motion Posted January 13, 2007 Share Posted January 13, 2007 Have you actually played anything past Arbiter's Grounds The ganondorf? If not, that statement about how the game gets so much better doesn't make sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fierce_LiNk Posted January 13, 2007 Share Posted January 13, 2007 If I'm honest, I think the game does get better in the second half. The dungeon designs and locations in the second half is much, much better than the first few, imo. I thought the sky temple was pretty damn hard, and I think the temples/dungeons in general got harder as you progressed. Storywise, I think it was better in the second half, too: Ilia losing her memory and then regaining it, the cutscenes for that were amazing. I think there were so many amazing moments in both halves of this game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShadowV7 Posted January 13, 2007 Share Posted January 13, 2007 Have you actually played anything past Arbiter's Grounds The ganondorf? If not, that statement about how the game gets so much better doesn't make sense. It's his own opinion,doesn't need to be the same as yours. I didn't think it got worse past Arbiters Grounds.I thought it was more memoriable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motion Posted January 13, 2007 Share Posted January 13, 2007 Who said it does have to be the same as mine? I was only asking a question. The fact that most people on this thread agree that the second half isn't as good surely means something though. The story loses complete focus, there's no sense of doom to Hyrule, the dungeons get smaller with the exception of the City in the Sky, there's nothing to do between temples with the exception of Ilia and before the City in the Sky (both hardly long quests). The 8th temple while cool, is tiny and can be done in 30 minutes. There aren't great moments like in the first half (navigating Hyrule the castle roofs in wolf form, unfreezing Zora's domain, accompanying Telma/Ilia in the carriage, the bridge of Eldin duel, the triforce cutscene, rushing Midna back to Zelda and way more. The second half may have cool dungeon locations and cool items, but as I said, in my opinion the story becomes a complete mess, nothing noteworthy happens and it just feels like the Triforce hunt from Wind waker, only with small dungeons at the end of each stage. And don't get me started on two last bad guys, sitting in their comfy chairs doing nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hellfire Posted January 13, 2007 Share Posted January 13, 2007 It's his own opinion,doesn't need to be the same as yours. I didn't think it got worse past Arbiters Grounds.I thought it was more memoriable. Let go Luke. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The3rdChildren Posted January 13, 2007 Share Posted January 13, 2007 I don't have anything better to do with myself... so let's take a spin. This lack of impending doom thing is bullshit. Ocarina of Time had seven years to establish it's doom scenario, Twilight Princess could hardly conjure up anything on the scale everyone was expecting in the maximum of a week between Ganondorf returning to Hyrule, taking over the castle and Link confronting him. There's not really a lot he could have done in that time, and it seems he was simply wanting to rule Hyrule and control the sacred realm, not destroy it. His evil deeds would have of course come... but futher down the line had Link, Midna and Princess Zelda not defeated him. Couple that with the Twilight being something most people are unaware of and you're painting a very OBLIVIOUS picture. How can there be doom and fear when practically nobody knows there's anything to be afraid of? Monsters were the only real thing to be afraid of if you were a civillian and those fucked off when the Twilight did. You are the player were well aware of the stakes and danger, so why do you give a crap about the NPC characters cowering in fear? The game did a fine job of showing YOU that it was important to defeat Ganondorf and save Hyrule from what would have been dark times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motion Posted January 13, 2007 Share Posted January 13, 2007 That's the point, there was nothing for the people to be scared of. There was no danger to them, they don't have a clue who Ganondorf is or that he's taken over Hyrule Castle. They don't care there's a giant diamond over the castle and they certainly have no idea who Link is and what he's trying to achieve. Would it have taken much for the developers to include some bad weather, armies of enemies swarming Death Mountain or taking control of Castle Town? Let the people go about their business but with a reminder of the new leadership. Would it have taken much to have Link run into Ganondorf at least once?? In Wind Waker it was cool because he referred to Link like he knew about past heroes, which he did "I've been waiting for someone like you, the hero". In this one it's "you're wrong Midna, and so is your 'little friend'". When you're just about to walk into the final battle and the sky is yellow with storm clouds and lightning everywhere... I just thought to myself, that's 15 hours too late. In Ocarina of Time, you felt as though you were Hyrule's last hope, everything was destroyed and it was your chance to put it right. In Twilight Princess, the bad guys are sitting on their seats minding their own business, not doing anything, no ones aware of what's going on, and you have two pathetically easy boss battles to subdue them. True nobody knows there's anything to be afraid of, but as i said... That's my point!