Fierce_LiNk Posted October 17, 2012 Posted October 17, 2012 This game will blow. Why? Because it doesn't have any material that references everybody's favourite Bond film. Yes. Die Another Day. All they had to do was put in a level or two from there. A line here or there. Then, watch as the money rolls in. Hey, wait a minu-
Captain Falcon Posted October 17, 2012 Posted October 17, 2012 This game will blow. Why? Because it doesn't have any material that references everybody's favourite Bond film. Yes. Die Another Day. All they had to do was put in a level or two from there. A line here or there. Then, watch as the money rolls in. Hey, wait a minu- I'm not too sure what you're getting at here? Die Another Day is not a good Bond film or even a good film full stop. But this game has Goldfinger and it still isn't good. As questionable as that and Moonraker are, I also happen to like Licence to Kill and which showed Bond how he really is just like Craig now does. The problem lies in what they've done to the game. They could have made those Die Another Day levels quite good with smart level design and sophisticated AI but by all accounts there isn't any of that found in the game at all. Slapping Bond characters into Modern Warfare 3 wouldn't suddenly make it a bad game. It would be horrendous use of the licence, but that doesn't make it bad. Broken AI, super cheap production values, terrible scripts, poor voice acting, none existant level design, reduced multiplayer aspects etc are what made this game bad (if the reviews are to be believed). The films have nothing to do with it.
Fierce_LiNk Posted October 17, 2012 Posted October 17, 2012 I'm not too sure what you're getting at here? Die Another Day is not a good Bond film or even a good film full stop. But this game has Goldfinger and it still isn't good. As questionable as that and Moonraker are, I also happen to like Licence to Kill and which showed Bond how he really is just like Craig now does. The problem lies in what they've done to the game. They could have made those Die Another Day levels quite good with smart level design and sophisticated AI but by all accounts there isn't any of that found in the game at all. Slapping Bond characters into Modern Warfare 3 wouldn't suddenly make it a bad game. It would be horrendous use of the licence, but that doesn't make it bad. Broken AI, super cheap production values, terrible scripts, poor voice acting, none existant level design, reduced multiplayer aspects etc are what made this game bad (if the reviews are to be believed). The films have nothing to do with it. I was just messing around, pretty much. Also, anything with Die Another Day in is just going to taint everything else. As is evident here. It's sad. In theory, a Bond Legends game has the potential to be amazing. But, as you say, there's so much wrong with it. A shame, considering that I loved the Goldeneye re-imagining.
Captain Falcon Posted October 17, 2012 Posted October 17, 2012 It's sad. In theory, a Bond Legends game has the potential to be amazing. But, as you say, there's so much wrong with it. A shame, considering that I loved the Goldeneye re-imagining. And that's it - we know they have the pedigree to make a great game so it's all the more gauling when things like this happen most likely as a result of decisions outside their control. Which is why when people say things like "what did you expect", I feel it's quite insulting to the developer.
Cube Posted October 18, 2012 Posted October 18, 2012 Die Another Day is not a good Bond film or even a good film full stop. Die Another Day does have one thing going for it. It's not On Her Majesty's Secret Service.
Captain Falcon Posted October 18, 2012 Posted October 18, 2012 Die Another Day does have one thing going for it. It's not On Her Majesty's Secret Service. I gather OHMSS seems to be receiving new wave of support within the Bond community as of late - something DAD will never have. Plus, it's difficult to hate OHMSS too much when it has perhaps the greatest Bond theme of the lot - the version of The Living Daylights on A-Ha's own album is one of my all time favourite songs but the version used for the film is a bit wonky in parts. I watched Giant Bomb's play through of the Goldfinger level today. Seems to be some odd choices made in the game (single player perk system?) and throughout the hour odd section, there seemed very little scope for stealth and any attempts very quickly transitioned into full on fire fights. Also, Felix Leiter is not the Felix from the Craig era. It's one thing changing character from the past as part of a re-envisioning (such as Bond and Jinx) but it's another to change ones that apply to the current version of events. At one point, they walked into a room and I spotted straight away they had ripped the entire asset out fo GoldenEye and given it a couple of tweaks - every door and staircase was in the exact same point as well as sectons the player can't move past. At that point, I was half expecting Bond to walk through the rest of the Facility. Everything was blowing up from the moment the level started that you'd expect the entire base to be on full alert but you get so far and they stop... only to start up again. Not being Bond fans, the players hadn't a clue what was going on story wise and I don't blame them. I know in the film Bond is stuck at Goldfinger's ranch for quite some time and it doesn't lend itself to a game so they shift some plot bits around and cut it almost entirely out but things get explained in one line of dialogue (which they couldn't find subtitles for) so it was a blink and you'll miss it moment for a lot of bits.
