Rummy Posted November 9, 2013 Posted November 9, 2013 I find this very untruthful and I'm getting a rather nasty/personal vibe from you now (regarding 'outside of the topic' advice). I acknowledge that I have lynched the wrong people in the past (of course I have), but the particular example you brought in (your lynch in the keyboard mafia) was not a good one. In terms of the decision to lynch you at the time, it was worth doing based on what we knew then. I think given all the support for DuD's lynch now I ask you to please see that what you're saying could be seen as more than a little hypocritical. You are telling me that I never face the possibility that I am wrong...yet in this case you are yourself wrong about me and not modifying your vote accordingly. It's a perfect example. Yet you still defend it and you still prove my point that you will. What, if anything, would have convinced you away then? I gave everything, and still you were convicted in your opinion. I had to make an un-gamely gamble, that you wouldn't even take, to even get a consideration of doubt. Prior to that, you did not. Even now, you won't admit wrongness. I don't know how other than to explain to you - but no matter what your actual side I find that attitude extremely unhelpful to the town. In addition to that, I have a vote in EVERY game. That I am entitled to use HOWEVER I WISH. I WILL do so. I don't, and haven't, pretending like my vote is gospel. I have, in fact, expressed my very reasoning for it. As for personal or not, I don't care. You can't handle the game, then you don't play. Simples. I'm ready to admit I've been disrespectful at times not only in mafias but also on the forum in general, but you aren't exactly the epitome of a gentlemen either even in mafias. So far in this game, your attitude towards people has stunk(DuD and Diageo in particular). However every single post in this game could be an angle, and that's why the discussion of being personal will hold no merit whilst it's occuring. Again, if you can't handle the game, don't play. You'll also notice I changed my vote 10 minutes before your post. Who can't read posts now?
Sheikah Posted November 9, 2013 Posted November 9, 2013 Your post wasn't there when I submitted mine, Rummy... and maybe we need to cool things a little, aye? Rather than getting angry, I think we can probably agree we are different people with different ways of looking at things. The way you see it, using hindsight you can blame other people for past wrong actions (e.g. a townie lynch), irrespective of what was known at the time. The way I see it, what was known at the time should be taken into account to judge whether a bad outcome was due to poor play or just bad luck. For instance, you say that the lynch of yourself in that Mafia was poor play as you were in fact town - something we knew for sure when you were lynched. In my view, based on all we knew at the time, it was a credible lynch. It wasn't a lynch train that one or two townies that weren't paying attention had hopped on, there were genuine reasons that mostly came about through the fact you got a shitty role that influenced you throughout the game. I'm not saying one view is right or wrong, rather that I accept you have your way of seeing blame/fault, and I have mine. One last thing: I do look back on past mistakes too, not just unlucky ones. I remember in the Lego Mafia City Mafia I totally gave away that I was Mafia and Dohnut saw it (I made a post trying to plant suspicion on a townie and he picked up on it). Needless to say I put it out there that I screwed up in the post game discussion. Still had fun though! :p
The Peeps Posted November 9, 2013 Posted November 9, 2013 If it's still needed Vote: DuD. Been at work since 3 and it looks like everything kicked off while I was gone!
Sheikah Posted November 9, 2013 Posted November 9, 2013 If it's still needed Vote: DuD. Been at work since 3 and it looks like everything kicked off while I was gone! Under...statement. :p
Magnus Peterson Posted November 10, 2013 Posted November 10, 2013 @Sheikah. I think I have stated everything I can. I feel EEVIL has *absolved* the issue - and that there was no 'redirection' or 'PM swap' and that my targeting systems must have malfunctioned slightly:laughing:. I am confident in my information on DuD. I am (fairly) confident that Sheikah is indeed town. (Although, I really thought that last game! ) *resolved*
Sheikah Posted November 10, 2013 Posted November 10, 2013 Aye but this time you got the goods (results). DEM GOODS!
Magnus Peterson Posted November 10, 2013 Posted November 10, 2013 I have not spoken to EEVIL directly about my PM, however. I think this would have a negative impact on the game, and the fun we're having. ...I like the mystery. @EEVILMURRAY, I believe some justice is due. @DuD..
