BlueStar

I've never been able to put on weight, guess it's genetic cos my dad's built like a sparra as well. What worked for me was waiting until I hit 26 and suddenly realising I was developing a beer belly and moobs.

This "OMG why don't we get a referendum on it, attack on democracy!!11" argument is stupid, we set up government and parliament expressly to do these things. If we had to run round the country for a show of hands every time the government made a decision then a) There'd be no point in having political parties or government b) Decisions would be taken by people with little or no understanding of the issue rather than professionals and we'd very quickly have sums not adding up as tax is decreased massively and public spending goes through the roof and c) We'd never get anything done. If you don't like what the government does, you vote them out at the next election, you don't demand to be able to micromanage them and have people vote on policy like it were Britain's Got Talent.

Strangely, although he only lost FIVE GAMES and took them to second in the Premiership and the Champion's League final, I somehow doubt the media will give Chelsea as much shit as we got for sacking Sam after he left us a broken team losing to the likes of Derby and was making decisions that implied he had been smoking crack cocaine. The new Chelsea manager will have to be aware that it's Abramovich who decides which players come and go and like it or lump it.

England has an Italian manager, France has people from their colonies playing, Ireland has just about anyone playing for them, we have the children of immigrants in the England squad, I'm off to support Brazil. I'd be interested to see what medieval football looked like, I have to say. The players who play for your city's football club may have come from further afield but they now live and work in that town, along side the people there. There's an affinity with the people you live with, even if they weren't born near you, is there not? You have people in your local pub who you drink with, play pub football with etc who you count as from the area , as friends and neighbours, who may have moved there for work or whatever, don't you? People can support other people's teams all they want, but the justification for it often appears feeble to me, that's all. I'll finish with something I think I've posted before in this thread, a post on a footy board that I quite liked

Not when you support one of the big four who charge £50 a ticket and you have to do a 200 mile commute to get to their home ground, no. I went to a Whitley Bay match a few weeks ago and it cost me £4 on the gate. When Sunderland were in the Championship they offered cheap tickets for games they thought they'd have trouble selling out (most of them ) offered £5 tickets to kids for some matches and my mate at Sudnerland Uni could just go to the university reception and ask if they'd been given any tickets and they'd usually have some he could have for free. If your local club is outside the top division, or even the top four, and you can get to it to public transport then you've got a much easier time following them financially. The Chelsea fans in London seemed to cause more trouble than the ones in Moscow.

Yes, maybe we should just embrace the Sky generation, where armchair fans are more important than people who go to games (ie moving kick offs to 12pm to fit more games on the telly, ignoring the fact that the away fans then have to get into a major city centre at the other end of the country by mid-morning)

Well we'll have to disagree because I think that historically geography has everything to do with it. Location is the identity of the team and the team is the identity of the location.

Of course not, but that doesn't mean people need to go for the default team of Man United, there's still pride in picking your nearest league team and it means you can engage with the club day to day. I was born in Newcastle but I live in Whitley Bay now and although I do go to some Bay matches and follow their progress I don't begrudge people who lived there all their life supporting Newcastle or Sunderland. There are hundreds of league clubs in the country and they've got a fairly wide catchment area, it's a cop-out to say "Oh, my little hamlet doesn't have a professional club, Man U or Liverpool it is then. Hooray. We won. "

That player is playing for the people of that city, they're playing for a club named after the city, based in the heritage of that city, created by that city. People can support who they want but if you've just latched on to Man U from London because you think they're going to win things for you you're going to have to face up to the fact that people won't respect that and your celebrations are going to be empty compared to the people who the club is representing. These are clubs that go back hundreds of years to a time when you couldn't just fly up for a match or switch on the TV to watch a team, when a football club was just that - a local club for people who wanted to play or watch football and represent their area, to pit their local lads from those of other cities. The rivalries between teams are often based not simply on proximety but social and political differences between groups of people and different areas. That's why football teams become something for the people from an area to gather around, show their pride in who they are and test their club against the club of another group of people. It's not just a company vieing for business from others by selling a certain brand or quality of football and who just happens to have an address in a certain place and take its name from there. It's not like picking O2 or Vodaphone depending on which has the better rates, or being a fan of My Chemical Romance or Daft Punk depending on which you like better. (Edited and added to this heavily )

On the pitch or in the crowd? My point is that no matter where the players come from, they're playing for an representing that city. I do accept some people have a genuine affinity for a certain club for a genuine reason, although I find it easier to believe that when it's a club which hasn't been consistantly or recently winning things and more inclined to roll my eyes if they have.

