Nintendo to announce secret “brand-new types of games” for Wii U soon

[Ville]

This list made me laugh, especially the last two. Even the 360/PS3/PS4/Xbone are filled with crap that's "more of the same". You CANNOT limit this just to Nintendo.

 

Yeah, I guess that's why games like The Last of Us and Bioshock Infinite are pulling 93-95/100 -type metacritic scores, eh? Also, for the next gen consoles we have for example The Crew, The Division, Destiny, Elder Scrolls Online etc etc. So same old crap my ass. Even Assassin's Creed IV, which is operating with the same mechanics as the previous games, is situated in a fresh new setting. Compare to Mario, who's stuck in the Mushroom Kingdom game after game. Same goes for Mario Kart: looks good and the anti-gravity mechanic is interesting, but let's be honest, we've seen those courses a million times before already...

 

Not to even mention GTA V, a sequel to another long-running series, which has fans creaming their pants just by the sheer scope and ambition of it. These are the modern trail-blazing games, and Nintendo doesn't hold a candle to them anymore. I mean just looks at Wii U's Metacritic scores: the best Nintendo game there is NSMBU at spot 10 (84/100). Yes, on their own friggin' console, they're not even at top 5, but top 10. Even worse, the next game is Nintendo Land at spot 21 (77/100), and after that NSLU at spot 25 (76/100). Now that's crappy. And what about the recently released Game & Wario? Spot 40 with a pathetic score of 61/100.

 

So spin it all you want, but the Wii U is definitely suffering from a severe case of "same old, same old". The 3DS seems to be doing fine, but that's probably because it's a handheld and thus it has more leeway in terms of graphics etc.

[Serebii]

Yeah, I guess that's why games like The Last of Us and Bioshock Infinite are pulling 93-95/100 -type metacritic scores, eh? Also, for the next gen consoles we have for example The Crew, The Division, Destiny, Elder Scrolls Online etc etc. So same old crap my ass. Even Assassin's Creed IV, which is operating with the same mechanics as the previous games, is situated in a fresh new setting. Compare to Mario, who's stuck in the Mushroom Kingdom game after game. Same goes for Mario Kart: looks good and the anti-gravity mechanic is interesting, but let's be honest, we've seen those courses a million times before already...

 

Not to even mention GTA V, a sequel to another long-running series, which has fans creaming their pants just by the sheer scope and ambition of it. These are the modern trail-blazing games, and Nintendo doesn't hold a candle to them anymore. I mean just looks at Wii U's Metacritic scores: the best Nintendo game there is NSMBU at spot 10 (84/100). Yes, on their own friggin' console, they're not even at top 5, but top 10. Even worse, the next game is Nintendo Land at spot 21 (77/100), and after that NSLU at spot 25 (76/100). Now that's crappy. And what about the recently released Game & Wario? Spot 40 with a pathetic score of 61/100.

 

So spin it all you want, but the Wii U is definitely suffering from a severe case of "same old, same old". The 3DS seems to be doing fine, but that's probably because it's a handheld and thus it has more leeway in terms of graphics etc.

So, a game that has the same mechanics but a new setting isn't more of the same, but a game that has new mechanics and a similar setting is? Please.

 

Also, where did I say that the other consoles are JUST getting the same old stuff over and over. Providing a list of several games that are not does not in ANY WAY make that not true. If they were the only games for said consoles, then yes you'd be right. However, they are not and saying otherwise is completely extremely fallacious.

 

Yes, the Wii U doesn't have many games, and they don't all review that well, but that's besides the point. You're comparing a 2D platformer, which has the same assets as the previous in the series, released just a few months after the last one, to a massive open world game that's a sequel to one that came out 6 years ago. Again, you're comparing apples and oranges and that's just ridiculous. Also, New Super Luigi U is DLC for Christ's sake so why is this being included?

 

I'm going to stop now because I don't want to piss off the mods, but crap like this is why the Wii U Discussion threads got closed

[Happenstance]

I'm going to stop now because I don't want to piss off the mods, but crap like this is why the Wii U Discussion threads got closed

 

Do you honestly not understand that its the kind of stuff you post that got that thread closed? You are probably the main reason other members dont like to come into the Nintendo section anymore. Nearly every post you make ends up being defensive and people are sick of it.