D_prOdigy Posted October 18, 2012 Posted October 18, 2012 This game will blow. Why? Because it doesn't have any material that references everybody's favourite Bond film. Yes. Die Another Day. All they had to do was put in a level or two from there. A line here or there. Then, watch as the money rolls in. Hey, wait a minu- *very-English Toby Stephens accent* "JAPAN IS A BUG WAITING TO BE SQUASHED"
are1981 Posted October 18, 2012 Posted October 18, 2012 (edited) The problem lies in what they've done to the game. They could have made those Die Another Day levels quite good with smart level design and sophisticated AI but by all accounts there isn't any of that found in the game at all. Slapping Bond characters into Modern Warfare 3 wouldn't suddenly make it a bad game. It would be horrendous use of the licence, but that doesn't make it bad. Broken AI, super cheap production values, terrible scripts, poor voice acting, none existant level design, reduced multiplayer aspects etc are what made this game bad (if the reviews are to be believed). The films have nothing to do with it. I watched Giant Bomb's play through of the Goldfinger level today. Seems to be some odd choices made in the game (single player perk system?) and throughout the hour odd section, there seemed very little scope for stealth and any attempts very quickly transitioned into full on fire fights. Also, Felix Leiter is not the Felix from the Craig era. It's one thing changing character from the past as part of a re-envisioning (such as Bond and Jinx) but it's another to change ones that apply to the current version of events. At one point, they walked into a room and I spotted straight away they had ripped the entire asset out fo GoldenEye and given it a couple of tweaks - every door and staircase was in the exact same point as well as sectons the player can't move past. At that point, I was half expecting Bond to walk through the rest of the Facility. Everything was blowing up from the moment the level started that you'd expect the entire base to be on full alert but you get so far and they stop... only to start up again. Not being Bond fans, the players hadn't a clue what was going on story wise and I don't blame them. I know in the film Bond is stuck at Goldfinger's ranch for quite some time and it doesn't lend itself to a game so they shift some plot bits around and cut it almost entirely out but things get explained in one line of dialogue (which they couldn't find subtitles for) so it was a blink and you'll miss it moment for a lot of bits. Sounds like yet another 007 game that should never have been published. After GoldenEye, I only ever played parts of two Bond games. My brother bought a game for the GameCube, was it "Agent Under Fire" maybe? And I played another one named something with "fire", also on the GameCube, I believe. After those two, which never caught my interest enough to play more than three to five hours, I gave up Bond games. I honestly believe I never again will be able to play a proper Bond game. Edited October 18, 2012 by are1981
D_prOdigy Posted October 18, 2012 Posted October 18, 2012 Sounds like yet another 007 game that should never have been published. After GoldenEye, I only ever played parts of two Bond games. My brother bought a game for the GameCube, was it "Agent Under Fire" maybe? And I played another one named something with "fire", also on the GameCube, I believe. After those two, which never caught my interest enough to play more than three to five hours, I gave up Bond games. I honestly believe I never again will be able to play a proper Bond game. Nightfire was a kind of okay early-6th gen FPS that was clearly just trying to be a back-to-basics shooter and emulate GoldenEye. There was also Everything or Nothing which was a genuinely interesting and ambitious third-person action game designed to play out like a movie that never was. The Bond games have definitely had their downs, but they've also had plenty of ups. A very interesting series, in my opinion.
Tamazoid Posted October 19, 2012 Posted October 19, 2012 I love how they turned Jynx white for Die Another Day in this game. Halle Berry is the worst thing that has happened to Bond.
Zechs Merquise Posted October 19, 2012 Posted October 19, 2012 Ultimately there's only been two really great Bond games and both of them have been Goldeneye and both of them have been on Nintendo systems. I know Goldeneye was also released on the PS3 and 360 but by all accounts it wasn't as good as the Wii version. There have been other decent Bond games namely The World is not Enough on the N64, Everything or Nothing and Nightfire on the PS2, XBOX and GC and finally Quantum of Solace on the Wii, 360 and PS3 was perfectly serviceable and enjoyable. From what I can see, 007 Legends fails due to the removal of much of stealthy game play that made the Goldeneye games so great. Plus, you always have to be suspicious when a game doesn't get any hands-on previews - it's usually because the publisher lacks confidence in the product.