Rummy Posted November 10, 2013 Posted November 10, 2013 Your post wasn't there when I submitted mine, Rummy... and maybe we need to cool things a little, aye? Rather than getting angry, I think we can probably agree we are different people with different ways of looking at things. The way you see it, using hindsight you can blame other people for past wrong actions (e.g. a townie lynch), irrespective of what was known at the time. The way I see it, what was known at the time should be taken into account to judge whether a bad outcome was due to poor play or just bad luck. For instance, you say that the lynch of yourself in that Mafia was poor play as you were in fact town - something we knew for sure when you were lynched. In my view, based on all we knew at the time, it was a credible lynch. It wasn't a lynch train that one or two townies that weren't paying attention had hopped on, there were genuine reasons that mostly came about through the fact you got a shitty role that influenced you throughout the game. I'm not saying one view is right or wrong, rather that I accept you have your way of seeing blame/fault, and I have mine. One last thing: I do look back on past mistakes too, not just unlucky ones. I remember in the Lego Mafia City Mafia I totally gave away that I was Mafia and Dohnut saw it (I made a post trying to plant suspicion on a townie and he picked up on it). Needless to say I put it out there that I screwed up in the post game discussion. Still had fun though! :p Ok. 1. Nice of you to assume/imply I'm angry. I'm not because... 2. My point was never about a wrong townie lynch in any previous game. At no point did I mention a lynch(that you keep coming back to). My point is it's easy for you to be convicted and self-sure yet still be absolutely 100% wrong. That is the only point I ever made - in fact I'm almost certain I haven't mentioned a lynch related to anything other than this game. You can read every single post I've made here - find it and point it out to me by all means. Maybe a beautiful irony of my point right there. 3. You're defending your rightness to no end, which is an attitude I find both unhelpful and potentially detrimental to the town. If town, I find it bad. If mafia, it is explained. I find in favour of wishing to rid us of said player either way. 4. Also - my post was made TEN MINUTES BEFORE. Given your speed of posting so far, it doesn't take you ten minutes to type a paragraph and a half. So yes, my post was there. You just lack the ability to pay attention to the thread and read posts, or can't be bothered. Oh wait, is that rude? Well then you should apologise to Diageo for a similar accusation.
The Peeps Posted November 10, 2013 Posted November 10, 2013 It's insane play for the mafia to have gone after Sheikah like this... but I fully trust Magnus' results and I believe Sheikah is town. To me, it seems obvious that he is but I could be wrong.
Rummy Posted November 10, 2013 Posted November 10, 2013 It's insane play for the mafia to have gone after Sheikah like this... but I fully trust Magnus' results and I believe Sheikah is town. To me, it seems obvious that he is but I could be wrong. I'm waiting for the DuD flip before I decide for sure. If manipulation has happened(and yes is a big if) then to make a town then a mafia could be a perfect way to get two people lynched.
Sheikah Posted November 10, 2013 Posted November 10, 2013 You're effectively calling me a liar about not seeing your post. Weird? I wasn't 100% self sure. No one can be totally self sure in a game where you don't know everything. The point is that everyone on that lynch was confident enough to vote you (not just me, so it's not really fair to single me out). Whatever you offered to stop the lynch was clearly not good enough. Your unusual offer was effectively worthless, which I still think you don't see, and that's because you hadn't established a truth precedent by doing the same thing multiple times before to prove you it was a genuine move.
Rummy Posted November 10, 2013 Posted November 10, 2013 Just to be clear, I'm not backing up Sheikah here. I'm just against barking up the tree that isn't what the alignment investigator has presented us. I'm backing Magnus Peterson. I still definitely had doubts about Sheikah myself up until EEVIL's posts. And even those don't totally clear him for me, but I think we should drop it for now until there's more info on Sheikah. Completely understood btw. Even just another person weighing in was more substance than the arguments presented at the time. I took Magnus on his info for Cube, I'll take your on yours in addition to what else is here for now. You're effectively calling me a liar about not seeing your post. Weird? I wasn't 100% self sure. No one can be totally self sure in a game where you don't know everything. The point is that everyone on that lynch was confident enough to vote you (not just me, so it's not really fair to single me out). Whatever you offered to stop the lynch was clearly not good enough. Your unusual offer was effectively worthless, which I still think you don't see, and that's because you hadn't established a truth precedent by doing the same thing multiple times before to prove you it was a genuine move. Why are you still talking about a lynch I never mentioned, brought up, or cared about - even after my express post stating that fact? Seriously. The audacity of you to talk about other people not reading posts.
Sheikah Posted November 10, 2013 Posted November 10, 2013 Yet I did on Day 2. Interesting. Diageo's right - you can splash 20 or 30 or 100 different angles, hit one and claim you're right. Your strongest one would be to always operate with an ounce of self-doubt - do you recall the Keyboard mafia? The one where I was totally mafia? Oh no wait, that was just what you totally believed with all the conclusive evidence in front of you despite 100% accurate and truthful claims by myself which you were equally adamant were not the case. >You'll hopefully understand why I take you, and everything else, with a pinch of salt. Weird, you forgot the points you brought up already? I'm getting fed up with arguing with you now Rummy. You're just being annoying and unhelpful with your comments and general behaviour. Use your vote to lynch Mafia throughout the game and not to express your childish opinions. I really don't need to hear what is wrong with me from the person who pretty much pissed Flink off to the extent he hasn't returned to play Mafia since.
