So why are you Racist?

[MoogleViper]

I fail to see how racism is 'legitimate'. The Black people in your country got captured in Africa, bundled and Fedex'd to the Americas. They worked the plantations whilst getting bull-whipped or extraordinarily abused in some other way, I strongly believe it is their work that built up the economy of America and much of the western World to the level it is today...Then their freedom came and what did they get? KKK members hunting them like prized game and 'Whites Only' hospitality...All for WHAT? What did these people ever do to them but do as they were told? White people did nothing to honour the labour of these guys. These are the grass roots of the racism in America - how are they legitimate? You seem to symphasise with racists? Why?

 

I'm not accusing you of this but your post reminded me of it. I hate it when black people use the race card or the slavery card. Some people use it as a get-otu-of-jail free card or a instant argument win card. And has anybody noticed that 90% of black comedians' joke are about racism? I watched this black guy on Have I got news for you (can't remember his name) and then he was also on Live at the Apollo. He started his act with some jokes about growing up in London being black and being a "nigger" in school. And it was funny at first but his whole routine was about racism. And I've noticed it with other black comedians. Ok it's funny up to a point but change the tune. And surely they are just reinforcing this "barrier" between black and white people by constantly going on about it. That's why I think the law against racism creates a lot of racism. It creates a sense of "us and them".

 

Has anybody seen "Shoot the Messenger"? It was on sometime last year and was about a black teacher who kept giving black students detention to try and give them extra lessons. But then all of the black people started calling him racist and he went off the rails. It was really good and explored issues such as how black people staying together in one community prevents them from getting good jobs and stuff.

[Pete]

I love the way I'm being called short sighted by the person who obviously can't read... I suggested he work for less money so he can keep his job so that, um, he can keep his job!

 

The employers may be arsewipes, but that's their problem. They'll do what they can to save money, as long as it's within the law (although some go beyond that from time to time...), and I can understand why they are doing it, but that doesn't mean I agree with it.

 

Most importantly, I say "well done" to the immigrants. They're willing to work for less money than other people, yet they demonstrate time and time again that they are as good as, if not better at their jobs than those they replace. They deserve the full amount, if not more. Unfortunately, the companies don't see it that way. If you don't want to get replaced at work, make yourself a valued employee.

 

Ok we'll put the insult to one side (by the way I fully undertood your comment) You know at the end of day I dont think either of us are 'the bad guy' here but I think we may be on very different pages on some issues here but hey thats fair enough, thats life.

 

I dont like exploitation of anyone simply as that, Im sure we are agree on that.

[The fish]

I dont like exploitation of anyone simply as that, Im sure we are agree on that.

 

I agree, it's horrifically unfair. However, most companies don't give two shits about fairness, and just want money. It's a system that is unfortunately here to stay, so it simply has to be integrated into.

[M-PG71C]

It seems you'er right about you being an American - the closed minded view suggests you are.

It's not a case of work for less, it's a case of be a better worker that the people who are willing to work for less. If you're not a better worker, than be prepared to get paid less. The American workforce gets more holidays (the same we do, along with 4th July, President's Day, Thanksgiving), more pay, relative to prices, by quite a substantial chunk, and the need for weapons show insecurity. :wink:

 

No, war is often for the purpose of driving economics when you want to have both ends of the trading chain. However, there are exceptions. Look at the Falklands. Look at Kosovo.

 

What a bunch of a crap, there are close minded people in every single section of society. Maybe you haven't stepped outside of your own country, but I've been around the world and seen it for myself. America may be filled with plenty of ignorants, but the same applies to Great Britan, Japan, ROK, Germany, you name it, they have it and plenty of them. Where you live is not an indication of your worldly knowledge or lackof.

 

Now I can't speak on what immigrants do on your behalf, but over here, the grand majority of them are lazy, the Mexicans anyway. Everyone else doesn't apply in my own personal experience. But anyway, we pay them less BECAUSE WE EXPECT LESS FROM THEM. They don't know the English language, they speak varations of the Spanish language. Communcation is difficult as hell, especially if they are working in the service sector. They always use their cultural background as an excuse rather than use it as something that can benefit them. In return, we pay them less because that is what they do. That is what they demonstrate in job interviews, even as simple as Mickey D's.

 

Not to say all of them are like that, there are a number of immigrants who do work harder than people in this country and they damn right deserve more pay. My own mom is an IMMIGRANT, she is Korean. She has busted her ass in her life and she was able to make far more money than many of the people who live in my country. How much you get paid should be an indictation of how much work you do. While I can't speak on your behalf that is how it works over here. The amount of work you put in is exactly what you are going to get out of it.

 

And I would certainly know this first hand because I know how it is like to be poor just as much as I know what it is like to live in the professional class.

