History has already shown that Nintendo can't win a head-on battle against Sony.  They will always lose if attempting to compete on even footing in that red ocean, as 3rd parties will always politically favour Sony and they will never be able to outspend their competition.  Nintendo's own IP isn't strong enough to overcome the tide (especially now that Sony's own first party output is pretty comparable from a commercial standpoint).

Nintendo have to operate by offering something different.  It's the fundamental, core part of their DNA that has kept them going.  The gameplay evolution of their IPs also depends on them developing new hardware that allows for new types of gameplay mechanics to be made that couldn't be done before.  Gameplay stagnation will eventually kill them.

How would they be competing with Sony though. If they just released a more powerful Switch 2 they still wouldn't compete graphically with PS5 given it's a mobile form factor, so still wouldn't get the third party games. And it'd still be a hybrid machine, unlike the PS5.

 

No way they are ditching the Switch format for their successor. We have seen Nintendo not innovate too much between generations before like DS to 3DS (the main gimmick just being a fairly pointless 3D effect). So it's not like there isn't precedent for Nintendo playing it safe to say they won't do it.

 

I reckon Switch 2 will still get a smattering of third party ports and whatnot, and they'll still sell reasonably well owing to the huge install base they'll get.

[darksnowman]

18 hours ago, Sheikah said:

I reckon Switch 2 will still get a smattering of third party ports and whatnot, and they'll still sell reasonably well owing to the huge install base they'll get.

Third parties have it too good on Switch as it is. They rock in with lesser ports of their games from generations ago, mark up the price, and laugh all the way to the bank. Assuming the Switch successor is still behind the other two in terms of power, third parties will do the same all over again.

[Sheikah]

Third parties have it too good on Switch as it is. They rock in with lesser ports of their games from generations ago, mark up the price, and laugh all the way to the bank. Assuming the Switch successor is still behind the other two in terms of power, third parties will do the same all over again.

If it a hybrid it'll have to be less powerful, and I'm sure it still will be.

[Dcubed]

Looks like the February Direct is happening next week…

https://www.resetera.com/threads/universo-nintendo-new-nintendo-direct-next-week-between-february-12th-and-15th.813381/
 

… around the same time as when Xbox are announcing their exit from the console hardware business and their move to becoming a 3rd party publisher…

[darksnowman]

Coincidence is cancelled. Feb Directs are unheard of. These rumblings the Switch 2 is built of MS Surface tech about to be confirmed.

Edited February 6 by darksnowman

[Julius]

Nintendo's earnings report dropped this morning for Q3, covering the period of 1st October 2023 - 31st December 2023. 

 

The Big Takeaways

• The Nintendo Switch across its different SKUs sold 7.14 million units this past quarter, bringing sales for the FY up to 13.98 million units, meaning that the total lifetime sales of the Nintendo Switch now stands at 139.6 million units. Total software sales for the platform now stand at 1.2 billion units following software sales of 163.95 million units year-to-date. 
• The Switch is now the best-selling system ever in Japan; with 33.34 million units sold, it has surpassed both the DS (32.99M) and GB/GBC (32.47M). 
• Nintendo President Shuntaro Furukawa has again seemingly all but confirmed that news on the Switch's successor isn't far away; per Bloomberg, while the existing Nintendo Switch will be Nintendo's "main business" heading into 2024 (as should be expected if its successor launches in the latter part of the year), he shared that the company's plans for the next fiscal year will be shared at its next earnings briefing. I think that gives us a bit of a rough timeline for when to expect us news on the Switch's successor, with the financial year wrapping up on 31st March 2024 and the results to be shared soon after during the subsequent investor's meeting. 
• In terms of software sales figures to highlight, Mario Kart 8 Deluxe has now sold 60 million units sold (!!!) with a total of 60.58 million units; Pokémon Scarlet & Violet have sold 24.36 million units, making them the 3rd best-selling Pokémon games ahead of Gold & Silver (23.7M), and behind only Sword & Shield (26.17M) and Red, Green & Blue (31.38M); Pikmin 4 has reached 3.33 million units sold; Super Mario Bros. Wonder sold 11.96 million units between its launch on 20th October 2023 and the end of last year, and Super Mario RPG sold 3.14 million units between its launch on 17th November 2023 and the end of last year. There have been a total of 24 million-seller titles on the Switch year-to-date (17 of which are Nintendo titles, and 7 published by third parties). 