Cube Posted October 19, 2012 Posted October 19, 2012 The World is not Enough is brilliant. I'd certainly put it above New GoldenEye.
are1981 Posted October 20, 2012 Posted October 20, 2012 Nightfire was a kind of okay early-6th gen FPS that was clearly just trying to be a back-to-basics shooter and emulate GoldenEye. There was also Everything or Nothing which was a genuinely interesting and ambitious third-person action game designed to play out like a movie that never was. The Bond games have definitely had their downs, but they've also had plenty of ups. A very interesting series, in my opinion. Yes, Nightfire! It was Nightfire. I never tried EON. (See what I did there?) Ultimately there's only been two really great Bond games and both of them have been Goldeneye and both of them have been on Nintendo systems. I know Goldeneye was also released on the PS3 and 360 but by all accounts it wasn't as good as the Wii version. There have been other decent Bond games namely The World is not Enough on the N64, Everything or Nothing and Nightfire on the PS2, XBOX and GC and finally Quantum of Solace on the Wii, 360 and PS3 was perfectly serviceable and enjoyable. From what I can see, 007 Legends fails due to the removal of much of stealthy game play that made the Goldeneye games so great. Plus, you always have to be suspicious when a game doesn't get any hands-on previews - it's usually because the publisher lacks confidence in the product. The World is not Enough? But the film was so... boring, lackluster. I just never bothered looking at the Bond games sharing title with a film I did not enjoy to a certain degree. I know Goldeneye was also released on the PS3 and 360 but by all accounts it wasn't as good as the Wii version. Eh, what? Why? How? The World is not Enough is brilliant. I'd certainly put it above New GoldenEye. So it seems I actually missed out on a few good Bond games then. I will take a look at the next in line, probably in a couple of years time. I guess it is a possibility it could turn out good.
Tamazoid Posted October 20, 2012 Posted October 20, 2012 The World is Not Enough PS1 is awful. the N64 version (developed by Eurocom ironically enough) is a great game, though I still prefer Goldeneye. I liked Agent Under Fire and Nightfire. Everything or Nothing is a pretty decent third person shooter as well, the co op is pretty enjoyable. Goldeneye Rogue Agent and From Russia with Love were both pretty mediocre though.
Zechs Merquise Posted October 20, 2012 Posted October 20, 2012 Eh, what? Why? How? Yep, Goldeneye was released on the Wii in 2010 and sold 1.7 million units. In 2011 Activision released an HD version called Goldeneye Reloaded for the PS3 and 360, however those versions were far less commercially successful selling less than a million combined.
Tamazoid Posted October 20, 2012 Posted October 20, 2012 I believe the complaints about the HD version of Goldeneye were that apparently the stealth sections were removed and it became much more like CoD. It has a worse metacritic rating than the Wii version so they must have screwed it up somehow.
are1981 Posted October 20, 2012 Posted October 20, 2012 (edited) Yep, Goldeneye was released on the Wii in 2010 and sold 1.7 million units. In 2011 Activision released an HD version called Goldeneye Reloaded for the PS3 and 360, however those versions were far less commercially successful selling less than a million combined. Sorry, I was ambiguous. I know of the game, both versions. But how is it possible Reloaded is actually worse? The PS3 version should play the same with Move. I believe the complaints about the HD version of Goldeneye were that apparently the stealth sections were removed and it became much more like CoD. It has a worse metacritic rating than the Wii version so they must have screwed it up somehow. ...And here is the explanation. Really? Stealth sections removed? How wise! It seems not as much GoldenEye Reloaded as GoldenEye Retarded then? Edited October 20, 2012 by are1981
Zechs Merquise Posted October 21, 2012 Posted October 21, 2012 Sorry, I was ambiguous. I know of the game, both versions. But how is it possible Reloaded is actually worse? The PS3 version should play the same with Move. ...And here is the explanation. Really? Stealth sections removed? How wise! It seems not as much GoldenEye Reloaded as GoldenEye Retarded then? It goes a little deeper than that. Nintendo had major hands on with the development and really helped Eurocom optimise the game for the Wii. They also helped with numerous other issues with the game (see end credits). This extra help went a long way to improving the game.