[The fish]

What a bunch of a crap, there are close minded people in every single section of society. Maybe you haven't stepped outside of your own country, but I've been around the world and seen it for myself. America may be filled with plenty of ignorants, but the same applies to Great Britan, Japan, ROK, Germany, you name it, they have it and plenty of them. Where you live is not an indication of your worldly knowledge or lackof.

 

Now I can't speak on what immigrants do on your behalf, but over here, the grand majority of them are lazy, the Mexicans anyway. Everyone else doesn't apply in my own personal experience. But anyway, we pay them less BECAUSE WE EXPECT LESS FROM THEM. They don't know the English language, they speak varations of the Spanish language. Communcation is difficult as hell, especially if they are working in the service sector. They always use their cultural background as an excuse rather than use it as something that can benefit them. In return, we pay them less because that is what they do. That is what they demonstrate in job interviews, even as simple as Mickey D's.

 

Not to say all of them are like that, there are a number of immigrants who do work harder than people in this country and they damn right deserve more pay. My own mom is an IMMIGRANT, she is Korean. She has busted her ass in her life and she was able to make far more money than many of the people who live in my country. How much you get paid should be an indictation of how much work you do. While I can't speak on your behalf that is how it works over here. The amount of work you put in is exactly what you are going to get out of it.

 

And I would certainly know this first hand because I know how it is like to be poor just as much as I know what it is like to live in the professional class.

 

Over there, the most discussed immigrants are those from within the EU, especially Poles. Time and again, they have demonstrated that they do work better, more efficiently, and, in some cases, speak better English... They deserve better pay than they get, but I haven't heard them bitching about it. Most immigrants from outside the EU are, normally, good quality workers. I'd rather have a person who speaks slightly broken English do some plumbing/building work in less time at a higher standard for less money than some home-grown rip-off merchant.

[M-PG71C]

I fail to see how racism is 'legitimate'. The Black people in your country got captured in Africa, bundled and Fedex'd to the Americas. They worked the plantations whilst getting bull-whipped or extraordinarily abused in some other way, I strongly believe it is their work that built up the economy of America and much of the western World to the level it is today...Then their freedom came and what did they get? KKK members hunting them like prized game and 'Whites Only' hospitality...All for WHAT? What did these people ever do to them but do as they were told? White people did nothing to honour the labour of these guys. These are the grass roots of the racism in America - how are they legitimate? You seem to symphasise with racists? Why?

 

Let me quote myself:

 

...most of the time, its roots are fairly legitimate however sad that it happens.

 

Keyword: Most of the time. America is a prime exception of the rule. We didn't do anything to African Americans and they certainly didn't do anything to us. We used them as tools for our own gain and that is wrong, plain and simple. There were no singificiant roots or anything, they were easy exploits. What was worse is that they tried to justify what they did but I digress.

 

I don't sympathize for them, I never said it was right or justified. I did say I can understand why racism happens and how some of it can be legitimate, especially through a sociological/psychological level. But leigitimate does not mean right though, there is always a historical background on why people may hate other people. It can because they were oppressed for years (For example, older generation Koreans absolutely hate the Japanese for what they did to them throughout their lives. They forgive them, certainly, but forgive does not mean forget and it is that pain that leads to absolute hate. But where does that leave me, I am a Korean. I don't hate the Japanese at all, frankly I like them quite a bit. But I can understand why the older generation hates them).

 

Everything I state has some personal experience tied to it. If you are going to patronize me, do it to me on a more personal level rather than sticking my country towards me.

[The fish]

They forgive them, certainly, but forgive does not mean forget and it is that pain that leads to absolute hate. But where does that leave me, I am a Korean. I don't hate the Japanese at all, frankly I like them quite a bit. But I can understand why the older generation hates them).

 

I can't understand why the older generation still hate them. If every Japanese man, woman, and child currently saw it as their duty to make life shite for Koreans, then fair enough. But they don't, and never did.

 

It's a shame that we inherit the sins of our fathers, even when they're aren't necessarily there...

[Blackfox]

I love the way I'm being called short sighted by the person who obviously can't read... I suggested he work for less money so he can keep his job so that, um, he can keep his job!

 

The employers may be arsewipes, but that's their problem. They'll do what they can to save money, as long as it's within the law (although some go beyond that from time to time...), and I can understand why they are doing it, but that doesn't mean I agree with it.

 

Most importantly, I say "well done" to the immigrants. They're willing to work for less money than other people, yet they demonstrate time and time again that they are as good as, if not better at their jobs than those they replace. They deserve the full amount, if not more. Unfortunately, the companies don't see it that way. If you don't want to get replaced at work, make yourself a valued employee.

 

You really believe that? As I understand it, this guy was replaced by someone who was willing to work for less, and he should have accepted lower pay to save this job? That's utter bullshit. What a greedy little company to do that. It s nothing to do with skill levels, just pure greed/more profits. He shouldn't have to do that at all.