 

Top 10 Best-selling Switch titles

1. Mario Kart 8 Deluxe - 60.58M
2. Animal Crossing: New Horizons - 44.79M
3. Super Smash Bros. Ultimate - 33.67M
4. Breath of the Wild - 31.61M
5. Super Mario Odyssey - 27.65M
6. Pokemon Sword/Shield - 26.17M
7. Pokemon Scarlet/Violet - 24.36M
8. Super Mario Party - 20.34M
9. Tears of the Kingdom - 20.28M
10. New Super Mario Bros. U Deluxe - 17.20M

Edited February 6 by Julius

[Ashley]

Shouldn't we have a Pokémon direct later in the month too? The anniversary one is usually late February right?

[Glen-i]

10 minutes ago, Ashley said:

Shouldn't we have a Pokémon direct later in the month too? The anniversary one is usually late February right?

27th of February, yep. That's when Pokémon Day is, so expect something then.

Edited February 6 by Glen-i

[Julius]

4 minutes ago, Glen-i said:

27th of February, yep. That's when Pokémon Day is, so expect something then.

Glen, I'm lighting the beacons. It's time. 

(also FireRed and LeafGreen because it's the 20th anniversary please&ty no seriously it's fine to skip the GB/GBC games just hurry up and re-release the GBA ones already)

[Glen-i]

12 minutes ago, Julius said:

Glen, I'm lighting the beacons. It's time. 

Yeahhhhh, gonna have to snuff that beacon out. The Mystery Dungeon team have only just released the latest Shiren the Wanderer game in Japan.

I'd be surprised if they were working on two titles at the same time.

[Julius]

6 minutes ago, Glen-i said:

Yeahhhhh, gonna have to snuff that beacon out. The Mystery Dungeon team have only just released the latest Shiren the Wanderer game in Japan.

I'd be surprised if they were working on two titles at the same time.

 

Who am I kidding, you're probably right. Even if Shiren hadn't just released I genuinely think they wouldn't be doing Explorers next. 

Because the world sucks  

(let's pump all that energy into GBA Pokémon re-releases instead, then )

[Glen-i]

6 hours ago, Julius said:

(let's pump all that energy into GBA Pokémon re-releases instead, then )

For once, I want TPC to go the route that costs people more. FR/LG are the still the best Gen 1 experience, so if they can't, or won't, have Transfer Pak support, then I'd rather just play the remakes.

And seeing as the Golden Sun update adds the ability to have people link two different games together (Booting up The Lost Age while with a second player asks if you want Player 2 to use the first Golden Sun), it's now perfectly possible to trade in between versions. No excuses now.

[Hero-of-Time]

On 06/02/2024 at 8:28 AM, Dcubed said:

Looks like the February Direct is happening next week…

https://www.resetera.com/threads/universo-nintendo-new-nintendo-direct-next-week-between-february-12th-and-15th.813381/
 

Rumours are that it's going to be a partner Direct. Disappointing, if true. Although it does give weight to your Microsoft theory. 

[Dcubed]

Just now, Hero-of-Time said:

Rumours are that it's going to be a partner Direct. Disappointing, if true. Although it does give weight to your Microsoft theory. 

... was thinking exactly the same thing.  In which case, a Partner Direct would actually be more exciting than a standard February Direct in this one exceptional case

[Julius]

3 minutes ago, Hero-of-Time said:

Rumours are that it's going to be a partner Direct. Disappointing, if true. Although it does give weight to your Microsoft theory. 

I do agree it would be disappointing, but it also suggests to me that the Switch 2 announcement might come before the next Direct proper?

There are still absolutely games for them to put windows and dates to releasing this year on the Switch, but with their financial year end just seven weeks away at the end of March and their fiscal report typically dropping at the end of April/start of May, I think you could bundle a lot of those announcements into a Switch 2 event eventually, assuming that there's some backwards compatibility going on ("and here are the games coming to both Switch and Switch 2"). 

Wouldn't be the first time someone's announced a new system only to double back in a following event to their current one. Remember that PS4-only State of Play towards the end of the summer in 2020? Not saying it's a good idea and that Nintendo is going to be that silly with it, mind you 

10 minutes ago, Dcubed said:

... was thinking exactly the same thing.  In which case, a Partner Direct would actually be more exciting than a standard February Direct in this one exceptional case

I'm imagining a scenario with Banjo popping up to confirm a Nuts & Bolts port and that being it from Xbox, would love to see the fallout from that  

But yeah, I'll be shocked now if they don't turn up in a Direct (mini?): Partner Showcase, that was a good shout @Dcubed! Man, it's hard to imagine what that could look like. 

