Zechs Merquise Posted October 25, 2007 Author Posted October 25, 2007 FACT ONE: for two generations Nintendo wasn't the king of the home console market. FACT TWO the Wii has broadened the market and re-engaged many with gaming who have not touched a console since the days of the SNES FACT THREE the Wii is outselling all other home consoles even when one of them has had a major price cut FACT FOUR this is a Nintendo board where Nintendo fans come to celebrate things like the revival of Nintendo's fortunes in the home console market FACT FIVE I'm a massive Nintendo fan and have been since I was 7, i've been playing Nintendo games since then and have always loved Nintendo - I'm not ashamed of this and if people want to label me a fan boy I don't care The last generation was awful for Nintendo in terms of sales and public reception to Nintendo a a brand and as a company. Things have changed and are still changing. I'm happy because of that. In every market place there will be winners and losers, and if PS3 loses out so be it. SONY have had a strangle hold on the market for two generations and finally Nintendo have come and brought something new to the table that's blowinng people away.
Owen Posted October 25, 2007 Posted October 25, 2007 All fair points. Agreed. That was a much more mature way of putting your view across as well Zech's.
Falcon_BlizZACK Posted October 25, 2007 Posted October 25, 2007 Man...This is sad. I was reading these comments then suddenly thought "why the f*** am I sitting here watching (supposedly) adults defend consoles?" Seriously, what do these companies really do for you to gain such loyalty? I also agree that most of you bought your Wiis for the future; in the spring, you were most probably harping on about games coming out in the winter, in the autumn you're still saying the same thing. The two top games on the Wii were not even native to the system, then Nintendo offers low standards with games like S.Paper Mario that would have been great if it was anything like its predecessors. Based on software quality and standards, imo, Nintendo does not deserve these Wii sells. What pretty much annoys me is how (some) Nintendo fans are ready to label the PS3 as 'horrible' and such, but when another calls the Wii such you all use the "Wii has been out for under a year" card...So what, how long has the PS3 been out for? If you lot are geniune gamers; PEOPLE WHO LOVE PLAYING GAMES! You would appreciate all consoles for what they would offer, but not here, here you got this ignorant Nintendo pride...Look at this topic title, ain't this just fanboy service? "AND WII STILL SELLS MOOOORE!!!!!111!". One theory why the Wii could be selling more than the PS3: It is almost/was about half as cheap, with inferior technical capabilities. For what the PS3 offers, even though I was not into it, it is WELL worth it. But can you surely say the same for the Wii? Sure the Wii is 'cheap' but that probably only disguises how over-priced it probably is. I have yet to see anything as visually astounding on the Wii as Gamecube LAUNCH games like Rogue Leader, Wave Race and even Luigi's Mansion...So the chip/processor in the Wii can't be that advanced than the GC's. And material-wise, the Wii looks pretty cheap. Then theres the VC games...another story perhaps. I know this is a Nintendo forum, but there is a clear difference from being a Nintendo fan and a Nintendo extremist! I can understand being a long term fan but some of you are posting like you work in the Nintendo Logistics Department with all this talk of "attach rates" and the like...Are you Nintendo consumers or Nintendo employees? And how much is Nintendo paying you?
Patch Posted October 25, 2007 Posted October 25, 2007 FACT FOUR this is a Nintendo board where Nintendo fans come to celebrate things like the revival of Nintendo's fortunes in the home console market Nicely put. That has earned a special place in my heart. More unbiased discussions belong to non-specific sites such as neogaf. Maybe, you haven't been around for long enough, but this is Choze, ignoring his posts is the right thing to do. Ah, OK. My bad.
Hellfire Posted October 25, 2007 Posted October 25, 2007 Can't be bothered answering your post King lol You raise some valid points, but most of them, no, not really.
Blue_Ninja0 Posted October 25, 2007 Posted October 25, 2007 then Nintendo offers low standards with games like S.Paper Mario that would have been great if it was anything like its predecessors. Err... what?? Super Paper Mario?? Low standards?? oh boy... I have yet to see anything as visually astounding on the Wii as Gamecube LAUNCH games like Rogue Leader, Wave Race and even Luigi's Mansion...So the chip/processor in the Wii can't be that advanced than the GC's. And material-wise, the Wii looks pretty cheap. Then theres the VC games...another story perhaps. Twilight Princess, Super Mario Galaxy, Super Smash Bros Brawl and Metroid Prime 3 don't count right? And TP was even a GC game.
