AeroScap Posted May 5, 2007 Posted May 5, 2007 One thing, If syler didnt die from hiro and just regenned and went on to become peter's brother. Where did he get the power to regen from? If in the latest episode he just managed to get to claire caus parkman caught her?!
Shorty Posted May 5, 2007 Posted May 5, 2007 One thing, If syler didnt die from hiro and just regenned and went on to become peter's brother. Where did he get the power to regen from? If in the latest episode he just managed to get to claire caus parkman caught her?! Wait a second... you're right o_O that doesn't make any sense at all. In fact... if future sylar was only alive because he survived Hiro's blow by regenerating, then why was future Claire even alive? Even Claire shouldn't be able to recover from that. And if she did recover, why did he have to take her ability again? I thought I totally understood the last episode, but now I'm completely confused. Or did they screw up? Edit: I guess it's possible that the Heroes team aren't working on a "Back to the Future"-esque alternate universe style time-travel. Maybe when Hiro changed the past by getting on the train, it shifted everything so Claire was alive. This doesn't explain how Sylar survives Hiro's attack - but maybe he will simply fail to kill Sylar by some means. Or maybe he will realise Peter is the cause of the explosion and attack him instead.
Retro_Link Posted May 5, 2007 Posted May 5, 2007 Yeah I thought I understood it all as well! Hmmm.... this may take some thinking! Something I also don't get about Sylar is that in Episode 3 (I think) he got shot loads by Parkman, yet he got up unhurt and got away, how did he survive the bullets if he couldn't regenerate? It didn't look like he stopped the bullets in mid-air or anything and he collapsed! Also, in Episode 20 he could walk through walls which is D.L.'s power, yet Peter said he killed D.L. in the explosion! So how did Sylar get this power, just go and find D.L. after the explosion?
Eddage Posted May 5, 2007 Posted May 5, 2007 Yeah I thought I understood it all as well! Hmmm.... this may take some thinking! Something I also don't get about Sylar is that in Episode 3 (I think) he got shot loads by Parkman, yet he got up unhurt and got away, how did he survive the bullets if he couldn't regenerate? It didn't look like he stopped the bullets in mid-air or anything and he collapsed! Also, in Episode 20 he could walk through walls which is D.L.'s power, yet Peter said he killed D.L. in the explosion! So how did Sylar get this power, just go and find D.L. after the explosion? D.L. wasn't killed in the explosion, only Micah. Future Hiro mentions that he gave D.L. and Candice (shape shifter) to Bennet so he could hide them but needed them to help get into Homeland Security (he mentions he only wants the people he gave to Bennet). Sylar must have got to them at some point and taken their powers. Also when they're in the future it's the time line where Hiro didn't stab Sylar, which is why him and Claire were both a live in the future - Sylar didn't need her regen power, although the thing about Parkman shooting him is indeed a bit strange!
Dante Posted May 5, 2007 Posted May 5, 2007 One thing, If syler didnt die from hiro and just regenned and went on to become peter's brother. Where did he get the power to regen from? If in the latest episode he just managed to get to claire caus parkman caught her?! Timeline One: Sylar kills Clare and takes her power, Hiro tries to kill Sylar, but he regenerates and explodes. Timeline Two: Peter saves Clare, Peter becomes the bomb, Hiro goes to forward five years and missed the chance to kill Sylar back in the present, future hiro joins this timeline from timeline one as he become back from the past. Timeline Three: New Future? Something I also don't get about Sylar is that in Episode 3 (I think) he got shot loads by Parkman, yet he got up unhurt and got away, how did he survive the bullets if he couldn't regenerate? It didn't look like he stopped the bullets in mid-air or anything and he collapsed! Sylar slows down the bullets and moves from the bullets path.
Shorty Posted May 5, 2007 Posted May 5, 2007 Candice (shape shifter) I'm pretty sure Candice creates illusions - as seen in her coverup of Simone's death.