[Serebii]

Do you honestly not understand that its the kind of stuff you post that got that thread closed? You are probably the main reason other members dont like to come into the Nintendo section anymore. Nearly every post you make ends up being defensive and people are sick of it.

I'm sure it had nothing to do with the rampant negativity too.

 

Sorry for trying to paint a positive outlook on things, in addition to providing facts considering that's my job as a journalist. I should know better, though. Instead, I'll put on some emo music and start writing depressing poetry to fit in.

[flameboy]

I might have been a tad too aggressive in my point, indeed. I apologize for that.

 

Still, I think it's pretty obvious why Nintendo didn't do it: every single time they do, they get waves of complaints that these aren't "core" games.

 

I was all ready to hit back but you know what apology accepted. Who knew a fanboy with a bit of humility! Not enough respect in this place sometimes.

 

Anyway yes I get your point. However as we know E3 is attended by mainstream press as well and I think you can attribute a lot of the Wii's success to getting their message out there. I just don't think it would have done any harm as a supplement to what they showed. Sure we've had E3s in the past that have focussed to much the other way (not just from Nintendo) it's about finding that right balance. With no press conference as a focal point I feel like Nintendo had that chance to just put stuff out there in a much more natural way.

[Happenstance]

I'm sure it had nothing to do with the rampant negativity too.

 

Sorry for trying to paint a positive outlook on things, in addition to providing facts considering that's my job as a journalist. I should know better, though. Instead, I'll put on some emo music and start writing depressing poetry to fit in.

 

I wondered when you would bring up that you were a "journalist". You seem to use that as some kind of excuse for talking to people the way you do.

[madeinbeats]

Buying Nintendo systems and games and then berating them makes no sense. You're part of the perceived problem.

 

Why be on a Nintendo site when a large percentage of your participation is to just jump on them at any opportunity? Makes no sense.

 

Don't buy Nintendo, move to a Playstation or MS forum.

 

If Nintendo is no longer for you, fine, but don't kick and scream for Nintendo to change just because you have.

 

People seem to want a Sony console with a Nintendo badge on it.

 

If enough people think the same and don't buy Nintendo products (vote YES for their business practices) then they will change to accommodate.

 

The constant berating and moaning has to stop though. Remove yourself from the enviroment you now hate so much and direct your custom elsewhere.

[Jamba]

So, a game that has the same mechanics but a new setting isn't more of the same, but a game that has new mechanics and a similar setting is? Please.

 

I think you're looking at this the wrong way entirely. For a game that is story driven, changing the situation/setting for the characters with minimal changes to the mechanics is exactly what a successful sequel should do. The audience is following a set of characters and their continuing story so they don't want to that distracted by getting used to too much new stuff from a gameplay point of view. They are invested in their story so that's their hook to buying the next game.

 

Many Nintendo games are mechanics based with very little story. Nobody really gives a hoot what happens to Peach in Mario right? So what do you change to entice people back for another go? Has to be the design and mechanics, maybe even the graphical style. Which is why Mario follows this pattern. The stimulus of those games is perfecting the new mechanics. So when we get MORE NSMB, with no mechanics changes, then it all starts to feel a bit old. I would argue that everything in Mario Land 3D U seems all a little too familiar as well.

 

But it's a value judgement, not black and white. It's likely that a major mix up in the mechanics, with some familiar necessaries in a Mario games is going to get received better and people would be more excited about it.

[Happenstance]

Buying Nintendo systems and games and then berating them makes no sense. You're part of the perceived problem.

 

Why be on a Nintendo site when a large percentage of your participation is to just jump on them at any opportunity? Makes no sense.

 

Don't buy Nintendo, move to a Playstation or MS forum.

 

If Nintendo is no longer for you, fine, but don't kick and scream for Nintendo to change just because you have.

 

People seem to want a Sony console with a Nintendo badge on it.

 

If enough people think the same and don't buy Nintendo products (vote YES for their business practices) then they will change to accommodate.

 

The constant berating and moaning has to stop though. Remove yourself from the enviroment you now hate so much and direct your custom elsewhere.

 

I come here to talk about games, good or bad its as simple as that. Nintendo are having a hard time at the moment with the Wii U and that is worth talking about. I'm not just going to stop because you want a more positive conversation.

