Dannyboy-the-Dane Posted March 5, 2012 Posted March 5, 2012 I could put this in the funny stuff thread, but I'd actually rather put it here. Without a doubt the best article I've ever read on Cracked: 6 Things Rich People Need To Stop Saying
Charlie Posted March 5, 2012 Posted March 5, 2012 I could put this in the funny stuff thread, but I'd actually rather put it here. Without a doubt the best article I've ever read on Cracked: 6 Things Rich People Need To Stop Saying Before I read that I was thinking that the author of the article was going to seem incredibly bitter about life and reading it didn't change my mind. The number 1 point is just ridiculous and tops off a ridiculous article. I can't actually describe how much it annoys me. This is the senior editor of Cracked.com (a website which everyone other than me seems to love) so he must be doing well for himself. Of course people had help from their parents while they were growing up. An absolute joke of an article.
Dannyboy-the-Dane Posted March 5, 2012 Author Posted March 5, 2012 Really? I think he makes some of the most excellent points on the topic I've ever heard.
Charlie Posted March 5, 2012 Posted March 5, 2012 Really? I think he makes some of the most excellent points on the topic I've ever heard. I think what annoys me the most is that he's obviously painstakingly researched this article for hours to find quotes which match his points perfectly and make them all seem like assholes. All the rich people I know acknowledge they're incredibly lucky, whether it's being in the right place at the right time or being born into a wealthy family. Sure, if that one guy somehow also has the head for management and finance and the networking skills, he could maybe open his own chain of yacht repair shops. But they can't all do that. They could do exactly that if they wanted to. There's nothing stopping them putting a business plan together to get some funding from the bank. What's stopping them doing that is an entrepreneurial spirit; there might be too much risk etc. For every successful entrepreneur I'm betting there's at least 10 failed ones. To make money you have to take risks. You could argue that going to Uni is taking a risk. You're investing X amount and spending 3 or 4 years of your life learning about something which has no guarantees of a job at the end of it. Going to uni is a risk that a lot of people take. What he's doing is putting every rich person in the same category and that, to use his own word choice, is insulting.
bob Posted March 5, 2012 Posted March 5, 2012 I could put this in the funny stuff thread, but I'd actually rather put it here. Without a doubt the best article I've ever read on Cracked: 6 Things Rich People Need To Stop Saying You therefore won't have read this one: The 7 Most Useless Transformers Ever
Dannyboy-the-Dane Posted March 5, 2012 Author Posted March 5, 2012 Putting every rich person in the same category? Did you even read the article? He's clearly not hating on rich people, only the arrogant arseholes. You're expressing the same "you're your own luck's smith" mentality that I really can't stand. To some degree you're right, obviously, but it's extremely arrogant to assume that there's not a fuckton of luck involved in financial success - if nowhere else, then in the simple fact that you were born in a part of the world where it's even possible. George Monbiot said it best: "If wealth was the inevitable result of hard work and enterprise, every woman in Africa would be a millionaire."
Charlie Posted March 5, 2012 Posted March 5, 2012 (edited) You're expressing the same "you're your own luck's smith" mentality that I really can't stand. Really? Where? I even said that rich people I know acknowledge their own luck. Another point I think is worth noting is one which is rather common in the UK. People who are on benefits yet still have enough money for a fancy smartphone and Sky television. If these people decided not to spend a large sum of money on unnecessary expenses would they have the chance to increase their wealth (and not just by saving money)? Of course they could. What I think is that all entrepreneurs have something in common; a willingness to undertake risk. Yes, there's obviously a degree of luck but I think the major factor is a willingness to try. And not only that; you can't put everything down to luck. Would you say that Alan Sugar 'lucked out' because he managed to find someone to sell his products to on his first ever day selling on the street? He worked bloody hard to sell his products. If you start calling things like that luck then there's no stopping it. The concept of 'luck' is something that a lot of people fall back on when things aren't going their way. Is a player hitting the crossbar and the ball flying out of play in football unlucky? No - he didn't strike it correctly and it didn't hit the target. No luck involved. If he hit a better shot then it would've gone in. If a small business secures a large contract which substantially increases the size of their business lucky? No, they put in the effort and deserved the contract. Edited March 5, 2012 by Charlie
Charlie Posted March 5, 2012 Posted March 5, 2012 Charlie is the 1%. Hardly, I wouldn't say I'm rich in the slightest. I'm just not part of the other 1% (1% rich, 98% 'normal', 1% bitter) who think life is unfair and everyone is out to get them.