Tamazoid Posted October 21, 2012 Posted October 21, 2012 Nintendo should just buyout Eurocom and get the 007 license back. Doubt that will ever happen again sadly.
are1981 Posted October 21, 2012 Posted October 21, 2012 It goes a little deeper than that. Nintendo had major hands on with the development and really helped Eurocom optimise the game for the Wii. They also helped with numerous other issues with the game (see end credits). This extra help went a long way to improving the game. I see. I guess Nintendo helping out, in the end gained both parties. I hope they both earned more money because of it. Nintendo should just buyout Eurocom and get the 007 license back. Doubt that will ever happen again sadly. Ooo, yes! If Eurocom is a good developer constrained by publishers, Nintendo should come in and save them! Let them blossom!
Fierce_LiNk Posted October 21, 2012 Posted October 21, 2012 Nintendo should just buyout Eurocom and get the 007 license back. Doubt that will ever happen again sadly. If that ever did, it would be brilliant. If they really poured money, resources, time and attention into this, we would get something amazing. Add Wiimote controls, maybe using the WiiUpad as well (with a stand) to have an instant access to an arsenal of gadgets/explosive, etc, WiiU's power and graphical capabilities...God.
Captain Falcon Posted October 21, 2012 Posted October 21, 2012 (edited) It goes a little deeper than that. Nintendo had major hands on with the development and really helped Eurocom optimise the game for the Wii. They also helped with numerous other issues with the game (see end credits). This extra help went a long way to improving the game. Any chance you can elaborate on Nintendo's involvement on this? I remember seeing stories before release they were involved but no details were ever clarified. I just had a look at the credits and whilst it does mention "friends" at Nintendo, all the names listed are managerial types to do with testing, licencing, publishing and other such none development roles - no Nintendo employee gets a programming credit or anything remotely related. Eurocom had already shown they could squeeze some impressive results out of the machine with Dead Space so they were no slouch to begin with. Nintendo ultimately has to approve all games so that there was some communication between the two is understandable but I can't help but think the level of interaction might have been oversold to inspire confidence that this wouldn't be another Rogue Agent. Activision, through their development teams, know more about FPS games than Nintendo ever will and Treyarch had been flying the Wii FPS flag for some time. Nintendo are great at what they do but they don't do FPS and never have. Rare made Goldeneye, not Nintendo - they didn't even know it had a multiplayer mode such was their involvement. FYI, the stealth sections remain totally unchanged in the Reloaded release - not sure where the idea that they were changed stems from. Also, if you look at the average review scores, there isn't much between them really - 10 percentage points from both Metacritic and Gamesranking. Ultimately, Reloaded was a Wii port and whilst the title stood out quite easily on the shooter starved console, the upscaled graphics, mildly better textures and tweaked lighting wasn't enough to grab attention on machines that have been inundated with exceptionally high quality FPS games. Plus, the controls are just nice with a Remote than a normal Controller. Edited October 21, 2012 by Captain Falcon
Tamazoid Posted November 23, 2012 Posted November 23, 2012 Bad news for Eurocom and probably any faint hope that the Wii U version would be any better than the others. It seems that they've had to downsize to 50 people from their current 200 and are now focusing on mobile games. Only two years after the great Goldeneye Wii too. Activision has killed another decent developer, RIP Eurocom. Nintendo really needs to open a UK studio and snap up some of the talent that is floating around. http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2012-11-23-eurocom-forced-to-make-large-number-of-redundancies?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter
Dcubed Posted November 23, 2012 Posted November 23, 2012 Another one bites the dust. Very sad to see another longstanding developer go downhill like this Nintendo really needs to open a UK studio and snap up some of the talent that is floating around. Agreed wholeheartedly. There's an enormous amount of UK talent just going to waste right now. They'd do well to start up their own studio here in the UK and snap up the talent just lying around (all the better that a lot of ex Rareware staff are still here, they already had a working relationship!) Get them working on some exclusive titles that cover genres that their internal developers wouldn't want to cover!
welsh_gamer Posted December 4, 2012 Posted December 4, 2012 Looks like the Skyfall levels will be included on the disc for the Wii U release :-
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