[Serebii]

I think you're looking at this the wrong way entirely. For a game that is story driven, changing the situation/setting for the characters with minimal changes to the mechanics is exactly what a successful sequel should do. The audience is following a set of characters and their continuing story so they don't want to that distracted by getting used to too much new stuff from a gameplay point of view. They are invested in their story so that's their hook to buying the next game.

 

Many Nintendo games are mechanics based with very little story. Nobody really gives a hoot what happens to Peach in Mario right? So what do you change to entice people back for another go? Has to be the design and mechanics, maybe even the graphical style. Which is why Mario follows this pattern. The stimulus of those games is perfecting the new mechanics. So when we get MORE NSMB, with no mechanics changes, then it all starts to feel a bit old. I would argue that everything in Mario Land 3D U seems all a little too familiar as well.

 

But it's a value judgement, not black and white. It's likely that a major mix up in the mechanics, with some familiar necessaries in a Mario games is going to get received better and people would be more excited about it.

 

Fair point. The minimal narrative does beg for more to change, and I do get why NSMBU didn't review massively high. While it's a fantastic game, arguably the greatest 2D Mario game (ignoring nostalgia) in level design, it is very simple.

 

However, the point you paint is that the story is the main reason people purchase games. That's not the case. Nearly everyone I know focuses on gameplay first and that's where Nintendo triumphs. Yes, assets are sometimes safe, but they try new stuff with every new iteration of their games (NSMB not withstanding) and that cannot be disputed. Look at Cat Mario in SM3DW. On the surface it's "so it's a cat suit. yay?" but think about how it changes your approach to levels. You can climb any wall, pounce on any enemy. It changes the gameplay. No prior 3D Mario plays like that. Yes, it may look aesthetically like past ones, but that's superficial. Besides, you don't see people complaining that they haven't changed up the aesthetics in say CoD or Halo or Forza.

 

I wondered when you would bring up that you were a "journalist". You seem to use that as some kind of excuse for talking to people the way you do.

 

How I talk to people? Please do explain. I provide facts, I do not insult people, I do not berate them, I just provide facts. As a journalist, it is my job to collect facts and present them. Perhaps I am biased a bit because the company is one I love and my future is tied directly to them, but I try to be objective. If they screw up, I say so.

[Zechs Merquise]

Do you honestly not understand that its the kind of stuff you post that got that thread closed? You are probably the main reason other members dont like to come into the Nintendo section anymore. Nearly every post you make ends up being defensive and people are sick of it.

 

No, it's not actually.

 

I game with people on this forum, and there's plenty of people that aren't happy with the situation with the Wii U right now - I'm one of them!

 

I (and others) know the Wii U isn't doing as well as it should be, or providing the games it should be. But the reason we get sick of the Wii U Discussion isn't because of @Serebii. It's because the of the rampant negativity that is attached to everything Nintendo do.

 

Sure, the Wii U launched at a high price, it wasn't advertised correctly and the name was misleading. Nintendo have also failed to give the console their usual high profile and high quality first party support so far. We know they're clearly having trouble making the adjustment to HD development.

 

But damn, some people are just NEGATIVE, and for the sake of being negative. That's what gets an awful lot of people down. If people hate Nintendo so much, then back the f*ck up and get lost.

 

Two of us actually performed a small test, we posted a small negative remark in Sony discussion, I had my post deleted, the other person was told to stop. That's how quick it's stamped on. But on the Nintendo board it's actively encouraged - despite their being a seperate Wii U discussion for those who want to bitch.

 

Now I'm not saying everyone should just keep smiling whilst theTitanic sinks, but there's reasoned discussion and there's bitching. And the other day it got so bad some people were actually now complaining that Nintendo were sponsoring a major sporting event! In just the same way some people are complaining about the smallest things in every Nintendo game - oooh the ground textures in Pikmin 3, they're not 'next gen' - WTF?

 

I'm all for debate and I have just as many misgivings over things that are - or are not happening - at the moment. But just piling on the negativity and refusing to acknowledge any of the good stuff is doing a lot of people's heads in. People who just want to come to a forum and say 'hey - I just got this game for the Wii U and enjoyed it' - without a barage of abuse about why their purchase and the console they enjoy playing is a load of 'shit'.

 

Serebii is not the problem, he's just trying to give a positive voice and opinion on the things happening. He might not always be right, but it's a sad day when on a NINTENDO FORUM you get shouted down for being positive about Nintendo.