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emasher Posted January 13, 2007 Share Posted January 13, 2007 i we had karmara i would give you one can anyone remember what page the link to the entire ost was on Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motion Posted January 13, 2007 Share Posted January 13, 2007 karmara? do you mean karma? And if so, what does that mean in forum language? http://www.thehylia.com/media/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CooInTheZoo Posted January 13, 2007 Share Posted January 13, 2007 but it didnt fire!! and if it did.. it would be behind some ice passages i asume i'll need the ball and chain to get too, which i cant get yet arrgh confused!! hahaha you'll never guess what (and this took me an hour...) i never put a bomb in the cannon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stocka Posted January 13, 2007 Share Posted January 13, 2007 People prefer the second half of the game to the first half? Crazy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motion Posted January 13, 2007 Share Posted January 13, 2007 Tell me about it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flameboy Posted January 13, 2007 Share Posted January 13, 2007 Well haven't completed the game yet, but just about to go into hyrule castle to what I assume will be a dungeon then the face off against ganondorf. Anyway, back to what I wanted to say, I loved the first half of the game, I loved the organic feel of the dungeons, the way the you felt like you were getting further into the woods, i loved the fire temple feeling like I was going further into the mines, but this idea soon seemed to get abandoned, and we end up with temples of the traditional form and easy ones at that..only the sky temple has really had me scratching my head... Also think there are some blatant attempts to stretch the game out longer...and some lazy ones mind... One final thing, whilst there have been some great boss battles so far, from an epic kind of view point, none of them have been that hard, once you've sussed what to do there are a piece of piss... I prefer my bosses to be about solving what to do and struggling through with it, really feeling like the battle is a challenge, I mean Zant was a joke to be honest.... This is my first real post to critique TP and no doubt I will get slated for it. But I would still say this is up there with OOT as one of the best Zelda's there is. It is simply the most comprehensive Zelda there is, the best re-telling of the ancient tale there is. has some of the coolest items to collect and even though I have had a go about the levels being easy, i'm glad it's been the way it is. I'm in my final year at uni and don't have the time to spend on giant adventures right now, so Zelda has been ok for me, spent 40ish hours so far and thats ok for me, anymore and it would have been too long and hard I reckon. Also finally think the wiimote works so well and am so glad nintendo held it back for the wii. recently got the 4 game collectors disc off ebay and played abit of the WW demo quickly to just get straight into it and found it sooo wierd going back, hated not swinging to use the sword didn't feel natural at all..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zell Posted January 13, 2007 Share Posted January 13, 2007 That's the point, there was nothing for the people to be scared of. There was no danger to them, they don't have a clue who Ganondorf is or that he's taken over Hyrule Castle. They don't care there's a giant diamond over the castle and they certainly have no idea who Link is and what he's trying to achieve. Would it have taken much for the developers to include some bad weather, armies of enemies swarming Death Mountain or taking control of Castle Town? Let the people go about their business but with a reminder of the new leadership. Would it have taken much to have Link run into Ganondorf at least once?? In Wind Waker it was cool because he referred to Link like he knew about past heroes, which he did "I've been waiting for someone like you, the hero". In this one it's "you're wrong Midna, and so is your 'little friend'". When you're just about to walk into the final battle and the sky is yellow with storm clouds and lightning everywhere... I just thought to myself, that's 15 hours too late. In Ocarina of Time, you felt as though you were Hyrule's last hope, everything was destroyed and it was your chance to put it right. In Twilight Princess, the bad guys are sitting on their seats minding their own business, not doing anything, no ones aware of what's going on, and you have two pathetically easy boss battles to subdue them. True nobody knows there's anything to be afraid of, but as i said... That's my point!! Why does it even matter? Please tell me. Did you complain about this in Wind Waker, because it seemed to me that the people in Windfall didn't have a clue about Ganon trying to drain the ocean? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonwah Posted January 13, 2007 Share Posted January 13, 2007 I liked the fact that Link was a completely unkown hero in this game. The whole world was in danger the whole time but nobody knew about it. And then Link, Zelda and Midna save the day but get no recognition for it, because they didn't need any recognition. And look at other games, as Zell said, nobody has a clue about what's going on in WW do they. Just a couple of the main characters. And OoT, the Hyrulians had moved to Kakoriko after Ganondorf took over and seemed to have been leading a pretty alright life without any major concerns. Infact, the only two times they're really unsettled at all is when they're first ushered out of Castletown, and then when Kakoriko catches on fire. Other than that, people don't really have much knowledge. In fact, screw going through all the games. I think the only game where people... civilians... know what's going on in the world, is in Majoras Mask. Because there's a freaking moon with a face on it crashing to the earth. So does that mean that Majora's Mask is the only decent Zelda game made? Because it focused on npcs? Right. Ontop of this. It isn't always in the enemy's best interest to constantly attack and strike. Zant had pretty much taken over the world and severed the castle off from everywhere else too. He was the king of twilight from before the game started, which is what he wanted. Other than that he was just doing Ganondorf's bidding, which was to get him back into Hyrule. Which happened during the game, it's not like they both just sat about on their asses the whole time. They had a plan, whether it was truly thought out that well or not, they both got what they wanted, if not briefly thanks to link. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motion Posted January 13, 2007 Share Posted January 13, 2007 Well haven't completed the game yet, but just about to go into hyrule castle to what I assume will be a dungeon then the face off against ganondorf. Anyway, back to what I wanted to say, I loved the first half of the game, I loved the organic feel of the dungeons, the way the you felt like you were getting further into the woods, i loved the fire temple feeling like I was going further into the mines, but this idea soon seemed to get abandoned, and we end up with temples of the traditional form and easy ones at that..only the sky temple has really had me scratching my head... Also think there are some blatant attempts to stretch the game out longer...and some lazy ones mind... One final thing, whilst there have been some great boss battles so far, from an epic kind of view point, none of them have been that hard, once you've sussed what to do there are a piece of piss... I prefer my bosses to be about solving what to do and struggling through with it, really feeling like the battle is a challenge, I mean Zant was a joke to be honest.... This is my first real post to critique TP and no doubt I will get slated for it. But I would still say this is up there with OOT as one of the best Zelda's there is. It is simply the most comprehensive Zelda there is, the best re-telling of the ancient tale there is. has some of the coolest items to collect and even though I have had a go about the levels being easy, i'm glad it's been the way it is. I'm in my final year at uni and don't have the time to spend on giant adventures right now, so Zelda has been ok for me, spent 40ish hours so far and thats ok for me, anymore and it would have been too long and hard I reckon. Also finally think the wiimote works so well and am so glad nintendo held it back for the wii. recently got the 4 game collectors disc off ebay and played abit of the WW demo quickly to just get straight into it and found it sooo wierd going back, hated not swinging to use the sword didn't feel natural at all..... Fantastic post, nice one, I agree completely. Yeah people seem to slate you if you have a negative opinion about CERTAIN aspects of TP around here. That's what annoys me. Why does it even matter? Please tell me. Did you complain about this in Wind Waker, because it seemed to me that the people in Windfall didn't have a clue about Ganon trying to drain the ocean? Yes I did complain about it, but the difference is... there was the threat of saving Zelda. Here, saving Zelda makes ZERO sense, it's just been thrown in at the last minute to add to the drama. As well as this, games should improve with each outing, especially since TP took twice as long to make than WW. After 4 years you'd expect better than WW, but TP ain't it (imo as always) I liked the fact that Link was a completely unkown hero in this game. The whole world was in danger the whole time but nobody knew about it. And then Link, Zelda and Midna save the day but get no recognition for it, because they didn't need any recognition.And look at other games, as Zell said, nobody has a clue about what's going on in WW do they. Just a couple of the main characters. And OoT, the Hyrulians had moved to Kakoriko after Ganondorf took over and seemed to have been leading a pretty alright life without any major concerns. Infact, the only two times they're really unsettled at all is when they're first ushered out of Castletown, and then when Kakoriko catches on fire. Other than that, people don't really have much knowledge. In fact, screw going through all the games. I think the only game where people... civilians... know what's going on in the world, is in Majoras Mask. Because there's a freaking moon with a face on it crashing to the earth. So does that mean that Majora's Mask is the only decent Zelda game made? Because it focused on npcs? Right. Ontop of this. It isn't always in the enemy's best interest to constantly attack and strike. Zant had pretty much taken over the world and severed the castle off from everywhere else too. He was the king of twilight