Tellyn Posted October 25, 2007 Posted October 25, 2007 And material-wise, the Wii looks pretty cheap. I decided to only highlight this part of your post because most of the other stuff has already been addressed (I don't get why you're even on a Nintendo forum if you clearly don't like the consoles that much. You're always going to get bias here so don't complain). Anyway this bit reminded me of my friend who stated his reason for not getting a Wii as: "It has no curves."
Falcon_BlizZACK Posted October 25, 2007 Posted October 25, 2007 I decided to only highlight this part of your post because most of the other stuff has already been addressed (I don't get why you're even on a Nintendo forum if you clearly don't like the consoles that much. You're always going to get bias here so don't complain). Anyway this bit reminded me of my friend who stated his reason for not getting a Wii as: "It has no curves." Thats silly. This is where you and others make the mistake, I took the effort to sign up to a Nintendo forum and view the updates because...dum....dum...DUMMMM!...I am a fan of Nintendo. But Nintendo are not perfect, and so naturally there HAS to be something to criticize, and I do scorn any half-assery just as much as I will praise the good stuff. But most of you praise Nintendo up high and avoid its faults. Anyway, to the point, yes, I feel at present Nintendo does not deserve the high sells its been getting, why? Because of a lack of decent games. My opinion, your opinion, cry, swear, bark whatever...Move on. And yes, the material used to create the Wii is cheap compared to the others. I used this example to highlight the production costs of the Wii and not as a low-blow. Err... what??Super Paper Mario?? Low standards?? oh boy... Twilight Princess, Super Mario Galaxy, Super Smash Bros Brawl and Metroid Prime 3 don't count right? And TP was even a GC game. Oh Boy?...I'm guessing you actually enjoyed SMP...o_O...fair dos. If you can't see that SMP is no where near as good as its predecessors, then I will end this with a o_O! AGAIN, Galaxy, Brawl are all FUTURE titles, I am talking about NOW!! The present, Mr Nakamura. Corruption is not so far advanced than Prime 2...Which again highlights the production cost point I was making; the chip used in the Wii is not THAT different/special/advanced to the Gamecube chip - it is not a great technological leap, therefore it shouldn't cost that much to use. Can't be bothered answering your post King lol ...Maybe because you realise my valid points, your highness.
Hellfire Posted October 25, 2007 Posted October 25, 2007 ...Maybe because you realise my valid points, your highness. The valid points you raise are that no one owes alligience to any console. The rest is bull. We've already seen games that couldn't be don on GC. I'm not even talking about Mario Galaxy and Metroid Prime 3, even Excite Truck, that at first glance doesn't look to be fantastic graphically couldn't be done on GC. Lots of particle effects, lots of cars running arround and crashing terrain deformation all of that couldn't be done on GC running fluidly. Factor 5, which is one of the best companies in terms of graphics already said that Wii can do MUCH MUCH better than GC, just that companies aren't taking advantage of it. Also, Wii doesn't have quality? Let's see, you have much better assistance and quality assurance than either 360 that's breaking all the time or PS3 which has the fantastic track record of quality shown with PS2 and PSP. My Wii is beautiful, the materials aren't cheap in any way, it doesn't overheat, it's small and it's silent. That's quality. Wii is overpriced? Funny, because you have to pay more for a 360, that admittedly, has better hardware, but then again, you'll need an HDTV. Oh and wi-fi? Oops, have to buy an adaptor! Want storage? Well, buy the more expensive version or an overpriced memory card, but then, you won't be able to do much with all trailers and live content and whatnot. It's HD! High quality! HDMI? Buy the Elite version. PS3? They dropped the 60 GB and sell only the 40 GB which doesnt even allow BC and market it as a price drop. Also, 70 € games. Awesome stuff. Realise this: these are companies running a business, Nintendo could lower the price, sure, we'd be happier, but a new console for less than 250€? Would be viewed as a crappy toy. Not to mention there's a thing called profit. It's useful for them too. We keep waiting for games. Interesting, my favourite game ever came out on THE LAUNCH