 

For what its worth I say hello and smile to all my Tesco cashiers ^^...and offer a little wink to those cute ladies that ask if I have a clubcard. XD

 

I used to love that when people were polite to me when I was part of the checkout massive. It brightens your day when someone does that, so on behalf of checkouts monkeys everywhere

 

I'm not accusing you of this but your post reminded me of it. I hate it when black people use the race card or the slavery card. Some people use it as a get-otu-of-jail free card or a instant argument win card. And has anybody noticed that 90% of black comedians' joke are about racism? I watched this black guy on Have I got news for you (can't remember his name) and then he was also on Live at the Apollo. He started his act with some jokes about growing up in London being black and being a "nigger" in school. And it was funny at first but his whole routine was about racism. And I've noticed it with other black comedians. Ok it's funny up to a point but change the tune. And surely they are just reinforcing this "barrier" between black and white people by constantly going on about it. That's why I think the law against racism creates a lot of racism. It creates a sense of "us and them".

 

 

I can't say if I notice if every black comedian does it - but that guy played on it for the whole act, and it was still quite shitty.

[M-PG71C]

Over there, the most discussed immigrants are those from within the EU, especially Poles. Time and again, they have demonstrated that they do work better, more efficiently, and, in some cases, speak better English... They deserve better pay than they get, but I haven't heard them bitching about it. Most immigrants from outside the EU are, normally, good quality workers. I'd rather have a person who speaks slightly broken English do some plumbing/building work in less time at a higher standard for less money than some home-grown rip-off merchant.

 

That is because what they are getting is probably a lot better than what they have recieved in the past. That won't last forever though, eventually they will want more. People always want to strive for better and even when they reach a new level of that, they go on ahead and strive for even something higher. That is how it works, I live in a family of it. : peace:

 

And frankly, that IS a good thing in a lot of respects. Because it still goes with the whole thing I stated earlier, people don't settle for less. Even those Poles are not settling for less, that is why they went and took those jobs. It is something better for them and they want it just as much as anyone else.

 

Of course....that creates competition. If someone who lives in that country is not willing to work as equally as hard as somebody who is getting paid less, than he or she needs to get a serious reality check. More pay should drive your motiviation to work harder, not less so than someone getting paid worse. So I agree with you there. Also, thanks for filling me in, LOL!

 

Over here, we have Mexicans. A lot of them don't speak broken English, they just don't speak English. Even worse, they fully expect everybody around them to speak Spanish, which pisses a lot of people off. Not to say all Mexicans are like that, I've worked with some that can speak English, however broken it is enough so to where you can understand them. They also work hard and I like that because I work hard, I like to get my job finished up so I can leave or pursue something else.

 

Generally speaking, on a personal level, I could care less if it is immigrant or a person who was born in my country. If the person works hard, all to them and I hope they get exactly what they deserve, higher pay and a better life.

[The fish]

You really believe that? As I understand it, this guy was replaced by someone who was willing to work for less, and he should have accepted lower pay to save this job? That's utter bullshit. What a greedy little company to do that. It s nothing to do with skill levels, just pure greed/more profits. He shouldn't have to do that at all.

 

Oh no, he shouldn't have to. However, it's what must be done if you want to keep your job. Either that or you find a way to make companies less selfish, but good luck with that...

[M-PG71C]

I can't understand why the older generation still hate them. If every Japanese man, woman, and child currently saw it as their duty to make life shite for Koreans, then fair enough. But they don't, and never did.

 

It's a shame that we inherit the sins of our fathers, even when they're aren't necessarily there...

 

You don't understand my people's history, that is why it is hard for you to understand it. The older generation want an apology and they have been asking for it since the end of World War II. They want an apology for stealing their historical works, they want an apology for the tons of Japanese soliders who raped Korean women, they want an apology for the years of oppression of the country. That is all they want, an apology and they have never gotten it. While it doesn't affect me at all, I can see why they want it. This is like if America all of a sudden went into Great Britan, oppressed it for a couple hundred years, allowed its soliders to have its way with women of it, claimed certain historical works ours because we can put our hands to it, and end up killing hundreds of thousands of people because we're able to.

 

And then after we leave and regime change occurs, we pretend nothing happened whatsoever. That would be BS in every single respects.

 

The politics between the two countries, EVEN TODAY, are still going about this one issue. Should the Japanese apologize to the Koreans?

 

EDIT: That was a little harsher than it should have been honestly, I take back that former comment.

[The fish]

And then after we leave and regime change occurs, we pretend nothing happened whatsoever. That would be BS in every single respects.

 

The politics between the two countries, EVEN TODAY, are still going about this one issue. Should the Japanese apologize to the Koreans?

