Rummy Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 Well let's be honest, it was still a pretty sparse line up. That said, Bayonetta was there. So I just hope this means we might see Nintendo focus on releasing system sellers early on their next consoles lifespan. A new 3D Metroid, Zelda, Mario etc. If you get those games right, people will buy a console for them. That said, game development should be much easier for them going forward given the whole joint architecture stuff If you ask me, Nintendo are going to be facing a very steep uphill battle getting the next console off the ground - so they definitely need these 'system sellers' there - but I'm almost wondering whether they'll be enough. They need to blow it out of the water with Zelda Wii U to really get a future sales on it. Consider also that by time this next gen comes, I could potentially get a PS4 and a big back catalogue for much cheaper - why bother buying Ninty off the bat? Certainly hasn't done the job for some folks here, and I'm genuinely wondering if it'll do the job for me next gen as well.
Dcubed Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 (edited) My God, there is some seriously out of context paraphrasing going on in this article... Having actually read the article itself, the writer has some clear beef with Nintendo's "casual" efforts in the Wii/DS era and is really trying to spin a certain narrative... I'm not gonna go ahead and quote the whole thing or scan it for obvious reasons, but Miyamoto is not condemning "casuals" but rather he is talking about how the expectation that a game exists purely to provide entertainment in a passive manner like a book or a movie and that it should not attempt to challenge them to improve their skills is an attitude that he finds offensive and that he feels bad for people who can't see the appeal of a game that encourages you to challenge yourself - the idea that a game should be contempt to make the player feel good and not attempt to encourage them to challenge the player to better themselves is the concept that he is lambasting here, not the idea of making games for inexperienced "casuals"! The fact that the writer is "as happy as we (I) are to hear it confirmed, the signs of a shift in Nintendo's approach have been there for a while" is just simply pathetic, as is the attitude of everyone else who is seemingly getting their jollies over the idea of Nintendo abandoning the filthy casual scum in favour of the glorious hardcore gamer master race. The part that is most interesting here though is this other quote from Miyamoto in the same article... Fortunately, because of the spread of smart devices, people take games for granted now. It's a good thing for us, because we do not have to worry about making games something that are relevant to general people's daily lives. ... because it shows that he sees the proliferation of smart devices as an opportunity for Nintendo and that he feels that they can pull people away from them and move them up the skill ladder (in the same manner that their "bridge" games of the Wii/DS era did, like New Super Mario Bros Wii and Wii Sports Resort - games which were designed to be more complex than their predecessors and offer a step up for people who were newly brought into gaming by the likes of Wii Sports). It shows that they're not giving up on expanding the gaming population, but that they don't feel the need to make "entry level" games for them at this time because smart devices are already acting as their entry point. It doesn't mean that they're moving away from trying to court "casuals", but rather that they're moving away from "entry level" games like Wii Sports in favour of "bridge" games like Wii Sports Resort and higher skill level games like DKCR/DKCTF and Zelda, because the smart devices are acting as a substitute for what Wii Sports and Nintendogs were doing back in the Wii/DS era. Edited August 28, 2014 by Dcubed
Serebii Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 My God, there is some seriously out of context paraphrasing going on in this article... Having actually read the article itself, the writer has some clear beef with Nintendo's "casual" efforts in the Wii/DS era and is really trying to spin a certain narrative... I'm not gonna go ahead and quote the whole thing or scan it for obvious reasons, but Miyamoto is not condemning "casuals" but rather he is talking about how the expectation that a game exists purely to provide entertainment in a passive manner like a book or a movie and that it should not attempt to challenge them to improve their skills is an attitude that he finds offensive - the idea that a game should be contempt to make the player feel good and not attempt to encourage them to challenge the player to better themselves is the concept that he is lambasting here, not the idea of making games for inexperienced "casuals"! The fact that the writer is "as happy as we (I) are to hear it confirmed, the signs of a shift in Nintendo's approach have been there for a while" is just simply pathetic, as is the attitude of everyone else who is seemingly getting their jollies over the idea of Nintendo abandoning the filthy casual scum in favour of the glorious hardcore gamer master race. The part that is most interesting here though is this other quote from Miyamoto in the same article... ... because it shows that he sees the proliferation of smart devices as an opportunity for Nintendo and that he feels that they can pull people away from them and move them up the skill ladder (in the same manner that their "bridge" games of the Wii/DS era did, like New Super Mario Bros Wii and Wii Sports Resort - games which were designed to be more complex than their predecessors and offer a step up for people who were newly brought into gaming by the likes of Wii Sports). It shows that they're not giving up on expanding the gaming population, but that they don't feel the need to make "entry level" games for them at this time because smart devices are already acting as their entry point. It doesn't mean that they're moving away from trying to court "casuals", but rather that they're moving away from "entry level" games like Wii Sports in favour of "bridge" games like Wii Sports Resort and higher skill level games like DKCR/DKCTF and Zelda, because the smart devices are acting as a substitute for what Wii Sports and Nintendogs were doing back in the Wii/DS era. This is happening a lot with this EDGE interview piece. Take Splatoon. In it, they said they considered other IPs, including Mario, for it before settling on the new characters. Now, there are articles, threads etc. around the net saying things like "At one point, Splatoon was set to star Mario instead of being a new IP." Giving the full facts and full story doesn't get hits really.
