BlueStar Posted December 3, 2008 Share Posted December 3, 2008 Why didn't Arsenal play like their first team The first team that beat Chelsea, or the first team that lost to Hull and Stoke while their bairns were tonking Wigan? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramar Posted December 3, 2008 Author Share Posted December 3, 2008 Why didn't Arsenal play like their first team? Looking at their situation, no trophies for a while (Dunno how many seasons) and their best shot at silverware and they play a mediocre team, they should have really pushed for the Carling Cup surely? Because for the last god knows when Wenger has decided to use the tournament to test his academy and reserve players. And to be fair I don't mind, it's good to see how they're progressing, and home matches are usually dead cheap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dazzybee Posted December 3, 2008 Share Posted December 3, 2008 I'm so glad Arsenes arrogance has embarrased them 2 seasons in a row now. By all means play young players, it's great, but winning the match has to be a priority. With 4th spot looking uncertain and doubtful hope in the other 2 cups, Arsenal should have thought that winning 'something' would be good. But no. I'm pleased of course. Now if Blackburn beat man U then Spurs may as well just engrave the cup now and keep it locked up for another year :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramar Posted December 3, 2008 Author Share Posted December 3, 2008 I'm so glad Arsenes arrogance has embarrased them 2 seasons in a row now. By all means play young players, it's great, but winning the match has to be a priority. With 4th spot looking uncertain and doubtful hope in the other 2 cups, Arsenal should have thought that winning 'something' would be good. But no. What a bitter mong you are. 1. What arrogance and 2. What embarassment? (If anything I'm proud of our young players, they've performed well in the competition considering many of them are younger than me). You talk as if Wenger's youth policy for the Carling Cup only came in last year. Yet the reality is he's been doing it for years, a few years back a certain 16 year old called Francesc Fabregas scored against Rotherham, and look how far he's come now. He's better than your whole squad. 4th spot looking uncertain, lol, worry about yourself mate, you still might not be in the Premier League come May. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Posted December 3, 2008 Share Posted December 3, 2008 To be honest I think Wenger should have put out a bit more experienced side. I still think Youth is the way to go but with Arsenal's season seemingly going down the shitter, a little silverware wouldn't have hurt - even if it is a mickey mouse cup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramar Posted December 3, 2008 Author Share Posted December 3, 2008 To be honest I think Wenger should have put out a bit more experienced side. I still think Youth is the way to go but with Arsenal's season seemingly going down the shitter, a little silverware wouldn't have hurt - even if it is a mickey mouse cup. Going down the shitter how? We're top of our Champions League group, and undefeated in that tournament. We've be drawn against Plymouth at home in the FA Cup, so we're still in that. We're fourth in the league and are only 8 points a drift from Liverpool with over half the season still to play. As it stands, we're still in 3 major competitions. Down the shitter is when you go out of 3 cups in the space of 10 days. And we've done that before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fierce_LiNk Posted December 3, 2008 Share Posted December 3, 2008 The thing with Arsenal is that I just don't feel that there's progression over season to season. Sure, it's good developing your youngster, but you can't keep thinking long-term. What about today or tomorrow? Arsenal have been in a stage of transition for how many years now? And, in that time, Liverpool have managed to snag players like Reina, Torres, Babel (under-rated, imo) and Mascherano. Look at United, we're playing players like the awesome Rafael, and he's filling a gap that we so sorely needed. There are more holes in Arsenal than there are holes in my crocheted blanket, knitted by my Mother when I was a young lad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramar Posted December 3, 2008 Author Share Posted December 3, 2008 There are more holes in Arsenal than there are holes in my crocheted blanket, knitted by my Mother when I was a young lad. And yet we beat you with an arguably weakened team.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fierce_LiNk Posted December 3, 2008 Share Posted December 3, 2008 And yet we beat you with an arguably weakened team.. And you've lost five games all season, which is three more than us. Also, we were the away team and played pretty awful (with some shocking individual performances), and I was the first to hold my hands up and say that it was a terrible performance. You don't get magic points for beating any of the top four. We've had a distinctly average season by our standards, and yet we've only lost two, both away to Liverpool and Arsenal. So, well done for beating us. What do you have to say about the games you've lost? Would you have traded in the win against Man United for the losses you suffered against Man City, Villa, Stoke, Hull and Fulham? The Premiership is judged over the course of a season. Individual games don't win you the season. But, a string of losses can end it for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramar Posted December 3, 2008 Author Share Posted December 3, 2008 My point was that Man Utd are League and European champions, yet our team