Dan_Dare Posted May 5, 2007 Author Posted May 5, 2007 Wait a second... you're right o_O that doesn't make any sense at all. In fact... if future sylar was only alive because he survived Hiro's blow by regenerating, then why was future Claire even alive? Even Claire shouldn't be able to recover from that. And if she did recover, why did he have to take her ability again? I thought I totally understood the last episode, but now I'm completely confused. Or did they screw up? Edit: I guess it's possible that the Heroes team aren't working on a "Back to the Future"-esque alternate universe style time-travel. Maybe when Hiro changed the past by getting on the train, it shifted everything so Claire was alive. This doesn't explain how Sylar survives Hiro's attack - but maybe he will simply fail to kill Sylar by some means. Or maybe he will realise Peter is the cause of the explosion and attack him instead. Ok I think I know how it goes: Because young Hiro jumps five years, he misses the bomb day and never attacks Sylar. Now he's gone back knowing what to do, he will, and create a new timeline. urgh. it's a bit of a headfuck. I'm not sure how it works exactly.
AeroScap Posted May 5, 2007 Posted May 5, 2007 Timeline Two: Peter saves Clare, Peter becomes the bomb, Hiro goes to forward five years and missed the chance to kill Sylar back in the present, future hiro joins this timeline from timeline one as he become back from the past. Ahh not really. If you watch the very beginning of the latest episode, you'd realised that the "5 years ahead timeline" is the "future hiro's" timeline. He belonged their. In the issacc's room, future hiro was shocked to hear that that cheerleader was actually saved. Which means in his timeline Sylar already got to her. Thusly explainly why stabbing future hiro's attempt at stabbing him didnt work. Which is confirmed by that comic book (we can accept the comic in series has been correct right). Well the origin of the comic was in future hiro's timeline thusly confirming that, this event was meant to happen their. --------- Summary Sylar slices brain. Those that have their brain sliced as shown die. Sylar obtains new power. Latest episode reveals future hiro's attempt to kill Sylar failed. This was because he regenned. Regen = Claire Sylar takes powers = claire dead (or stopped regenning which has happened) Claire is shown alive and well and still on the run in the same timeline sylar was stabbed and regenned. Most interesting Because young Hiro jumps five years, he misses the bomb day and never attacks Sylar It was future hiro which attacks future sylar
Retro_Link Posted May 5, 2007 Posted May 5, 2007 D.L. wasn't killed in the explosion, only Micah. Future Hiro mentions that he gave D.L. and Candice (shape shifter) to Bennet so he could hide them but needed them to help get into Homeland Security (he mentions he only wants the people he gave to Bennet). Sylar must have got to them at some point and taken their powers. Also when they're in the future it's the time line where Hiro didn't stab Sylar, which is why him and Claire were both a live in the future - Sylar didn't need her regen power, although the thing about Parkman shooting him is indeed a bit strange! Ah right! I thought both Micah and D.L. died; I heard the thing sbout Candice, but didn't hear them mention D.L. Yeah thinking about it I new that timeline stuff, the thread must be confusing me!
AeroScap Posted May 5, 2007 Posted May 5, 2007 Ah right! I thought both Micah and D.L. died; I heard the thing sbout Candice, but didn't hear them mention D.L. Yeah thinking about it I new that timeline stuff, the thread must be confusing me! Wasnt peter having a heated arguement about the explosion killing both D.L and micah and how it rested on his shoulders. Responsibility and all that.
Eddage Posted May 5, 2007 Posted May 5, 2007 Wasnt peter having a heated arguement about the explosion killing both D.L and micah and how it rested on his shoulders. Responsibility and all that. He doesn't actually mention D.L. in person during that argument, like he does Micah though. He does say "I killed them" but then "them" could be Micah and everyone else who died in the explosion, e.g. Ando! Future Hiro definitely mentions D.L., he says that "Candice can distract them with her illusions and D.L. can phase in and out of buildings" or something similar.
BGS Posted May 5, 2007 Posted May 5, 2007 I think there was definitely talk of DL being dead but not that he was killed by the explosion. One theory I have is that Sylar didn't actually re-gen but that he had already killed DL and used that power to make Hiro's sword pass straight through him, faking his own death.