[flameboy]

I'm sure it had nothing to do with the rampant negativity too.

 

Sorry for trying to paint a positive outlook on things, in addition to providing facts considering that's my job as a journalist. I should know better, though. Instead, I'll put on some emo music and start writing depressing poetry to fit in.

 

Jeez do you ever read back what you write? I'm a journalist it's my job to provide facts, get over yourself seriously!

 

I'm a teacher do you see me rampaging around correcting peoples grammatical errors? (No in fact I like not having to bother even thinking about it) It's not like you even present facts in any way shape or form. You're antagonistic and no matter how well constructed an argument/counter point you put people down every chance you get, it's pathetic.

 

Negativity doesn't close threads, conflict does and that's what you cause in every thread you grace with your presence.

[Happenstance]

How I talk to people? Please do explain. I provide facts, I do not insult people, I do not berate them, I just provide facts. As a journalist, it is my job to collect facts and present them. Perhaps I am biased a bit because the company is one I love and my future is tied directly to them, but I try to be objective. If they screw up, I say so.

 

You talk down to them, just ask @Hero\-of\-Time in the Wii U thread locking post

 

Do you know their are members of the forum that will not enter this topic or board because they feel like if they offer a negative point of view they will be flamed? Well it's true.

[Jamba]

However, the point you paint is that the story is the main reason people purchase games. That's not the case.

 

Ok, just for a second cool down and read what I wrote in context. I said the main reason people buy a SEQUEL for storyline based games.

 

On the other hand I'm not going to try and argue about whether Cat-Hat actually is new enough or not. You can try and boil down the logic of the fact that it should be fresh enough as it should allow you to explore the Mario levels in a new way.

 

The only thing that matters is if the potential punters consider it fresh enough. And my opinion and several others have been that it's a wet trout. Maybe it's because vertical assent = jumping and kitten attack = sonic or that kitten attack is effectively a big win button against enemies.

 

One small point for future reference to you particularly @Serebii , can you keep in mind with my post that when I'm talking about the Wii U, I'm almost always talking in terms of potential new customers and not existing ones. You seem to be missing the context of what I'm saying in my previous posts.

[madeinbeats]

I come here to talk about games, good or bad its as simple as that. Nintendo are having a hard time at the moment with the Wii U and that is worth talking about. I'm not just going to stop because you want a more positive conversation.

 

Serii is in the right place. He loves Nintendo. He OWNS a Wii U. He plays their games. He likes their style.

 

He posts on a Nintendo forum. He isn't the odd one out.

[Ville]

@Serebii Bottom line: other consoles are getting games that get praised to the heavens, the Wii U is not.

 

@madeinbeats And this is why the "Other Wii U" -thread was created. I know the moaning is tiring to hear, but so is the "oh you guys are such dumbasses there's nothing wrong with Nintendo and it doesn't matter how many years you've supported the company just go away if you don't like it". I mean don't you find it a bit worrying that on a Nintendo forum there is so a much complaining? Same thing with the critics. These are fans of Nintendo that have suddenly turned sour. Why, just because we don't see the brilliance of Nintendo anymore? Or because you guys can't see flaws in anything Nintendo does? Now this is the problem.

 

Seriously guys, this is getting ridiculous. If this forum is going to survive, we do need dual topics. We have one group that is so positive and optimistic that they see nothing wrong with Nintendo ever. And then there's the other group that has been let down by Nintendo and are in complaining mode. Both groups piss each other off.

[nekunando]

I'm sick of all the fighting..

 

I hope some of the unannounced games inspire a bit more joy amongst everyone..

[flameboy]

Serii is in the right place. He loves Nintendo. He OWNS a Wii U. He plays their games. He likes their style.

 

He posts on a Nintendo forum. He isn't the odd one out.

 

Judging by the OWNS you're implying people who don't are in the wrong place. It's not about being in the right place by your logic what right does Serii (as he affectionately known by his defense force) have to post in the other consoles? No one is saying he can't post but the manner with which he conducts himself is appalling.

 

People need to get off their high horses about what this place should be and that they have to be quite so defensive (scratch that offensive) about Nintendo, at the end of day aren't we all just big kids who fell in love with games?