from before the game started, which is what he wanted. Other than that he was just doing Ganondorf's bidding, which was to get him back into Hyrule. Which happened during the game, it's not like they both just sat about on their asses the whole time. They had a plan, whether it was truly thought out that well or not, they both got what they wanted, if not briefly thanks to link. Get off your high horse, at least there's damage, destruction and death in OOT and MM. Something to fight for, something to save. "It's not like they both sat on their asses" - Really? Cause that's exactly how it looks like to me. What exactly did Ganondorf want? What was he doing about it? Zant was a joke, he wanted to rule the Twilight... right, so what? Majora's Mask was excellent because it showed you first hand what could happen if you failed. OOT gave you a sense of 'oh shit' it's my fault all this happened in Hyrule, let me fix my mistakes. Oh and Ganon at least had a plan in OOT! In TP he just seems like an after-thought thrown in to make the game more epic. Link and him don't know each other, we don't see what he's been doing, and the fact that he somehow gets hold of Zelda at the end is the biggest plot hole in the entire Zelda series. In other words, yes, TP has a very rushed ending. You can tell by the storyline, by the temples, and by the 'events' or lack thereof in between dungeons. TP is a fantastic game, just not as well thought out as the other three. IN MY OPINION! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonwah Posted January 14, 2007 Share Posted January 14, 2007 Highhorse schmighhorse! I think the fact that Midna's world was being completely owned gave a feeling of being on the outside, seeing what could happen. A lot of the storyline was about preventing the same kind of ownage taking place in Hyrule. I thought Ganondorf being in the game, while clearly just Nintendo thinking they have to have him in a game for it to be considered a real Zelda game for some reason, wasn't bad really. Ganondorf wanted what he always wanted, total power over Hyrule. Though he was trapped in the twilight realm for ages untill the game. Okay I don't know why, having captured the castle, he didn't do anything for days on end. I'm sure there was a reason, like he was a bit poorly or something or he forgot what he was planning to do. But the main point is that he escaped and it was up to link to stop him before he got round to doing anything that'd impact the villagers. I'm not saying TP is any better than you think it is (I don't think), you're just bashing constantly. Which is good since few people have the balls to really knock it since it's Zelda. But I'd rather be fighting TP's corner to the very end than just sit by and watch. Besides, I like my high horse. (I also must say I didn't think WindWaker was all that good. But that's no the issue) - and yes the plot holes in TP were quite attrocious in all honesty Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CooInTheZoo Posted January 14, 2007 Share Posted January 14, 2007 i just think its fantastic nintendo are starting to EXPLAIN why Ganondorf escapes where he's captive, or why he doesnt die. are we saying ganondorf now without spoiler boxes?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonwah Posted January 14, 2007 Share Posted January 14, 2007 I thought there was a seperate no-spoilers thread? Or can we not be bothered keeping that going now? Speaking of spoilers, what's the deal with the way the sages look these days? Weird. They've given up on real people and maidens and stuff. Vulnerable ghosts it is! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motion Posted January 14, 2007 Share Posted January 14, 2007 Those sages just epitomised the laziness present in TP, boring, dull, identical. Compare them to the OOT ones! And the fact that they each wore the symbol of an OOT sage really got on my goat. Consistency and continuity is great but not when it's done so lazilly. And I'm not bashing constantly, I happen to think it's a fantastic game. When I bash, I bash because I love. I just think there's a sense of 'can't say anything bad about it, it's Zelda!' as you say. Ask me to list 20 things about TP that I adore and I'd have no problem! I just state the negatives because that's what I feel strongest about. Enjoy your high horse Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The3rdChildren Posted January 14, 2007 Share Posted January 14, 2007 I called my high horse Epona. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonwah Posted January 14, 2007 Share Posted January 14, 2007 Yes the sages were stupid, the continuity of the sages was slightly screwed by this game in my opinion. And bash away. Bash in the name of love! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hellfire Posted January 14, 2007 Share Posted January 14, 2007 Just because you don't understand who the sages are doesn't mean it doesn't have continuity. Nintendo always made things mysterious and weird. I think it's normal for beings that have transcended being human forsake shallow things such as appearance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The3rdChildren Posted January 14, 2007 Share Posted January 14, 2007 Didn't the Sages/wise men all look the same in Link to the Past as well? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hellfire Posted January 14, 2007 Share Posted January 14, 2007 I think they didn't appear at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts