Posted May 15, 2008 well if god can help us save "poor africans" why does he also help non belivers? or cut out the middle man and do it him self. it would actualy be better that way seeing as how he cant get aids or step on a land mine or have hotel rowanda happen, the main reasons i dont go to africa. and claiming you can only love some one purly through god is just elitist, proposterious and offencive. i have friends and family who i love, because i dont belive in god do i love them any less? do muslims, hindus, buddists, aithiests or scientologists some how not love as well as christians? im all for you having faith, but for the love of crap stop acting like every ones life would be better with god. a family friend belived in god, developed motor neuron dissease and killed himself. his life was literaly so shit he ended it, if faith really made his life better then why kill himself? god isnt a miricle cure and the sad fact is the people who are most desperate tend to cling to god yet theres no help from him. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted May 15, 2008 Why do some people believe that Life was created by an accident? I mean seriously, look at yourself and outside your window! You are far too complicated to be created by an accident, all the trees, the ocean and the world in its original shape is far too great to have been made by an accident. If life would have been made by a big explosion (refering to Big Bang or whatever it's called) or atoms, then yes life would be meaningless and pointless. But luckily that's not the case... God created the world and you. The meaning of life is to find God and live for him and his kingdom. You could say love is the meaning of life, since God is love and we are meant to feel love to each other. If this world and the life now seems meaningless then rest assure that there is better times ahead. The end destination of all believers is the heavenly kingdom which is unlike anyting you can ever know, and there we'll spend our eternity with God and all of our believing friends for an eternal time of joy. How can this be wrong? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted May 15, 2008 Why do some people believe that Life was created by an accident? I mean seriously, look at yourself and outside your window! You are far too complicated to be created by an accident, all the trees, the ocean and the world in its original shape is far too great to have been made by an accident. If life would have been made by a big explosion (refering to Big Bang or whatever it's called) or atoms, then yes life would be meaningless and pointless. But luckily that's not the case... God created the world and you. The meaning of life is to find God and live for him and his kingdom. You could say love is the meaning of life, since God is love and we are meant to feel love to each other. If this world and the life now seems meaningless then rest assure that there is better times ahead. The end destination of all believers is the heavenly kingdom which is unlike anyting you can ever know, and there we'll spend our eternity with God and all of our believing friends for an eternal time of joy. How can this be wrong? it can be wrong for several reasons. 1. common sense. that is all Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted May 15, 2008 I think the only reason why some of you completely reject to hear what I´m saying because you don´t know how real and amazing God is. You'd be correct. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted May 15, 2008 it can be wrong for several reasons. 1. common sense. that is all What common sense? The sense that tells you that everything is meaningless? That's not a nice sense to me... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted May 15, 2008 How can this be wrong? Because that's made-up? You've just effectively said; "A cow got up on it's hind legs and began to transform into a big blue fish, before it's head turned into a meagphone, which began to blare out the hits of The Ronettes. How can this be wrong?" Because it goes against everything we know...and is just made up... Believe in SOMETHING otherworldy fine, have faith that it will look after you in death, cool, I totally respect that, but letting a book of prose fiction rule your life is just wrong. It's not magic, the bible. It was written by people out of desperation. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted May 15, 2008 Common sense tells me that if I look at probabilities after they happen, its gonna look impossible. If we're playing cards and I get a combination of cards, you'll say "What were the odds of that exact combination to happen?", apparently, enough. Also, I'm kinda bored of the teapot argument, no offence Fish, but its getting repetitive. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted May 15, 2008 Also, I'm kinda bored of the teapot argument, not offence Fish, but its getting repetitive. I'm getting bored of people saying that I can't prove there is no deity, so, yeah. *runs away* Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted May 15, 2008 What common sense? The sense that tells you that everything is meaningless? That's not a nice sense to me... why should it be a bad thing? the idea of after life sucks, i think its because we know we die that we bother to do anything with our lives. we love more intensely, laugh harder, enjoy the moment more and push harder knowing it'l be over one day. life may be meaningless by itself, but our actions and feelings bring a meaning to our lives and the lives of those we interact with, yet it means nothing on a universal scale. so what? i wont care my life ment nothing when im dead, i'll be to busy being dead. incidently, how is discovering god any diffrent from living a pointless life? because you read a book written 2000 years ago? if you consider how many people have lived your still pointless for all intents and purpouses. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted May 15, 2008 Because that's made-up? You've just effectively said; "A cow got up on it's hind legs and began to transform into a big blue fish, before it's head turned into a meagphone, which began to blare out the hits of The Ronettes. How can this be wrong?" Because it goes against everything we know...and is just made up... Believe in SOMETHING otherworldy fine, have faith that it will look after you in death, cool, I totally respect that, but letting a book of prose fiction rule your life is just wrong. It's not magic, the bible. It was written by people out of desperation. The Bible have been right on many occassions. But my faith is not entirely based upon the Bible, I have heard God's voice, people that have prayed for me have known exactly how I felt, and I know I hadn't told them, so how could they know? They couldn't, but God can. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted May 15, 2008 The Bible have been right on many occassions. But my faith is not entirely based upon the Bible, I have heard God's voice, people that have prayed for me have known exactly how I felt, and I know I hadn't told them, so how could they know? They couldn't, but God can. My family and friends and I often reliase we know what the other is thinking due to the great and lasting relationships we have. We didn't need a spirit guide to connect us. I feel I have an eduated opinion, as I was once properly religious, believing in god etc, but when I visisted the war graves in Ypres, that just went away. I though by carrying some silver cross, that would make the uncountable names on those walls and the sea of cream graves all ok, but it didn't. It made it worse. My realisation of the fact that God doesn't exist was pretty natural, since it's pretty obvious. I think faith is great, but I hate all this "god" stuff. I'd prefer to have a deity that was reflection of my identity, rather than some ambiguous prescence. Like some earth spirit, or something. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted May 15, 2008 The Bible have been right on many occassions. But my faith is not entirely based upon the Bible, I have heard God's voice, people that have prayed for me have known exactly how I felt, and I know I hadn't told them, so how could they know? They couldn't, but God can. people hear voices all the time, its auditory hallucination, usualy associated with scizophrenia. still, i propose a test. ask god what game is currently in my wii. if he knows all he can tell you. its not asking alot, he created the universe. if he gets it right i'll consider him real. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted May 15, 2008 Why do some people believe that Life was created by an accident? I mean seriously, look at yourself and outside your window! You are far too complicated to be created by an accident, all the trees, the ocean and the world in its original shape is far too great to have been made by an accident. If life would have been made by a big explosion (refering to Big Bang or whatever it's called) or atoms, then yes life would be meaningless and pointless. But luckily that's not the case... It seems evident from what you've said that your personal scientific knowledge is equal to that of someone in, ooh, lets say, 1856. Life was not created by accident. Given enough time (4.5 billion years seems long enough for me), the required chemical reaction is all but guaranteed to happen. Chances of life not occurring anywhere in the universe, are, by some estimates, less likely than life occurring. Once it starts, evolution takes over the development of life. The biological complexity is rendered irrelevant by Mr. Darwin and his theory of evolution by natural selection. The complexity in things like the positioning of Earth in the solar system is explainable by the simple idea of physical sieves. You don't make a convincing case by not even knowing what the scientifically universally accepted theory is called. Life has no purpose, yet it is not meaningless. It is the result of physics, chemistry, biology, and a large chunk of time. It's like pretty much everything else in the universe. However, one thing that makes it's special is that, at it's highest known development (us), it can choose it's own meaning. I have chosen my life to be intended for being a humanist, continuing the species, and playing lots of video games. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted May 15, 2008 You can´t go and save poor africans on your own. But if God moves you and if He wants you to go to Africa to preach gospel and help those people there you can but only because He does it in you. I think you'll find there are plenty of people who have gone out and helped not only poor Africans, but any people in need of aid on their own without the motivation of religion behind them. Surely such help is far greater than someone going out and preach the gospel to people in desperate need. For one thing their aid would be purely out of desire to help with no strings attached (i.e. without trying to convert people through aid). As for God. I've gone through it, read the bible, read The Purpose Driven Life, gone on the Alpha Course, been to church and even tried the whole praying for salvation thing. The result was distinctly underwhelming, there was no great revelation and there was no change in feelings, everything was much the same as it always had been. This just leads me to the conclusion that either there is no God or there is but he just doesn't give a crap me. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted May 15, 2008 still, i propose a test. ask god what game is currently in my wii. if he knows all he can tell you. its not asking alot, he created the universe. if he gets it right i'll consider him real. What you really need to do is a double blind test. However, I have no doubt the results will be the same... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted May 15, 2008 My family and friends and I often reliase we know what the other is thinking due to the great and lasting relationships we have. We didn't need a spirit guide to connect us. I feel I have an eduated opinion, as I was once properly religious, believing in god etc, but when I visisted the war graves in Ypres, that just went away. I though by carrying some silver cross, that would make the uncountable names on those walls and the sea of cream graves all ok, but it didn't. It made it worse. My realisation of the fact that God doesn't exist was pretty natural, since it's pretty obvious. I think faith is great, but I hate all this "god" stuff. I'd prefer to have a deity that was reflection of my identity, rather than some ambiguous prescence. Like some earth spirit, or something. It has actually been strangers that have prayed for me and knew how I felt, without being possible to know. We are in a way a reflection of God, since God actually made us to be like him... and I don't think spirit is the right description of God. He has personality and he has a body even though we can't see him. For me it's obvious that God exists, life couldn't be made in any other way and I'm certain of God's existence in a way that is hard to describe. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted May 15, 2008 What you really need to do is a double blind test. However, I have no doubt the results will be the same... yeah, i suppose. i could also do with more participants. either way, i doubt i'll get an aswer. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted May 15, 2008 people hear voices all the time, its auditory hallucination, usualy associated with scizophrenia. still, i propose a test. ask god what game is currently in my wii. if he knows all he can tell you. its not asking alot, he created the universe. if he gets it right i'll consider him real. Mario Kart? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted May 15, 2008 I think you'll find there are plenty of people who have gone out and helped not only poor Africans, but any people in need of aid on their own without the motivation of religion behind them. Surely such help is far greater than someone going out and preach the gospel to people in desperate need. For one thing their aid would be purely out of desire to help with no strings attached (i.e. without trying to convert people through aid). As for God. I've gone through it, read the bible, read The Purpose Driven Life, gone on the Alpha Course, been to church and even tried the whole praying for salvation thing. The result was distinctly underwhelming, there was no great revelation and there was no change in feelings, everything was much the same as it always had been. This just leads me to the conclusion that either there is no God or there is but he just doesn't give a crap me. I was going to say what my favorite small sun-coloured man has said here, but I saw a chance to rant about evolution, and took that instead. So, what he said. And I've read the Koran, too. I should also point out, relating to the African aid thing and what I said about being a humanist, that I plan, after doing civil engineering in Uni, to specialise in water systems. Chances are I'll end up in South America and Africa supervising the construction of aqueducts, water reserves, and sanitation systems in a few years, and I'll be doing it because I, not god, feel it is the right thing to be doing. Oh, and it's also got a little to do with beating god-squad types at their own game... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted May 15, 2008 To be honest, asking "What is the meaning of life?" really only means you can't find your own purpose. It's a pointless question, as if there's some higher goal that everybody can achieve. You must realize that everybody needs to find their own purpose, and there's no superior power that governs it. It's a delusional thought that follows from the admiration of life. Nobody can answer the question because the question doesn't make sense. There's no single 'meaning'. It's like asking "What is the number of drops in a glass of water" - there's no definitive answer because each filled glass is different, and there's no supernatural power that governs how big your glass is. And to add to The_Fish, if you need religion to obtain morals, there is something fundamentally wrong with you. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted May 15, 2008 Mario Kart? no, not since earlier today when i lost my temper trying to get a star rating for mirror mode flower cup. It has actually been strangers that have prayed for me and knew how I felt, without being possible to know. We are in a way a reflection of God, since God actually made us to be like him... and I don't think spirit is the right description of God. He has personality and he has a body even though we can't see him. For me it's obvious that God exists, life couldn't be made in any other way and I'm certain of God's existence in a way that is hard to describe. ok, if god has a body and is every were, i could theoreticaly be shitting in his mouth. that would be awkward at the pearly gates. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted May 15, 2008 no, not since earlier today when i lost my temper trying to get a star rating for mirror mode flower cup. ok, if god has a body and is every were, i could theoreticaly be shitting in his mouth. that would be awkward at the pearly gates. Everywhere? He sees all, but it doesn't mean he is literally everywhere... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted May 15, 2008 no, not since earlier today when i lost my temper trying to get a star rating for mirror mode flower cup. God tells me you're lying. Or I didn't account for that in the probabilities. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted May 15, 2008 Everywhere? He sees all, but it doesn't mean he is literally everywhere... i was always told he was every where, and if he sees all, why let kids get molested? though when you consider what an arse he was when afam ate that apple its not to hard to imagine him turning a blind eye. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted May 15, 2008 i was always told he was every where, and if he sees all, why let kids get molested? Because he enjoys watching, that's why priests do it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