[Jamba]

Serii is in the right place. He loves Nintendo. He OWNS a Wii U. He plays their games. He likes their style.

 

He posts on a Nintendo forum. He isn't the odd one out.

 

Whilst on a Nintendo forum, you should expect a certain amount of bias but I think it's pretty short sighted to expect people not to be upset about things at all. In fact, people should be allowed to get upset as most of us understand that kind of "What the fuck have I just paid £350 for?!" kind of disappointment.

 

And that kind of feeling is going to happen every time Nintendo essentially say: "it's ok kids! Wait til E3 and then all of your worries shall be forgotten!" Fans will have that feeling of being crushed all over again.

 

What causes the conflict is the "shut up, there's nothing to complain about" attitude that does get bandied around. Being upset about something isn't a factual argument that you can counter, it's somebody's emotional state that should be addressed with some compassion.

[Fused King]

I gotta say, I'm lovin' it.

 

All this passion, all this fervent talk, all this zeal.

 

I think that a shift of perspective has taken place in people who experience NINTENDO consoles and NINTENDO games, but also experience the amazing output on Microsoft and especially Sony their respective consoles.

Once the PS3 started picking up steam, and also before then, games started coming out that were on a whole other level than NINTENDO's own output.

By now there is a very clear distinction between NINTENDO games and games from Sony and Microsoft and a good handful of 3rd parties, and some just can't go back anymore after having tastes the riches of massive-grand-epicness with a hint of awesomecreamer.

 

I'd say certain people prefer the type of epicness and 'games as art' kind o' vibe one gets from The Last of Us/GTAV/Skyrim/Uncharted/Bioshock/etc... than the gameplay focused games NINTENDO puts out.

I mean, the former really try to approach storytelling and whatnot as if it were a movie, and with a realistic tone to it.

NINTENDO usually talks about putting a fun gameplay experience at the foreground which brings a smile to your face, and that most certainly puts games in a much more 'games = entertainment' corner.

 

Neither is bad or good, because, as is the case with almost everything in this world, 't is all subjectivity.

Whether you like playing as Missingno. in the most glitchy adventure ever or playing through a grand American epic we've seen a million times in the cinema already like the Last of Us (not a fan), one's tastes are one's tastes.

 

Then you have that lovely debate about new IPs which again is the bitch of subjectivity.

 

I can understand both sides.

Whilst Miyamoto has a point that new characters + new world does not equal a new IP instantly, I can see that for some people (myself included) the act of exploring a new world with its own new lore and characters is somewhat of a new 'gameplay mechanic'. And of course it doesn't really help seeing 'gameplay innovations' such as a cat suit in the new 3D Mario and NINTENDO marketing the fuck out of it as if its some kind of milestone.

I honestely think that if they perhaps fleshed out that cat idea, NINTENDO could've come up with their own take on something like Mirror's Edge.

Granted though, I must say that most NINTENDO games, and especially Mario games, are packed with neat little touched, fresh ideas and unique ways to jump, slash, or fuck around. It's just that, when compared to the grandeur of games on the other consoles, it feels so tiny.

 

But again, I don't really care I love NINTENDO for what they do and what they could do in the future, and I love Sony for their own unique way of showing what games are about.

And Microsoft, well, .... they also have awesome games on their console:grin:

 

Fact is, NINTENDO is too important for a lot of people to not have some form of a relationship with.

Because, of course, most of us were nurtured by the teat of a NES, SNES, N64 or GameBoy.

Edited July 6, 2013 by Fused King

[madeinbeats]

Judging by the OWNS you're implying people who don't are in the wrong place.

 

Most of the habitual moaners and drive-by Wii U thread posters don't seem to own one, no. Anyone who can only 99% of the time muster negative comments are in the wrong from talking about the wrong thing, bringing down and grating on people who want to be in the thread who mostly have a mixture of things to contribute.

 

serii (as he affectionately known by his defense force)

 

To be fair, that's quite a churlish level to lower it to. Maybe you realise after reading it back. I don't know. Does then make you the Serii Assault Force? Don't answer that

Edited July 6, 2013 by madeinbeats

[Serebii]

Judging by the OWNS you're implying people who don't are in the wrong place. It's not about being in the right place by your logic what right does Serii (as he affectionately known by his defense force) have to post in the other consoles? No one is saying he can't post but the manner with which he conducts himself is appalling.