Dannyboy-the-Dane Posted March 5, 2012 Author Posted March 5, 2012 (edited) Really? Where? Right here: What I think is that all entrepreneurs have something in common; a willingness to undertake risk. Yes, there's obviously a degree of luck but I think the major factor is a willingness to try. Obviously risk-taking is part of it, but I think you're overestimating the skill and perseverance involved and hugely underestimating the luck. Here's the article by George Monbiot from which the earlier quote is taken. He cites some interesting finds, which, while they do seem a bit extreme, reflect what I have long suspected to be true: that financial success today is mostly about luck and coincidence. And not only that; you can't put everything down to luck. Would you say that Alan Sugar 'lucked out' because he managed to find someone to sell his products to on his first ever day selling on the street? He worked bloody hard to sell his products. If you start calling things like that luck then there's no stopping it. The concept of 'luck' is something that a lot of people fall back on when things aren't going their way. Is a player hitting the crossbar and the ball flying out of play in football unlucky? No - he didn't strike it correctly and it didn't hit the target. No luck involved. If he hit a better shot then it would've gone in. I'm not putting everything down to luck, obviously. I'm not saying you don't need skills and perseverance, I'm saying you need a lot of luck in addition to those things to be successful. Which is why I can't stand it when success and wealth becomes the gauge on which your worth is measured, and when people look down on poor people and claim it's their own fault for not trying hard enough. Edited March 5, 2012 by Dannyboy-the-Dane Automerged Doublepost
Magnus Posted March 5, 2012 Posted March 5, 2012 Hardly, I wouldn't say I'm rich in the slightest. I'm just not part of the other 1% (1% rich, 98% 'normal', 1% bitter) who think life is unfair and everyone is out to get them. That just makes you one of those rich people who complain about not being rich. :p
Charlie Posted March 5, 2012 Posted March 5, 2012 Which is why I can't stand it when success and wealth becomes the gauge on which your worth is measured, and when people look down on poor people and claim it's their own fault for not trying hard enough. I really admire poor people who try really hard to make a living for them and their families and often come out and say it (although never here, it's never come up). I actually admire these people just as much, if not more so, than other people or groups who tend to be the ones admired in society. These are the guys who are working extremely hard and go about it without complaining. Of course they'd like more money (who doesn't?) but they aren't whinging about people who are successful. Then on the opposite end of the spectrum you get guys who are working the same jobs as the aforementioned group and complaining that they don't have enough money, that the rich are too rich etc. The vast majority aren't even doing anything to try and change it and there's absolutely nothing stopping them from setting up their own business.
Dannyboy-the-Dane Posted March 5, 2012 Author Posted March 5, 2012 Far from everyone is capable of setting up their own businesses. True, some are just complaining and not trying to do anything about it, but the point here is that the idea that everyone could become successful if they wanted is bullshit. Besides, this isn't about complaining about rich people being too rich (at least not for me). There are numerous elements to this, but jealousy is not one of them, nor is thirst for persecution.
Charlie Posted March 5, 2012 Posted March 5, 2012 Why isn't everyone capable of setting up their own business? What's stopping them?
Diageo Posted March 5, 2012 Posted March 5, 2012 Lack of money, lack of credit, lack of confidence, lack of skill, lack of knowledge, lack of luck, lack of facilities, lack of opportunities, lack of interest. ETC.
Ellmeister Posted March 5, 2012 Posted March 5, 2012 Far from everyone is capable of setting up their own businesses. True, some are just complaining and not trying to do anything about it, but the point here is that the idea that everyone could become successful if they wanted is bullshit. Besides, this isn't about complaining about rich people being too rich (at least not for me). There are numerous elements to this, but jealousy is not one of them, nor is thirst for persecution. I fail to see why you believe in the article's story so much then. As much as it makes me feel sick to say this, I agree with Charlie, mostly.
Dannyboy-the-Dane Posted March 5, 2012 Author Posted March 5, 2012 Lack of skills, lack of finances, lack of a market where a small business has a chance in hell of ever being successful unless it gets very lucky. Everyone can become successful in theory, but realistically very few even get the chance, yet people berate the unsuccessful and claim it's their own fault.
Dannyboy-the-Dane Posted March 5, 2012 Author Posted March 5, 2012 I fail to see why you believe in the article's story so much then. As much as it makes me feel sick to say this, I agree with Charlie, mostly. The Cracked article? Why wouldn't I? It highlights exactly why this isn't just about jealousy and why the arguments often heard from rich arseholes are flawed.
Ellmeister Posted March 5, 2012 Posted March 5, 2012 Lack of skills, lack of finances, lack of a market where a small business has a chance in hell of ever being successful unless it gets very lucky. Everyone can become successful in theory, but realistically very few even get the chance, yet people berate the unsuccessful and claim it's their own fault. People berate the few successful businesses according to your theory as well!
Dannyboy-the-Dane Posted March 5, 2012 Author Posted March 5, 2012 People berate the few successful businesses according to your theory as well! Well, yes, but obviously not the same people. Apologies for using too general a noun to refer to different groups.
Charlie Posted March 5, 2012 Posted March 5, 2012 Lack of money, lack of credit, lack of confidence, lack of skill, lack of knowledge, lack of luck, lack of facilities, lack of opportunities, lack of interest. ETC. None of those are real barriers to entry. Confidence, skills, knowledge are all things that can be gained. Money? You can start a business with zero capital, yeah it's hard, but can be done. I've done it with my web design. Zero input in terms of money and I haves few clients now. All of which was done on the side while working another job. If they aren't interested then they have absolutely no right to complain.
Dannyboy-the-Dane Posted March 5, 2012 Author Posted March 5, 2012 Again: Yes, in theory. But realistically it's damn difficult and still requires a lot of luck, which is why it's neither realistic nor fair to claim it's the poor people's own fault that they're poor.
heroicjanitor Posted March 5, 2012 Posted March 5, 2012 Not saying it's poor people's own fault, I just got the impression from the article that people like doctors don't deserve more money than others, it lumps them in with the rich people manipulating the stock markets.
Dannyboy-the-Dane Posted March 5, 2012 Author Posted March 5, 2012 Oh, that's definitely not the impression I got. I'd rather not go into a debate how much money the different jobs deserve.
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