DAY. There are also the likes of Excite Truck, Trauma Center,Sonic, Wario Ware, Rayman, Scarface, Godfather, Mario Strikers, Zack and Wiki, MP3, SPM Mario Galaxy, Dewey, Eledees, Mercury Meltdown and some more games that I enjoy a lot. In one year. Metroid is out tomorrow and Mario in a few weeks don't say they don't count. Also, only people that aren't minimally savy can say that MP3 is a small leap graphically from MP2. Your eyes are so used to seeing HD games that you can't even judge SD games fairly. MP3 has a totally new graphic engine, uses bloom, has great textures, a very high poly count, fantastic particule effects, bigger and more enemies on the screen at the same time always with a fluid framerate. Not to mention much bigger environments. Don't talk about graphical leaps when you have no idea what you're talking about, I'm no tech geek, but I know one thing or two and I can notice a huge difference and I talked with guys that know a lot about graphics and hardware and they say the same. Wanna know what interests me in 360 for now? Dead Rising and Halo 3. Probably missing something, but mainly everything is on the PC. It's not a matter of brand loyalty it's a matter of taste. If my main interest was racing games, I would have bought a 360 for PGR and Forza. Also, SPM is an amazing game, but most people were expecting a Paper Mario sequel and had such incredibely high expectations that it was impossible not to be let down (i.e seeing people saying the game would be the 2nd coming of Jesus). And that's the problem with all the supposed Nintendo fans. You put Nintendo in a totally different standard than other companies and judge them under totally different lights, always expecting more and more and more, independently of what they do.
Falcon_BlizZACK Posted October 25, 2007 Posted October 25, 2007 Thats hilarious man...Can't stop LMAO!...You are obviously digging deeep to shine the Wii in a better light...Well, fair enough, I won't argue with your interests, it is pretty low that you have to stoop to near personal insults to get your point across though..."Your eyes are so used to seeing HD games that you can't even judge SD games fairly."...Right., so where the fuck did I compare MP3 with an HD game? I won't argue with you because its pretty much like talking to a brick wall; you don't listen or pay attention to what is being said. But you highlight my point; whenever you and a few other Wii owners pull out a list of your 'favourite' Wii games, you always have to pull out Galaxy, MP3 and all those others games that are not released yet or that you haven't even played. If you feel 100% satisified with what the Wii has offered so far and argue that it is better than what the 360 offers, then good for you, I and many others however are not and that is why I do not see how and why the Wii should be selling at such high proportions. That is all. Give me one ice breaking, critical, super effective reason why Wii deserves all these sells.
Cube Posted October 25, 2007 Posted October 25, 2007 I and many others however are not And many others would agree with Hellfire.
Gizmo Posted October 25, 2007 Posted October 25, 2007 The valid points you raise are that no one owes alligience to any console. The rest is bull. We've already seen games that couldn't be don on GC. I'm not even talking about Mario Galaxy and Metroid Prime 3, even Excite Truck, that at first glance doesn't look to be fantastic graphically couldn't be done on GC. Lots of particle effects, lots of cars running arround and crashing terrain deformation all of that couldn't be done on GC running fluidly. Factor 5, which is one of the best companies in terms of graphics already said that Wii can do MUCH MUCH better than GC, just that companies aren't taking advantage of it. Also, Wii doesn't have quality? Let's see, you have much better assistance and quality assurance than either 360 that's breaking all the time or PS3 which has the fantastic track record of quality shown with PS2 and PSP. My Wii is beautiful, the materials aren't cheap in any way, it doesn't overheat, it's small and it's silent. That's quality.Wii is overpriced? Funny, because you have to pay more for a 360, that admittedly, has better hardware, but then again, you'll need an HDTV. Oh and wi-fi? Oops, have to buy an adaptor! Want storage? Well, buy the more expensive version or an overpriced memory card, but then, you won't be able to do much with all trailers and live content and whatnot. It's HD! High quality! HDMI? Buy