Dcubed Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 This is happening a lot with this EDGE interview piece. Take Splatoon. In it, they said they considered other IPs, including Mario, for it before settling on the new characters. Now, there are articles, threads etc. around the net saying things like "At one point, Splatoon was set to star Mario instead of being a new IP." Giving the full facts and full story doesn't get hits really. It's a lot like the story of SMB2/Doki Doki Panic actually. For the longest time, people believed that SMB2 USA was just a re-skin of DDP and that it wasn't a "real" Mario game until just a few years back, where the original staff at Nintendo actually said that it was originally a Mario game that ended up getting re-skinned itself! Just standard practice. They make a gameplay prototype and plonk in the characters that best fit the game. If nobody fits, they make new characters BTW, there is one interesting point in that article... Apparently, Nintendo have set up a new initiative called Garage - it's pretty much exactly like Game Freak's new IP initiative which resulted in Harmoknight and Solitiba. Splatoon is the first game to come out of that (and Project Guard/Project Giant Robot come from it too).
Goron_3 Posted August 28, 2014 Author Posted August 28, 2014 I actually understood all of that from the article and read it with the understanding that there is clearly a translation issue with the word 'pathetic'. In fact the word apathetic would probably be more relevant, or even the word 'kawaisou', which as far as I can tell, doesn't actually have any negative connotations unlike in English. I think the message itself is pretty obvious though.
Dcubed Posted August 28, 2014 Posted August 28, 2014 I actually understood all of that from the article and read it with the understanding that there is clearly a translation issue with the word 'pathetic'. In fact the word apathetic would probably be more relevant, or even the word 'kawaisou', which as far as I can tell, doesn't actually have any negative connotations unlike in English. I think the message itself is pretty obvious though. Yeah it is obvious, but too bad the writer chose to spin it into an anti-casual narrative... Cause he clearly still wants to make games that appeal to inexperienced players. The comment about how he wants his games to be fun to watch for passive players also ties into that too. It's just that he doesn't feel the need for entry level games because smartphone games are currently substituting for them. But no, just letting Miyamoto speak without having his words twisted is clearly too much to ask...
Goron_3 Posted August 28, 2014 Author Posted August 28, 2014 Yeah it is obvious, but too bad the writer chose to spin it into an anti-casual narrative... Cause he clearly still wants to make games that appeal to inexperienced players. The comment about how he wants his games to be fun to watch for passive players also ties into that too. It's just that he doesn't feel the need for entry level games because smartphone games are currently substituting for them. But no, just letting Miyamoto speak without having his words twisted is clearly too much to ask... I haven't read the article so I can't comment on the twisted bit. Relax though, dude
Hogge Posted August 31, 2014 Posted August 31, 2014 Some awesome first party games and sales in the shitter. So they've already reached the N64/Gamecube thing. I gather you weren't a Nintendo fan back in the N64 days? If you look at the sheer variety, quality and (for the time) sophistication on the N64, you'll see that the Wii U is nowhere near that. What the N64 was lacking could be counted on one hand (RPGs, a Gran Turismo competitor and a stellar fighting game). Beyond that, the N64 had it all. Beyond the stuff that we expect from every Nintendo console, we got Wave Race (with for the time amazing physics), Pilotwings 64, Goldeneye, Perfect Dark, Starfox, Ridge Racer 64, Excitebike 64, not to mention a lot of great third party exclusives. I hope that Miyamotos opinion reflects what the rest of the company desires to do.
Jonnas Posted August 31, 2014 Posted August 31, 2014 What the N64 was lacking could be counted on one hand (RPGs, a Gran Turismo competitor and a stellar fighting game). And, you know, a cartridge system that alienated 3rd parties at the time, a different controller that no doubt scared those same 3rd parties, and the fact that, later on, some games depended on certain extra devices just to be played. And let's not even start into the things that the competition could do that N64 couldn't. Like FMVs, which were the true eye-catching innovation of the time. But all of this is pointless, as he was talking about sales. And he's right.
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