Dan_Dare Posted May 5, 2007 Author Posted May 5, 2007 It was future hiro which attacks future sylar Nah it was future Hiro when he was present Hiro stabbing present Sylar. So present Hiro jumped out of the correct timeline and in to a timeline in which future hiro never warns Peter.
Shorty Posted May 5, 2007 Posted May 5, 2007 Claire is shown alive and well and still on the run in the same timeline sylar was stabbed and regenned. Only thing I can guess is that Claire was saved by future Hiro going back on to the train to change things. His memories of the future weren't changed because he jumps about so much, so he didn't know that he had succeeded in changing the future until early Hiro told him that Peter saved Claire. Now: the reason Sylar continues to live - I'm guessing Hiro fails to kill him, or can't do it. Or maybe he survives without regenerative ability, or here's a possibility, maybe he has Linderman's power by then (unlikely but hey) and was able to heal himself with that, and future Hiro assumed it was Claire's power. Maybe Hiro realises that killing Sylar isn't the solution to saving New York, because it's Peter that goes boom. Either way we'll find out in a few episodes, unless there's plot holes. *hissss* plot holes, the devil, etc.
Guest Stefkov Posted May 5, 2007 Posted May 5, 2007 Future Hiro went back to tell Peter to save Claire. THe future Hiro was on the time line where Claire was killed. Claire was living in wherever she was so Future Hiro has no idea about her. Normal Hiro goes into the future and tells Future Hiro that Claire was saved. He was surprised meaning he didnt know she was saved. Which makes sense because he doesn't know where she is/where she would have been or whatever. I sounded better in my head. I was just thinking, Nikki/Jessica (I forget which isnt the psycho one) is going out with Peter, so DL is gone. When Nathan/Sylar gets the call from Parkman at the last bit of the episode he reaches through the door and pulls Peter out. So Sylar killed DL. Probably just stating the obvious. (plus I may have just said what someone else said, if so my bad)
McPhee Posted May 5, 2007 Posted May 5, 2007 I think there was definitely talk of DL being dead but not that he was killed by the explosion. One theory I have is that Sylar didn't actually re-gen but that he had already killed DL and used that power to make Hiro's sword pass straight through him, faking his own death. I think you've got it right there! There is only 1 timeline, Sylar survives by stealing DL's power and Peter explodes. Nathan blames Sylar to save his brother, Peter falls out with him over it and leaves. Hiro then has a lot to do, he realizes that he has to travel forwards and backwards in time manipulating things to make sure Peter is strong enough to defeat Sylar at the end of the last episode (just after he dies). He tells Peter to save the cheerleader and is in the background all the time tweaking things to make sure that the correct path is followed and Sylar is defeated. TBH thats just the storyline i'd like to see. It would fit and we could see Hiro popping up at random moments in other series'! Would be great, for example, to see him stop Peter and Nathan's dad from getting hit by a bus
Retro_Link Posted May 5, 2007 Posted May 5, 2007 I think you've got it right there! There is only 1 timeline, Sylar survives by stealing DL's power and Peter explodes. Nathan blames Sylar to save his brother, Peter falls out with him over it and leaves.I agree that there's only 1 timeline, just shown in the future or the present. I don't think people should refer to it as timeline 1 and 2, just as the future or the present. That is a way Sylar could have survived but I don't think it's what happened. That's why Hiro went back in time to help save Claire, he knew/saw that Sylar regerated after he stabbed him. If it was because of D.L. then Hiro would have gone back in time and made sure D.L. was kept hidden, or was not in the place he was when Sylar killed him.