the Elite version. PS3? They dropped the 60 GB and sell only the 40 GB which doesnt even allow BC and market it as a price drop. Also, 70 € games. Awesome stuff. Realise this: these are companies running a business, Nintendo could lower the price, sure, we'd be happier, but a new console for less than 250€? Would be viewed as a crappy toy. Not to mention there's a thing called profit. It's useful for them too. We keep waiting for games. Interesting, my favourite game ever came out on THE LAUNCH DAY. There are also the likes of Excite Truck, Trauma Center,Sonic, Wario Ware, Rayman, Scarface, Godfather, Mario Strikers, Zack and Wiki, MP3, SPM Mario Galaxy, Dewey, Eledees, Mercury Meltdown and some more games that I enjoy a lot. In one year. Metroid is out tomorrow and Mario in a few weeks don't say they don't count. Also, only people that aren't minimally savy can say that MP3 is a small leap graphically from MP2. Your eyes are so used to seeing HD games that you can't even judge SD games fairly. MP3 has a totally new graphic engine, uses bloom, has great textures, a very high poly count, fantastic particule effects, bigger and more enemies on the screen at the same time always with a fluid framerate. Not to mention much bigger environments. Don't talk about graphical leaps when you have no idea what you're talking about, I'm no tech geek, but I know one thing or two and I can notice a huge difference and I talked with guys that know a lot about graphics and hardware and they say the same. Wanna know what interests me in 360 for now? Dead Rising and Halo 3. Probably missing something, but mainly everything is on the PC. It's not a matter of brand loyalty it's a matter of taste. If my main interest was racing games, I would have bought a 360 for PGR and Forza. Also, SPM is an amazing game, but most people were expecting a Paper Mario sequel and had such incredibely high expectations that it was impossible not to be let down (i.e seeing people saying the game would be the 2nd coming of Jesus). And that's the problem with all the supposed Nintendo fans. You put Nintendo in a totally different standard than other companies and judge them under totally different lights, always expecting more and more and more, independently of what they do. Wall of Text'd.
theguyfromspark Posted October 25, 2007 Posted October 25, 2007 Give me one ice breaking, critical, super effective reason why Wii deserves all these sells. My Mum, Brother and Cousin both own a Wii. I play a few games with them whenever I see them. Neither have ever owned a console or requested to play games with me on any other platform, PC included. For me, the fact that the Wii has opened up the market, making it inclusive rather than exclusive justifies it's success. Because of the Wii, I can now enjoy my favourite past time with my favourite people.
Sheikah Posted October 25, 2007 Posted October 25, 2007 Err... what??Super Paper Mario?? Low standards?? oh boy... Now that's just not clever. Super Paper Mario was, without doubt, one of the worst games I have played in the past couple of years. No story had left my brain in liquid state for quite some time, while also failing to deliver gameplay with a lasting appeal (to further kick it, it had not even a shred of difficulty).
Hellfire Posted October 25, 2007 Posted October 25, 2007 I won't argue with you because its pretty much like talking to a brick wall; you don't listen or pay attention to what is being said. But you highlight my point; whenever you and a few other Wii owners pull out a list of your 'favourite' Wii games, you always have to pull out Galaxy, MP3 and all those others games that are not released yet or that you haven't even played. If you feel 100% satisified with what the Wii has offered so far and argue that it is better than what the 360 offers, then good for you, I and many others however are not and that is why I do not see how and why the Wii should be selling at such high proportions. That is all. Give me one ice breaking, critical, super effective reason why Wii deserves all these sells. Anything I like, to me, deserves to sell, I have every right of having that opinion and arguing against yours just as you have your right to argue against me. It's not like you're changing your opinion you know. Wall of Text'd. mmmm walls of text Now that's just not clever. Super Paper Mario was, without doubt, one of the worst games I have played in the past couple of years. You must tell me in what universe,you get your games.