 

People need to get off their high horses about what this place should be and that they have to be quite so defensive (scratch that offensive) about Nintendo, at the end of day aren't we all just big kids who fell in love with games?

To be fair, I do own a PS3 and 360 and got a great deal of enjoyment out of them so using his logic, would that not give me said right? I also intend to get a PS4. Why? Because I'm a gamer, not a Nintendo fanboy.

 

I also fail to see how the manner I approach things is "appalling". I don't berate people, I don't condescend. I provide facts in the hope I can help them either feel better about their purchase, or convince that things shall be alright in the end. I never criticise people for their opinions. So, pray tell, how is it "appalling"?

 

If this is all on me, then if Ashley or the other powers that be say so, I shall gladly leave in hopes of finding a place that hasn't turned into a mini-NeoGAF despite the fact I came to this forum years ago to discuss Nintendo happily with Nintendo fans.

 

Ok, just for a second cool down and read what I wrote in context. I said the main reason people buy a SEQUEL for storyline based games.

 

On the other hand I'm not going to try and argue about whether Cat-Hat actually is new enough or not. You can try and boil down the logic of the fact that it should be fresh enough as it should allow you to explore the Mario levels in a new way.

 

The only thing that matters is if the potential punters consider it fresh enough. And my opinion and several others have been that it's a wet trout. Maybe it's because vertical assent = jumping and kitten attack = sonic or that kitten attack is effectively a big win button against enemies.

 

One small point for future reference to you particularly @Serebii , can you keep in mind with my post that when I'm talking about the Wii U, I'm almost always talking in terms of potential new customers and not existing ones. You seem to be missing the context of what I'm saying in my previous posts.

 

True enough, but I don't really feel people play sequels for the story either. It helps, but they play it because it's more of what they enjoyed last time. In this era of cinematic presentation, it does feel that it has become less about the game and more about the narrative and I don't like that. I get that's the big thing that's in right now, but I'm glad Nintendo hasn't followed that path

[dazzybee]

I certainly post on these forum a lot less than I used to. No one seems to discuss or debate anything any more; people try from both sides and get shot down by someone or other or worse claim victim, like they express a view and any repsonse to that they build a wall around themsleves with "fanboy/Nintendo hater" "I'm allowed my opinion" "You're so negative/postive" these are the worst for me. I don't know. Beginning to really bore me...

 

Personally I prefer a more positive person than negative in general in life, but what the fuck is wrong with balance any more?! The internet seems to have killed it.

[flameboy]

To be fair, that's quite a churlish level to lower it to. Maybe you realise after reading it back. I don't know. Does then make you the Serii Assault Force? Don't answer that

 

Really you're going to say I've dropped too low with some of things that get said to people.

 

 

 

To be fair, I do own a PS3 and 360 and got a great deal of enjoyment out of them so using his logic, would that not give me said right? I also intend to get a PS4. Why? Because I'm a gamer, not a Nintendo fanboy.

 

I also fail to see how the manner I approach things is "appalling". I don't berate people, I don't condescend. I provide facts in the hope I can help them either feel better about their purchase, or convince that things shall be alright in the end. I never criticise people for their opinions. So, pray tell, how is it "appalling"?

 

If this is all on me, then if Ashley or the other powers that be say so, I shall gladly leave in hopes of finding a place that hasn't turned into a mini-NeoGAF despite the fact I came to this forum years ago to discuss Nintendo happily with Nintendo fans.

 

 

 

True enough, but I don't really feel people play sequels for the story either. It helps, but they play it because it's more of what they enjoyed last time. In this era of cinematic presentation, it does feel that it has become less about the game and more about the narrative and I don't like that. I get that's the big thing that's in right now, but I'm glad Nintendo hasn't followed that path

 

The big thing that comes out of here is you saying you are not condescending, that's a joke. Can't you see the way you make people feel? Multiple people across multiple threads across a sustained period of time.

 

I didn't even know you had other consoles never see you in there. Maybe you do post I dunno the fact that all this Nintendo noise drowns that out says something.

 

As for what you point out as why you love Nintendo yes good points. My problem is there isn't enough to sustain a home console. It's the lack third party support over what 3 generations of consoles now that just makes no sense to me. It has yo change or Nintendo has to ramp it up and publish/develop more games.