Apart from the fact they're representing that city, were formed by people from that city, originally consisted of players just from that city, employ people from that city, bring money and tourism to that city... The regional link to me is absolutely crucial. The club is part of the identity of the city and its people and the people and the city are part of the identity of the club. I can no more imagine supporting a different city's team than I could imagine supporting France or Italy in the world cup. I understand some people think differently and it must be tempting to support someone elses team.

There are genuine exiles. There are also many more people who at some point have just jumped on the bandwagon of a sucessful club because it's easy and, yes, they aren't real fans in my opinion - in spite of excuses like "My grandmother's from there" as if their gran coming from Stockport would have rendered them a County fan. But then they don't get as much out of following their club as real fans do, so it's self defeating. You need to have a damn good reason not to support a club you have no direct regional link to in my opinion.

True, although Bobby Charlton was born is Ashington and I don't see a disproportionately high amount of plastic mancs there...

This thread makes me laugh sometimes. Location: Belfast Yay, we won! Come on United! Location: London Red Army! Red Army! Location: Milton Keynes OMG best day ever! Location: Moon LOL @ Terry, 3 times Champions!

I don't understand this attitude that Chelsea 'buy' success and Man United don't - Rooney £26m, Ferdinand, the most expensive british footballer in history at up to £33m, Carrick £18m...

Yeah, they need to announce it now so the fans can book flights etc.

After last year's Celtic 'friendly' we're having one against Rangers this pre-season. So it's time for the Protestant section of the Old Firm to come down, drink all day, piss in the street, scream obscenities at lasses and bairns and then smash the windows of this season's chosen pub. Dunno why we keep inviting these two sets of apes down. Because they bring so many fans with them I suppose. Speaking of which, Joey Barton's gone down for six months

Bobby Chartlon moaning that it's "unethical and undermining" the way Real are courting Ronaldo. Obviously forgot how Man U wooed Ferdinand, and tapped up Jaap Stam and Mexes without getting their clubs permission...

(Headline to be read in booming Brian Blessed voice) Not sure which of these articles on the same story is more ridiculous, I honestly thought the first one was a Brass Eye-style spoof when I first read it Girl, 13, hangs herself after becoming obsessed with Emo 'suicide cult' rock band Why no child is safe from the sinister cult of emo Blink 182 is apparently a favourite of suicidal emos, I had no idea their bouncy brand of pop-rock fluff drove so many teens down a dark path.

Snopes debunked this idea two years ago http://www.snopes.com/politics/gasoline/gasout.asp

In other news, I also won my work league and got £100 for it. Would have got £50 for winning the cup as well but I lost by two points in the final to a guy in 16th place in a giant killing. Got two lots of £10 for manager of the month awards as well over the course of the season.

Final standings : peace:

http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/columnists/reade/

Could bring up again here that Chelsea haven't beaten us at St Jame's for 5 straight league matches I'll be watching the match in Rome and as always really hoping we win. Although personally I'd like to see Chelsea win the double if only because it'll have the media in tears. They're already sore about missing out on their "dream final" in the champions league.

Some bits of trivia about Dave's all-new groovy tree logoed inclusive nu-tory party Dave's shadow cabinet contains more people who went to Eton than any other school Two-thirds of said cabinet attended fee-paying schools The Conservative Party has more MPs called David (18) than it has women MPs (17). The Conservative Party has more MPs called Philip (4) than it has MPs from a Black or Minority Ethnic group (3). The Conservative Party has more MPs who are the sons of previous Conservative MPs (11) than it has MPs north of Chester (8).