Ashley Posted March 14, 2010 Posted March 14, 2010 (edited) You just have to accept that she makes quite bad/mediocre music (/Telephone is the second/third best on the album). I personally like the whole deviancy from the done pop thing. Why should a music video only be 4 minutes long? If it's worth watching, I'd prefer stuff was added to make it more worthwhile. She's twisting tradition for her own lovely ways. One of the reason she stuns is because she has the audacity of huge to have a 10 minute video; she could have just released a generic "I'm in a club dancing looking sexy" video - and we'd all have made no comment and left not nonplussed - but she isn't that shit. I think this is the problem. She's billed as a musician and she's bad at being a musician. Performance Artist? Perhaps more apt, but I understand there's not really a (mainstream) market for that. Its the same problem I have with Glee really, everyone acting as if its the pinnacle of its game just means greater stuff gets sidelined. And the other thing (and I'm not saying you are saying this) is the blinded notion that she's changing everything, that everything she has done is new and a paradigm shift. Which is just bullshit. Narrative videos have been around for a long time. Its perhaps not the best example but springs to mind. All of this has happened before, and all of this will happen again. Yeah, that song was pretty terrible. And Lady Gaga's face is beginning to annoy me. I guess its some Pavlovian thing where I see it and am immediately accosted by memories of flamboyantly homosexual men, and ditsy bints hailing her "music" as the greatest thing ever, repeatedly. Boring after a listen or two. Predictable. Can we move on, plz? And this. Just whenever I see/hear Gaga I picture all the squeeling fans I know and it just irritates. Its how I imagine asbestos would feel. So yeah. Gaga = Glee. Its fine, I understand why you (collective) like it but please can you take some fucking Prozac? I think I just needed to rant ^_^ Preferably at some people who will listen. I know you (individual) know and listen to better music and are aware where Gaga fits into that and have more realistic interpretations of her as a musician than some people I know who wouldn't listen and just flail. Back to Plastic Beach... Edited March 14, 2010 by Ashley
Ramar Posted March 14, 2010 Posted March 14, 2010 Ended up purchasing an import version of Saliva's Cinco Diablo yesterday, cost me £17, which I think is going to be a waste. The album sounds poor effort on first listen. Any way, because of that I'm posting this video, I actually bummed this song for most of my high school years. Having just re-watched that, the video is terribad but I still love the song.
ipaul Posted March 14, 2010 Posted March 14, 2010 That Lady Gaga video sort of annoys me, not sure why. The song is pretty bad though, she is so inconsistent with her music I swear =P There's what I think is a much more interesting video. Arbitrary comparison but what you gonna do?
chairdriver Posted March 14, 2010 Posted March 14, 2010 (edited) Performance Artist? Perhaps more apt, but I understand there's not really a (mainstream) market for that. There really is though. The fact she does joke/stunning things (that make you go "oooh") onstage / in videos adds so much, and makes me want to buy her stuff. If she just stood on stage with a microphone and sang, I wouldn't think about buying it. The reason she's had 6 US number 1s in a row is because she's been the "first" to exploit the open "performance artist" slot. Lady G is very much ahead of the game - she's realised pop music isn't about the music, it's about how you do the music. You can write the most banal, generic major key jingle, but as long as you have some sort of gimmick to keep people interested, it will do well. For example, Marina & The Diamonds has essentially sold "Hollywood" (probably the worst song on the album) off the back of the line "Oh my god, you look just like Shakira. No no, you’re Catherine Zeta. Actually, my name’s Marina". It's the only line anyone ever quotes. (Quite a shite irrelevant example, but hopefully you get what I mean.) Its the same problem I have with Glee really, everyone acting as if its the pinnacle of its game just means greater stuff gets sidelined. Glee is shite though in comparison. And the other thing (and I'm not saying you are saying this) is the blinded notion that she's changing everything, that everything she has done is new and a paradigm shift. Which is just bullshit. Yeah, it all comes back to Kate Bush, who first did the "Weird woman on stage" thing. Roisin Murphy, Gwen Stefani, Bjork etc etc have all done it too, but it feels they did it with compromise. Where Lady Gaga makes no compromise - "Oh course I'll wear sunglasses made from burning cigarettes.", "Oh course I'll hang myself on stage, whilst bleeding from my eyeballs." Its perhaps not the best example but springs to mind. Yes. All of this has happened before, and all of this will happen again. Well the same can be said of anything. *shrugs shoulders* ----- It's for the same reason I love Madonna; she does stunning things. Edited March 14, 2010 by chairdriver
Ramar Posted March 14, 2010 Posted March 14, 2010 Glee is shite. Fixed for accuracy. I've seen them ruin Journey and Queen, I can't bare to imagine what they'll tarnish next.