Rummy Posted November 10, 2013 Posted November 10, 2013 Weird, you forgot the points you brought up already? I'm getting fed up with arguing with you now Rummy. You're just being annoying and unhelpful with your comments and general behaviour. Use your vote to lynch Mafia throughout the game and not to express your childish opinions. I really don't need to hear what is wrong with me from the person who pretty much pissed Flink off to the extent he hasn't returned to play Mafia since. Nice quote. Do you see me mention any lynches there? No? I thought not. Additionally well done with making the personal comments you earlier disapproved of so much now that you can't substantiate your jumping to points never made. I'll add hypocrisy proof to the list methinks. Don't get angry now, Sheikah. Most of all, I thank you for illustrating my point relating to yourself(as you'll find that quoted post brings up) so well that I barely had to try. None of it was about some long forgotten lynch in an old game, it was about your conviction and defense of it to no end, which it seems is still going!
Sheikah Posted November 10, 2013 Posted November 10, 2013 Anyone who places a vote should have conviction. Otherwise it's just a punt. Are we done now? Can we send people to check out Rummy tonight given this spat?
The Peeps Posted November 10, 2013 Posted November 10, 2013 Anyone else getting tired of this in EVERY mafia?
Rummy Posted November 10, 2013 Posted November 10, 2013 Anyone who places a vote should have conviction. Otherwise it's just a punt. Are we done now? Can we send people to check out Rummy tonight given this spat? Now we're getting back to the game. Why me over you?
Sheikah Posted November 10, 2013 Posted November 10, 2013 Because now a handful of people have reason to believe I'm town? Because you held out on voting DuD for a long time? Because if you are in fact Mafia, I'd be more than happy to see you removed from the game?
Rummy Posted November 10, 2013 Posted November 10, 2013 And If I'm not? I did reveal your power before you did - either I'm a mafia power investigator or have a colleague that is, or had a lucky guess, or I'm town and did indeed suffer the things I said. This has apparently been somewhat confirmed by Yvonne(unless Yvonne is one of my mafia colleagues, of course). I held out on DuD for reasons I've explained, repeatedly. Did you not read my posts, still? If DuD flips town, do we then actually target you tonight, and attempt to lynch you tomorrow? After all, it'll have been shown that Magnus's investigations are open to flaws. Personally I'd suggest targeting the quiet ones and getting as much as we can there, as we probably won't otherwise - Esequiel and Dedede for two. I'd even suggest a lynch of one or the other tomorrow without other cause.
Sheikah Posted November 10, 2013 Posted November 10, 2013 I don't doubt that you were meddled with Rummy. The writeup stipulates the clock went back twice that night. My guess is the Mafia have a power mimic that lets them copy an ability from another player - possibly the person crawling in shadows (mentioned in one of the writeups). Given it specifically stated that the clock went back twice, it suggests to me that my actual character's power (Groundhog Day reporter Phil Collins' time warp) was used twice that night, rather than a Mafioso with a different power but similar effect. Might be wrong on that, but that's my theory. Given that you did nothing every night it certainly adds to the chances that you could have been stopped from performing a kill. Are you the traveller from the N1 writeup (since I'm the reporter)? More info on your role or character would help allay suspicions. @Yvonne what exactly did you learn regarding the time warp being used on Rummy?
Diageo Posted November 10, 2013 Posted November 10, 2013 At this point I wish I didn't read your posts.
Sheikah Posted November 10, 2013 Posted November 10, 2013 At this point I wish I didn't read your posts. Can you please drop it now? It'd be nice if we could all stay focused on the game and for us all to stop squabbling over who hates who the most.
Diageo Posted November 10, 2013 Posted November 10, 2013 Focus on what? The lynch has gone through. All there is left to do is wait. You're free to clog up the thread with petty squabbles but when the mood hits you everyone else must stop? Why should I drop it because you've said so?
Sheikah Posted November 10, 2013 Posted November 10, 2013 Focus on what? The lynch has gone through. All there is left to do is wait. You're free to clog up the thread with petty squabbles but when the mood hits you everyone else must stop? Why should I drop it because you've said so? Oh come on. 'The argument ends when I say it has' - how old are we? Why drag up something when we've clearly moved onto talking about the game again. You're better than this. Day isn't over until EEVIL comes along....there are still theories to discuss (like why the time warp was used twice, Yvonne may know more) and who Rummy is/what he does. There are still people we haven't heard from yet as well like Dedede.
Yvonne Posted November 10, 2013 Posted November 10, 2013 Hi everyone! I was out at a board games day yesterday. Looks like you all built a lot of walls in my absence. I'll see if I can shed some light before the day is closed. Well that's 20 minutes I'll never get back. Sheikah is town IMO. I am a power copier, I used his power on Rummy last night. I tried to use Rummy's power on Sheikah N2, but I got caught in the time warp. I am roger rabbit. oh and vote DuD I guess
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