Tellyn Posted October 25, 2007 Posted October 25, 2007 Thats hilarious man...Can't stop LMAO!...You are obviously digging deeep to shine the Wii in a better light...Well, fair enough, I won't argue with your interests, it is pretty low that you have to stoop to near personal insults to get your point across though..."Your eyes are so used to seeing HD games that you can't even judge SD games fairly."...Right., so where the fuck did I compare MP3 with an HD game? I won't argue with you because its pretty much like talking to a brick wall; you don't listen or pay attention to what is being said. But you highlight my point; whenever you and a few other Wii owners pull out a list of your 'favourite' Wii games, you always have to pull out Galaxy, MP3 and all those others games that are not released yet or that you haven't even played. If you feel 100% satisified with what the Wii has offered so far and argue that it is better than what the 360 offers, then good for you, I and many others however are not and that is why I do not see how and why the Wii should be selling at such high proportions. That is all. Give me one ice breaking, critical, super effective reason why Wii deserves all these sells. Comments like that annoy me. If we're in a serious debate, you don't use such a low, poor form of response. And saying that you're used to HD games isn't exactly an insult, now is it? We are listening and paying attention to your points. Simple as, we like the Wii. OMG! Why are you bent on telling us the bad points and why we shouldn't like it and why it doesn't deserve these sales? It has an excellent single (Zelda, SPM, MySims, etc.) and multi (Wii Sports, WarioWare, the many sports titles, Mario Party, Boogie, etc.) player experience, and then there's the whole host of Channels and Virtual Console titles, and then a boatload of WiiWare titles coming out next year, not to mention the fact that the game draught officially ends tomorrow with the launch of Metroid Prime 3. Then we have many more titles to look forward to, first and third party, in the coming months and most likely years. The glass is half-full.
Gizmo Posted October 25, 2007 Posted October 25, 2007 I agree with the comments about SPM for what its worth. Other than the first chapter it really was disappointing.
Patch Posted October 25, 2007 Posted October 25, 2007 Give me one ice breaking, critical, super effective reason why Wii deserves all these sells. Because, and let's not forget the initial furore over the controller being revealed, Nintendo made possibly the riskiest, ballsiest move the gaming industry has ever seen while on the verge of bailing out of the home console market altogether.
Sheikah Posted October 25, 2007 Posted October 25, 2007 You must tell me in what universe,you get your games. The universe where people have common sense, so probably not this one. How can anyone be left with an impression that Super Paper Mario was a good game?
Patch Posted October 25, 2007 Posted October 25, 2007 According to GameRankings, Super Paper Mario is the fourth best game on Wii.
Sheikah Posted October 25, 2007 Posted October 25, 2007 According to GameRankings, Super Paper Mario is the fourth best game on Wii. Which currently roughly translates to mediocre.
jammy2211 Posted October 25, 2007 Posted October 25, 2007 That is all. Give me one ice breaking, critical, super effective reason why Wii deserves all these sells. Because it's introducing people into gaming who would have otherwise never even considered doing it. It's tearing down that stereotype of anyone with a console being a no-friends geek who plays all day in their basement and allows people like me to share my passion with alot more people then I was previously ever able too. It seems some people don't dig this for some reason, which is their views, but to me it's great. As far as I'm concerned the fact that Nintendo are changing the face of video games in this way makes them worth every sale.
Hellfire Posted October 25, 2007 Posted October 25, 2007 The universe where people have common sense, so probably not this one. How can anyone be left with an impression that Super Paper Mario was a good game? How can anyone be left with an impression that Super Paper Mario was one of the worst games in years? See, it goes both ways. BUT, while you might not like the game denying it has quality means..well... I don't want to insult you, but not a single decent website or mag said the game is bad, even if they didn't say it was wonderful, so there might be something wrong here.
Goron_3 Posted October 25, 2007 Posted October 25, 2007 I've just started to read this thread and I agree with King_V; Nintendo do not deserve the sales they are getting. Let's face it, if a consoles sales were in correlation to the quality of games on the console, the Wii would have sold A LOT less. You have to remember they are a lot of people still buying Wii for Wii sports, and they are then going on to buy bullshit games. Take Mario party for example; how the HELL has that sold 2 million units worldwide! That's fucking rediculous considering how bad it is. Yeah, Nintendo do make some great games, and games like Galaxy prove that, but come on, you can't deny they've left some of their old hardcore fans in the dark abit. I mean, i want some new AAA IPs, not Big brain academy. That said, we know what will always sell more. Also, TellyN listed some great wii games for both single player and multiplayer. Well, the one game worth owning a wii for atm is Wii sports. Most other games can be found on other consoles tbh. I mean, Warioware lacked the GC's multiplayer and as always is criminally short, SPM is a last gen game no matter what anyone says, and TP? Well that lacked the next gen feeling completely.
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