that has more holes than your "crocheted blanket" beat yours at only 3/4 strength. If we have holes, dare I say Man Utd do too. To answer your question would I trade the victory for 15 points, selfishly, no. On the basis our team was down in the dumps and I witnessed a fantastic display first hand. Obviously a lot of people would definitely trade those 3 for the 15, but the matches we lost, we deserved to, points have to be won not given. You're right, individual performances don't win titles, but they can transform a team. Edit- And whilst we're here; C'mon the Hornets! (1-0 up against the scum) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fierce_LiNk Posted December 3, 2008 Share Posted December 3, 2008 My point was that Man Utd are League and European champions, yet our team that has more holes than your "crocheted blanket" beat yours at only 3/4 strength. If we have holes, dare I say Man Utd do too. To answer your question would I trade the victory for 15 points, selfishly, no. On the basis our team was down in the dumps and I witnessed a fantastic display first hand. Obviously a lot of people would definitely trade those 3 for the 15, but the matches we lost, we deserved to, points have to be won not given. You're right, individual performances don't win titles, but they can transform a team. We're not a perfect team, and we played pretty badly in some games last season. We are the champions, but no team is unbeatable forever. And, we won both competitions because we were consistent over the competitions. We can afford to lose a game against Arsenal or Chelsea. We lost BOTH Manchester derbies last season, and Chelsea at Stamford Bridge, yet still won the league. Points have to be won, you're right. But, you can't keep losing games against smaller teams and expect to give a good go at the title. That's not how it works. We didn't win against Arsenal, and I'm pissed that we didn't win against Villa, Everton or Newcastle, as each game counts, and they are games we could easily have turned into wins. But, we still got points in some of those games. Wins can transform teams. But, they haven't transformed Arsenal. You're still losing matches. You beat Wigan pretty well at home, but then lost to Villa and Man City. Transformed, you say? That's one hell of a transformation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramar Posted December 3, 2008 Author Share Posted December 3, 2008 Wins can transform teams. But, they haven't transformed Arsenal. You're still losing matches. You beat Wigan pretty well at home, but then lost to Villa and Man City. Transformed, you say? That's one hell of a transformation. The team that played Wigan were a completely different set of players from the City and Villa matches. Admittedly the reaction after the Man Utd game was not the one I expected, but I would like to think the team now are on the up. 8 points is nothing, in 97/98 we were 10 points behind Utd and went on a 10 game winning streak and won ourselves the title. Whilst I'll admit those defeats could cost us this season, it's too early to judge yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fierce_LiNk Posted December 3, 2008 Share Posted December 3, 2008 The team that played Wigan were a completely different set of players from the City and Villa matches. Admittedly the reaction after the Man Utd game was not the one I expected, but I would like to think the team now are on the up. 8 points is nothing, in 97/98 we were 10 points behind Utd and went on a 10 game winning streak and won ourselves the title. Whilst I'll admit those defeats could cost us this season, it's too early to judge yet. And that is where Arsenal are stumbling. The depth of squad there is pretty poor, definitely in comparison to United, Chelsea and Liverpool. What would happen if Adebayor (har har) Fabregas or Van Persie were to be out for a longer run of games? Are there players who can come in? A few important players got sold at the end of last season and they just haven't been replaced. Gaps need filling. It's in drips and drabs. One game (Chelsea, United) you're hot, but others (Villa, City) you're not. You need to find a way to play well across the whole season. The answer: Fill those gaps. Then, competition for places. To be honest, so much has changed since 1998. The league is getting pretty tighter now. Especially when the big teams rarely lose games. It's much, much harder to build a 10 point lead over your rivals, and I seriously can't see it happening this season, or the next. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramar Posted December 3, 2008 Author Share Posted December 3, 2008 The only departure we miss from the summer is Flamini, if we'd kept him I believe we'd be in a different situation. If I was honest I would have preferred it if we sold Adebayor in the summer, the guy hasn't shown an ounce of the effort, passion or desire he had last season. He's become lazy and started believing his own hype. As for Van Persie he's never sustained a full season, so that ones a bit null really. Fabregas is the one I'd be concerned about he is our driving engine and creates most of our attacks. Whilst so much has changed since 1998, if you look at the table from Man Utd down there's not a lot of points in it so far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fierce_LiNk Posted December 3, 2008 Share Posted December 3, 2008 The only departure we miss from the summer is Flamini, if we'd kept him I believe we'd be in a different situation. If I was honest I would have preferred it if we sold Adebayor in the summer, the guy hasn't shown an ounce of the effort, passion or desire he had last season. He's become lazy and started believing his own hype. As for Van Persie he's never sustained a full season, so that ones a bit null really. Fabregas is the one I'd be concerned about he is our driving engine and creates most of our attacks. Whilst so much has changed since 1998, if you look at the table from Man Utd down there's not a lot of points in it so far. It's still a hole you haven't filled, and I'd say there's others, too. Adebayor has become lazy? He's never been different, imo. And, ok, if you sold him, and if Van Persie has never sustained a full season, then who's up front? Bendtner? Hmm. Sure, he's never sustained a full season, but he's still effective when he does play, and that's a fair amount. And, sure, I'd agree that Fabregas is the one making things happen. I thought the reason that Henry was sold was to allow the team to not depend on one person. You're doing just the same with Cesc, and the team has not progressed at all for a few years now. We're only a dozen or so games in, so there's only been about 40 or so points to gain, if you achieved maximum. There's not a lot of points in it so far, but any team can't afford to lose that many games at such an early stage. Do Arsenal have what it takes to take it to the end of the season, and not lose games? I can just see them losing more. The play is predictable now, defending is pretty poor on the whole, and you're not making the most of your chances. I just can't see them keeping up with the pace at all. Also, two nil to United against Blackburn. Good stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Platty Posted December 3, 2008 Share Posted December 3, 2008 Well we're 2-0 up at half time. Quite fancy this cup this year especially with whats left in it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fierce_LiNk Posted December 3, 2008 Share Posted December 3, 2008 Well we're 2-0 up at half time. Quite fancy this cup this year especially with whats left in it. It would be cool to have it, as it's at least something in the bag. I'm hoping we can get the FA Cup this year, though. Love that competition, probably a bit more than the Champions League. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Platty Posted December 3, 2008 Share Posted December 3, 2008 So 5-3. Good proper cup tie. Tevez scoring 4, bet he is still on the bench at the weekend! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fierce_LiNk Posted December 3, 2008 Share Posted December 3, 2008 So 5-3. Good proper cup tie. Tevez scoring 4, bet he is still on the bench at the weekend! Technically it's 3 and a half, haha. Think the first goal was a combination of him and the defender? But still, wtf! Always knew he had it in him, haha. To be fair to him, he's looked great whenever he's played, imo. Always gives it his all. It's just going to be tough for the lad, especially as Berbs is here and I guess he's expected to start a lot of the time. I prefer the Rooney/Tevez partnership anyway. But yeah, fucking awesome. Any highlights on tonight? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Platty Posted December 3, 2008 Share Posted December 3, 2008 yeah ITV1 at like 11:40.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fierce_LiNk Posted December 3, 2008 Share Posted December 3, 2008 yeah ITV1 at like 11:40.... Heh, I'll still be up then. Although, I am watching Conan The Destroyer with Arrrnie, so it'll be a toss-up. But, I think I need to watch the game. Tevez, you beauty. Can't remember the last time a United player got four goals in a game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dazzybee Posted December 3, 2008 Share Posted December 3, 2008 What a bitter mong you are. 1. What arrogance and 2. What embarassment? (If anything I'm proud of our young players, they've performed well in the competition considering many of them are younger than me). You talk as if Wenger's youth policy for the Carling Cup only came in last year. Yet the reality is he's been doing it for years, a few years back a certain 16 year old called Francesc Fabregas scored against Rotherham, and look how far he's come now. He's better than your whole squad. 4th spot looking uncertain, lol, worry about yourself mate, you still might not be in the Premier League come May. Don't be a prick Ramar, why resort to insults? Fuck me, text book goon, no point in conversation. If you're happy with winning nothing every year and slowly getting further behind the championship then you be happy! And I have no problem with blooding in youngsters, I think it's great, but you need to have balance; the young players would learn MORE if they played alongside more experience. Losing 5-1 to spurs and the season after losing 2-0 to Burnley isn't going to get the confidence is up. But I don't have the same opinion as you so I'm sure you'll come back with an insult! And whilst we're here; C'mon the Hornets! (1-0 up against the scum) We don't all lose to lower opposition mate! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramar Posted December 4, 2008 Author Share Posted December 4, 2008 Don't be a prick Ramar, why resort to insults? Ironnyyyy... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueStar Posted December 4, 2008 Share Posted December 4, 2008 Looks like Roy Keane's thrown his toys out the pram and left the mackems http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/s/sunderland/7764671.stm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tapedeck Posted December 4, 2008 Share Posted December 4, 2008 Looks like Roy Keane's thrown his toys out the pram and left the mackemshttp://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/s/sunderland/7764671.stm Wow, maybe we were too big for Keano... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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