Daft Posted March 14, 2010 Posted March 14, 2010 (edited) The Bitter Earth/On The Nature of Daylight - Dinah Washington/Max Richter Fucking lovely. Fixed for accuracy. I've seen them ruin Journey and Queen, I can't bare to imagine what they'll tarnish next. That Journey cover is ace. As much as I love them, you can't honestly take Journey seriously. The Glee 'Halo/Walking on Sunshine' mash-up is excellent. Also their cover of 'Hate On Me'. There really are some excellent covers/mash-ups when the members who can actually sing do sing. Amber Riley is fantastic along with Kevin McHale and a few others. Edited March 14, 2010 by Daft
Paj! Posted March 14, 2010 Posted March 14, 2010 I don't think any of the music in Glee is particularly good. The Halo mash-up is alright. I wish they wouldn't let the crap ones sing. Like Quinn.
Jon Posted March 14, 2010 Posted March 14, 2010 The harmony at the start of Don't Stop Believin is techinally very good singing and many of the actors on the show are excellent singers. It's funny they're slated for doing a cover version of a great song, yet Teagan and Sara can do a cover of dancing in the dark and it's considered awesome because it's Teagan and Sara. Speaking of Bruce Springsteen, had Secret Garden in my head all day. What an epically inspiring song.
Daft Posted March 14, 2010 Posted March 14, 2010 I don't think any of the music in Glee is particularly good. The Halo mash-up is alright. I wish they wouldn't let the crap ones sing. Like Quinn. But Quinn is hot. ...I agree they shouldn't let the other crap ones sing though.
Ashley Posted March 14, 2010 Posted March 14, 2010 There really is though. The fact she does joke/stunning things (that make you go "oooh") onstage / in videos adds so much, and makes me want to buy her stuff. If she just stood on stage with a microphone and sang, I wouldn't think about buying it. The reason she's had 6 US number 1s in a row is because she's been the "first" to exploit the open "performance artist" slot. Lady G is very much ahead of the game - she's realised pop music isn't about the music, it's about how you do the music. You can write the most banal, generic major key jingle, but as long as you have some sort of gimmick to keep people interested, it will do well. For example, Marina & The Diamonds has essentially sold "Hollywood" (probably the worst song on the album) off the back of the line "Oh my god, you look just like Shakira. No no, you’re Catherine Zeta. Actually, my name’s Marina". It's the only line anyone ever quotes. (Quite a shite irrelevant example, but hopefully you get what I mean.) Glee is shite though in comparison. Roisin Murphy, Gwen Stefani, Bjork etc etc have all done it too, but it feels they did it with compromise. Where Lady Gaga makes no compromise - "Oh course I'll wear sunglasses made from burning cigarettes.", "Oh course I'll hang myself on stage, whilst bleeding from my eyeballs." Well the same can be said of anything. *shrugs shoulders* Surely though making pop music about the performance would just degenerate the pop music genre (even further)? I suppose the long term effects remain to be seen. But its not like she's alone, I think she's just gained a certain niche. I mean even have pretty fantastical shows (but obviously more U-rated) (and that thing at the 2:30 mark is creepy as fuck). It could be argued to be an inevitable progression of the genre and she's in the right place at the right time. I don't get where the hell the Marina quote has come from (or, should I say, I don't get its purpose in this discussion). I wasn't trying to compare Glee to Gaga, I was trying to say that my response to both is comparable. It begins to creep its way from boredom towards apathy. See I'm not so sure she's not making compromises. She seems to be trying to say "let's see how much weird shit I can do." I'm sure it has meaning to her, but it comes across as banal bricolage to me personally. Perhaps its unfair to judge someone from my own interpretation of their works...but its all we can do really. And the BSG line was thrown in because it was used on Caprica which I watched just before posting. Oh and in regards to Glee's covers, I think some of the arguments against them have been that it feels so empty. Particularly as its then whored the fuck out. Seems like an easy cash cow. And Pete Yorn's cover of DITD is better than T&S
Ramar Posted March 14, 2010 Posted March 14, 2010 Oh and in regards to Glee's covers, I think some of the arguments against them have been that it feels so empty. Particularly as its then whored the fuck out. Seems like an easy cash cow. Thats my main gripe especially with the Don't Stop Believin' cover, they just don't mean what they are saying. It's all big wide mouth smiley singing, which isn't out of tune or what ever just a bit soulless and over the top.