 

You don't know a damn thing about my people, don't try to act like an expert about it.

 

What should they apologise for? An apology from someone who is not the perpetrator is worthless. Why should the current generation in Japan inherit the sins of their fathers?

 

In fact, getting back on topic, by presuming that the Japanese are seen as responsible for what a prior generation has done, then that is racism. It presumes they are all raping, murdering, imperialists.

[Blackfox]

Oh no, he shouldn't have to. However, it's what must be done if you want to keep your job. Either that or you find a way to make companies less selfish, but good luck with that...

 

Why people should join the Unions. I wouldn't accept less, neither would the Unions.

[The fish]

Why people should join the Unions. I wouldn't accept less, neither would the Unions.

 

I know, but they haven't, have they? Union's are there for a reason, and yet people obviously don't join them.

[M-PG71C]

What should they apologise for? An apology from someone who is not the perpetrator is worthless. Why should the current generation in Japan inherit the sins of their fathers?

 

If we have to go this way, why should current day America pay for the sins of their previous generation's racism and slavery?

 

Because what my country did IS wrong and even though that generation is long past, that doesn't mean we should forget about it or disregard it. It should mean we learn from it, pay our respects to those who suffered from it, apologize for it and offer what we can to help that specfic generation come to peace. Something as simple as words can solve so many problems.

 

Words cost nothing yet solve the most problems. I promise you if that if an apology was never issued, African-Americans today would still be protesting and rioting on the streets and rightfully so.

[Apple_NdiB]

I think apologies are appropriate if the country in question is still reaping the benefits of its mistreatment (I don't know enough about the Japan/Korea situation to say whether that's the case there).

[M-PG71C]

I think apologies are appropriate if the country in question is still reaping the benefits of its mistreatment (I don't know enough about the Japan/Korea situation to say whether that's the case there).

 

I can agree to that in a lot of respects. In this specfic case, there has been a lot of debate on historical/artistic works from between the two countries. The argument states that Japan, when they took over Korea, took many of its art works and claimed it as their own. I don't know enough about the specfic works of art, I remember my history professor talking about it extensively. The debate has so far leaned towards Korea because they were able to show where the works came from and from who.

 

However, Japan hasn't anwsered anything in direct relation to it. Even my political science advisor, who is Japanese, finds it in belief that the country took the works as their own and now they don't want to give it back even if there is proof.

 

It is a significant argument, not enough so to where it could cause political troubles between the two countries, but it is still being widely debated.

 

But that is not my fight because for starters, I'm not an expert in art let alone Korean/Japanese art. I'll be the first to admit, if I don't know enough about a certain subject, I will state just that. I'm not that arrogant, LOL! :P

[Apple_NdiB]

Since you're American could I apologise on behalf of my country for the atrocities commited against you on the Youtube comment section. The shame runs deep.

[The fish]

I can agree to that in a lot of respects. In this specfic case, there has been a lot of debate on historical/artistic works from between the two countries. The argument states that Japan, when they took over Korea, took many of its art works and claimed it as their own. I don't know enough about the specfic works of art, I remember my history professor talking about it extensively. The debate has so far leaned towards Korea because they were able to show where the works came from and from who.

 

I agree without hesertation that the Japanese should return the pieces of art, and apologise for not returning the sooner. More than that, I'm unsure.

 

Also, @M-PG71C, check your PM inbox.

 

Since you're American could I apologise on behalf of my country for the atrocities commited against you on the Youtube comment section. The shame runs deep.

 

Fuck me, that's an awesome analogy! *steals*

[M-PG71C]

Since you're American could I apologise on behalf of my country for the atrocities commited against you on the Youtube comment section. The shame runs deep.

 

Certainly and while we're at it, allow me to apologize on behalf of George W Bush. The name alone has taken out thirty countries in itself and anything he does ends up only worse.

[Tellyn]

I'm not racist. The only 'kind' I hate is chavs from past experiences.

[DCK]

...most of the time, its roots are fairly legitimate however sad that it happens.

I fail to see how you could think that the systematic hatred against an entire ethnicity could ever be legitimate. Being closed minded and ignorant is never legitimate, especially not when it outs itself in racism.

[MoogleViper]

So if your grandfather commited a crime, should you be held responsible for it?

[Falcon_BlizZACK]

So if your grandfather commited a crime, should you be held responsible for it?

 

If the crime your grandfather committed is benficial to his descendants in anyway - yes. For example stealing pieces of art.

 

Since you're American could I apologise on behalf of my country for the atrocities commited against you on the Youtube comment section. The shame runs deep.

 

hahaha...Genious. : peace:

[MoogleViper]

If the crime your grandfather committed is benficial to his descendants in anyway - yes. For example stealing pieces of art.

 

That's bollocks. Why should I pay for a crime my ancestors caused that is in no way related to me?