BGS Posted May 5, 2007 Posted May 5, 2007 I agree that there's only 1 timeline, just shown in the future or the present. I don't think people should refer to it as timeline 1 and 2, just as the future or the present. That is a way Sylar could have survived but I don't think it's what happened. That's why Hiro went back in time to help save Claire, he knew/saw that Sylar regerated after he stabbed him. If it was because of D.L. then Hiro would have gone back in time and made sure D.L. was kept hidden, or was not in the place he was when Sylar killed him. But the point is, Hiro mightn't have known that Sylar used D.L's power. Future Hiro didn't know that Claire was even alive until Past Hiro confirmed that Peter saved her. In the 1 time line theory, claire might always have been alive but only because FHiro -thought- that she was dead (because of her going undercover to escape linderman and her dad's lot) so he went back in time to tell Peter to save her. Fact is, she was ALWAYS alive. Say sylar played along when Hiro stabs him and pretends to die (hell in the painting he did after he killed Isaac, it suggested that he was to pose as nathan so what a great opportunity it would be to fake your own death so everyone stops trying to hunt you down) Hiro wanders off after 'killing' him and Sylar makes his escape. Hiro comes back to find Sylar gone. Much later future hiro looks back through the news clippings and finds out Sylar went to kill a cheerleader (and successfully killed a 'cheerleader' remember) and assumed Sylar killed claire, as Claire is now undercover unknown to hiro and assumes that that's how Sylar survived Hiro killing him) The bomb goes off (peter) and nathan announces to the world that it was Sylar that exploded to protect Peter. Sylar now kills nathan at some point and poses as him. FHiro hears Nathan tell the world that it was Sylar that exploded and assumes that Sylar is now dead but came back after he (Hiro) killed him because he had claires re-gen power. This now sets off FHiro's actions and explains a lot within a single timeline (eg. the time travel bits in harry potter prisoner of azkaban) The only thing it doesn't explain is regarding the fact PHiro knows that Peter saved Claire whereas FHiro doesn't. FHiro should surely remember this. Could be easily explained though by some kind of memory loss brought on by the explosion or a memory extracted from him by The Haitian. This also means that the future really can't be changed (because the future is always there and changes made to the past have already had effect in the present) and that Peter will still explode. Maybe this is why the next series is rumoured to be dealing more with the parents of the heroes (I sense a sort of prequel coming especially as I read mohindar's dead sister will feature) instead of advancing the story forwards. I'll try and draw a time map similar to the one above if anyone fancies it? I still love a single timeline, paradox-free explanation to all this rather then a multiple timeline/realities one.
Shorty Posted May 5, 2007 Posted May 5, 2007 All these complicated ideas, I think my simple explanation in post #314 makes the most sense
Dante Posted May 5, 2007 Posted May 5, 2007 1. Sylar kills Claire 2. Sylar gets stabbed before going nuclear, but regenerates because of Claire's power. 3. Hiro realizes this and goes back in time to make sure Claire doesn't get killed by Sylar. 4. Claire is saved. 5. Sylar is no longer the bomb. It's Peter. 6. Nathan tells everyone it was Sylar to keep Peter safe. 7. P Hiro dont kill Sylar because he jumps five years later. 8. P Hiro goes back to get Sylar. 9. New timeline has been made.
BGS Posted May 5, 2007 Posted May 5, 2007 Remember though, that all this is still from the perspective of Future Hiro. It's all his opinion, doesn't make it fact. Also remember the whole point of that episode when he meets the waitress. The message there was you can't change the future (hinting to a single timeline story) The only anomaly with that story is that she doesn't remember hiro but she does look at him weirdly as if she remembers something and she does still have the japanese phrasebook that he gave her. She could have easily been bagged and tagged (and had her short term memory wiped) between meeting hiro in her past and meeting him at the moment you first see in the cafeteria.
Shorty Posted May 5, 2007 Posted May 5, 2007 Well... if originally Sylar was definitely the bomb, I guess it makes sense in that way. Kinda stupid though that if Sylar is prevented from being the bomb, Peter ends up being the bomb instead. Suggests some kind of outside influence making sure it happened....
AeroScap Posted May 5, 2007 Posted May 5, 2007 still the issue of when did sylar get the bomb powers... oooo spoookky
KingJoe Posted May 6, 2007 Posted May 6, 2007 It's all about Molly Walker now. * why isn't the Haitian in New York stopping the exploding man? * why hasn't Johnny Haitian stopped the President's powers from working? * is there only one timeline? is it impossible to change the past? arghhhhhhhhh... Tuesday...
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