The Bard Posted March 14, 2010 Posted March 14, 2010 I'm gonna be puritanical here, and say that this is the music thread, bitches. I don't wanna hear no shit bout visual performance. Aight? We're concentrating on what can solely be communicated on an auditory level through melody, rhythm, texture of any combination of the aforementioned. Video = do not want. Well not really, but justifying an artist by virtue of their music video's is fairly pathetic, especially if you don't even like the video for itself or the effect it produces, but just seem to vaguely agree with its socio-political standpoints about sexual egalitarianism. Or whatever. No! Music is abstract. It does not need ideas. Music hooks straight to the emotional centres of your brain, and like a good drug detaches you from any superfluous bullshit. It is your analgesic, geodesic dome of self contained perfection. I get carried away... I mean no offence.
ipaul Posted March 14, 2010 Posted March 14, 2010 It's for the same reason I love Madonna; she does things. That's better But back onto music! Currently giving Geogaddi by Boards Of Canada a listen. The whole record is so wonderfully infected by a sense of paranoia. It's only different in a very subtle way technically to Music Has The Right To Children, the same toolkit has been used to create both, but the contrast between the responses the two provoke is remarkable. There's a fine line between childhood nostalgia and memories with paranoia attached to them, apparently
Jon Posted March 14, 2010 Posted March 14, 2010 Thats my main gripe especially with the Don't Stop Believin' cover, they just don't mean what they are saying. It's all big wide mouth smiley singing, which isn't out of tune or what ever just a bit soulless and over the top. How exactly can you tell they don't mean it? From the many times I've watched the video, the only thing I can interpret from their body languages is enjoyment. It's certainly anything but soulless.
Jon Posted March 14, 2010 Posted March 14, 2010 You're aware they are actors yes? The harmony at the start of Don't Stop Believin is techinally very good singing and many of the actors on the show are excellent singers. ................
Ashley Posted March 15, 2010 Posted March 15, 2010 You (Jon) suggested "their body language seems to suggest they are enjoying it". If they were unable to feign enjoyment they shouldn't be in the acting profession is what I was getting at
Jon Posted March 15, 2010 Posted March 15, 2010 You (Jon) suggested "their body language seems to suggest they are enjoying it". If they were unable to feign enjoyment they shouldn't be in the acting profession is what I was getting at I don't know, Have of the so called stars in Hollywood seem unable to do it.
chairdriver Posted March 15, 2010 Posted March 15, 2010 The harmony at the start of Don't Stop Believin is techinally very good singing and many of the actors on the show are excellent singers. It's funny they're slated for doing a cover version of a great song, yet Teagan and Sara can do a cover of dancing in the dark and it's considered awesome because it's Teagan and Sara. This post just shows we are standing at totally different viewpoints. It just feels like it's pointless trying to persuade you otherwise/make you see light. (/not you in particular, you plural) Considering Tegan and Sara are one of the most listenable/good bands I rave about, I'm terrified but I'm not leaving.
Jon Posted March 15, 2010 Posted March 15, 2010 This post just shows we are standing at totally different viewpoints. It just feels like it's pointless trying to persuade you otherwise/make you see light. Considering Tegan and Sara are one of the most listenable/good bands I rave about, I'm terrified but I'm not leaving. What light? That would be your opinion, not any light. Half the time you seem to indicate that someone is awesome just because they apparently are, with nothing to back up. We obviously don't like the same sort of music, which is fair enough but I fail to see why you label people that you listen to as the de facto in music. when their quite obviously not.
chairdriver Posted March 15, 2010 Posted March 15, 2010 What light? That would be your opinion, not any light. Half the time you seem to indicate that someone is awesome just because they apparently are, with nothing to back up. We obviously don't like the same sort of music, which is fair enough but I fail to see why you label people that you listen to as the de facto in music. when their quite obviously not. Your sex was whack. ---- Talking of Teegz and Sare, I'm not sure if this was actually posted or not (I remember talking about it): The video adds, because I love choreographed sequences, and there's general lulz to be had. I'm kinda a bit "..." about the choice of Alligator as a single. In some respects I love, because it feels like it was selected at random, since there's way more obvious ones (Don't Rush, Arrow, On Directing, Paperback Head etc etc).
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