Domo Kun Posted May 27, 2008 Share Posted May 27, 2008 Well, a serious thread about the issue would actually be good. NO big insults. No arguements without evidence. No closed mindedness and certainly no anti semitism/anti arab/musilim posts please. Please please please read over your posts to make sure you don't upset anyone. My beliefs - Peace is the way forward. Lots of people are to blame, some more than others. I'll give more info later but right now I need to head off to see Indiana Jones 4... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emasher Posted May 28, 2008 Share Posted May 28, 2008 and certainly no anti semitism/anti arab/musilim posts please. You may want to re-word that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iun Posted May 28, 2008 Share Posted May 28, 2008 It's six of one, half a dozen of the other. Yes, it was wrong of the world to hand over Israel without giving thought to the people of Palestine. Absolutely wrong. But it's also wrong to believe that terrorist attacks will solve the issue. The other problem is that the Israeli Army has nukes and can point them anywhere in the region. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shino Posted May 28, 2008 Share Posted May 28, 2008 Isn't there somewhere else where we can put them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haver Posted May 28, 2008 Share Posted May 28, 2008 I was thinking Callisto? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twozzok Posted May 28, 2008 Share Posted May 28, 2008 Isn't there somewhere else where we can put them? The nukes or the Jews? If you mean the nukes, then no, they'd never give up those without a fight. If you mean the Jews, then that'd be silly, as the whole reason we gave it to them was because of Jerusalem etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The fish Posted May 28, 2008 Share Posted May 28, 2008 If you mean the Jews, then that'd be silly, as the whole reason we gave it to them was because of Jerusalem etc. So what? Why do they get first dibs on Jerusalem? It's holy to all three Abrahamic religions, so surely the least-violent solution is, you know, leave it with the people who've lived there for the last 1200 years... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twozzok Posted May 28, 2008 Share Posted May 28, 2008 I'm not saying you're wrong, I'm saying that after 60 years, it's not something you can do against a country with nukes. Even without the nukes, the IDF is one of the most dangerous militaries in the world. It'd pretty much be suicide trying to abolish Israel as a state. EDIT: Not to mention the whole, citizen revolt thing etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamba Posted May 28, 2008 Share Posted May 28, 2008 I would say that removing Israel as a country would be a terrible idea for several reasons, even if we put them there in the first place. American money and education have brought economic prosperity and an amount of stability (in that sense) to the area which would never have happened otherwise. Right now, it also helps the western world keep an eye on some very large terrorist organisations. It's not a particularly happy or peaceful notion but it is still valid. For me, the situation is about dealing with the now. The peace proccess was on track and making some very good progress until key figures on both sides were killed or left office and Hamas were voted in in Palestine. Both sides of the equation are very over reactionary and there is far too little blame put on individuals. For now I would like to see a solid boarder and for the petty terrorism to stop, along with pretty baseless military skirmishes in Palestinian areas. Business does and can carry across the boarded and should continue to do so but everyone in the area needs to start thinking about the future, not just subscribing to their personal feeling in reaction to short term events. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The fish Posted May 28, 2008 Share Posted May 28, 2008 I'm not saying you're wrong, I'm saying that after 60 years, it's not something you can do against a country with nukes. Even without the nukes, the IDF is one of the most dangerous militaries in the world. It'd pretty much be suicide trying to abolish Israel as a state. EDIT: Not to mention the whole, citizen revolt thing etc. I'd wager that, say, Iran, could take the IDF, or at least it could until Israel flattered Tehran. Russian (or rather copies of Russian) military equipment is probably the most reliable and combat-effective in the world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Indigo Posted May 28, 2008 Share Posted May 28, 2008 Clearly a two-state solution is the only way. The nature in which the modern Israel state was founded was clearly wrong, but it would be just as illegitimate to try and right that wrong with a similar use of force and aggression. The fact is most established states were originally founded by war and conquest, so if we were going to appeal to who was in a particular territory first then very few modern nations would have legitimacy. You also have to consider the context after WWII. The Jewish people experienced genocide, and had been a target of hate and oppression in Europe for generations beforehand - the Allies wanted to prevent something like that ever happening again. It was a different world then - Britain, France and the other powers still had their empires, and so we lacked the post-colonial mindset that we now have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurtle Squad Posted May 28, 2008 Share Posted May 28, 2008 Please please please read over your posts to make sure you don't upset anyone. You already have offended me. I'd explain, but seeing as though most of society doesn't get the differences & links between race, culture, beliefs, religion etc etc, no-one here would. I say the way forward is to let them get on with it. The British Govt. is probably helping fund the chaos though...Like in a few African countries; it's disgusting. Can't wait for human extinction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twozzok Posted May 29, 2008 Share Posted May 29, 2008 I'd wager that, say, Iran, could take the IDF, or at least it could until Israel flattered Tehran. Russian (or rather copies of Russian) military equipment is probably the most reliable and combat-effective in the world. I know this was a good 40 years ago, but it doesn't make it any less badass (I'm not going to go into if it was right or wrong, but it was badass nonetheless) The Israeli casualties of the war, far from Israel's anticipated heavy estimates, were quite low, with 338 soldiers lost on the Egyptian front, 550 dead and 2,400 wounded on the Jordanian front,[118] and 141 on the Syrian front. Egypt lost 80% of its military equipment, 10,000 soldiers and 1,500 officers killed,[119] 5,000 soldiers and 500 officers captured,[120] and 20,000 wounded.[121] Jordan suffered 700 killed and around 2,500 wounded.[122] Syria lost 2,500 dead and 5,000 wounded, half the tanks and almost all the artillery positioned in the Golan Heights were destroyed.[123] The official count of Iraqi casualties was 10 killed and about thirty wounded.[124] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Six-Day_War They lost 1029 men, compared to the 10,000+ the enemy lost. Also, If i remember this (might be some other war) correctly, the IAF shot down hundreds of planes, without losing a single one of their own. Which in anybodies books takes skill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirkatronics Posted May 30, 2008 Share Posted May 30, 2008 certainly no anti semitism/anti arab/musilim posts please. Think you meant no Anti-Muslim posts lol. Personally i don't know why they can't share it =] I'm probably ignorant to what is truly happening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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