Over/under 70% on the odds of a Phil Spencer cameo in the Direct if Xbox do turn up? 

[Glen-i]

27 minutes ago, Julius said:

I'm imagining a scenario with Banjo popping up to confirm a Nuts & Bolts port and that being it from Xbox, would love to see the fallout from that  

Found the other guy who wants the Banjo franchise to die again!

[lostmario]

4 hours ago, Julius said:

I'm imagining a scenario with Banjo popping up to confirm a Nuts & Bolts port and that being it from Xbox, would love to see the fallout from that  

But yeah, I'll be shocked now if they don't turn up in a Direct (mini?): Partner Showcase, that was a good shout @Dcubed! Man, it's hard to imagine what that could look like. 

Over/under 70% on the odds of a Phil Spencer cameo in the Direct if Xbox do turn up? 

Screw Banjo.

If xbox show up at the direct, give me these. Just hearing those iconic themes on a Nintendo Direct would be huge.

and this.

It's about time they came home.

[darksnowman]

9 hours ago, lostmario said:

Screw Banjo.

Agreed. If they hurry up and throw the remaining trio on NSO hopefully we can draw a line under it for good and the countdown for It's Mr. Pants can begin in earnest.

I'd jump at the chance to play the latest Killer Instinct and I wouldn't say no to a go on that new Battletoads either. Imho, it'd be incredible if Rare were to pick up where they left off with Kameo, Perfect Dark Zero and everything else. Uncle Tusk columns on the Switch news page. I may shed a tear to witness the course being corrected after 20 years. Rare was a massive loss. It's nice to dream.

[lostmario]

14 hours ago, darksnowman said:

 Rare was a massive loss.

Indeed, I'm currently playing through DKC 2 for the first time and still find it crazy that Nintendo let them go.

Had an idea for a thread on the topic but I keep putting off doing it.

[Glen-i]

6 minutes ago, lostmario said:

Indeed, I'm currently playing through DKC 2 for the first time and still find it crazy that Nintendo let them go.

Had an idea for a thread on the topic but I keep putting off doing it.

The thing is, that Rare's output had declined a lot since Donkey Kong 64. A lot of the people who made those games happen had left and moved on to other ventures at that point. Rare didn't really resemble themselves in the past.

I'd argue that Nintendo made the right call in the end. It sucks, but that's what it is.

[lostmario]

3 minutes ago, Glen-i said:

The thing is, that Rare's output had declined a lot since Donkey Kong 64. A lot of the people who made those games happen had left and moved on to other ventures at that point. Rare didn't really resemble themselves in the past.

I'd argue that Nintendo made the right call in the end. It sucks, but that's what it is.

I disagree, I don't see DK64 as the drop off in quality.  Perfect Dark, Banjo-Tooie and Conkers BFD all came after and were still peak Rare. Dinosaur Planet if Nintendo had not forced Starfox on them would have been a perfect swansong for the N64 as they would have kept to their original vision for the game. I've played the leaked rom and it just feels different to Star Fox Adventures.

I enjoyed Star Fox Adventures by the way.

It wasn't just Rare, their most important first party developer that they lost, it's all the valuable IPs that would have been useful during the gamecube years.

 

 

[Glen-i]

4 minutes ago, lostmario said:

I disagree, I don't see DK64 as the drop off in quality.  Perfect Dark, Banjo-Tooie and Conkers BFD all came after and were still peak Rare. Dinosaur Planet if Nintendo had not forced Starfox on them would have been a perfect swansong for the N64 as they would have kept to their original vision for the game. I've played the leaked rom and it just feels different to Star Fox Adventures.

I enjoyed Star Fox Adventures by the way.

It wasn't just Rare, their most important first party developer that they lost, it's all the valuable IPs that would have been useful during the gamecube years.

DK 64 was the start of the old Rare staff leaving. Not the actual quality of games. That's what I meant.

We know very little of the development of Dinosaur Planet, so we'll never quite know what kind of possible development hell the project was going under for Nintendo to make the decision to move it to Gamecube and make it a Star Fox title.

But clearly, Ninty decided that investing in Rare wasn't worth it anymore.
I look at Rare's output since, and a part of me, kind of agrees. I don't think they would've kept that quality up.

And I don't believe for one second that Rare would've helped the Gamecube much. The PS2 was too much of a juggernaut.