dwarf Posted June 7, 2009 Posted June 7, 2009 My Gamespot experiment: http://uk.gamespot.com/pages/forums/show_msgs.php?topic_id=26909960&msg_id=312783963#312783963
Sheikah Posted June 7, 2009 Posted June 7, 2009 (edited) So you're ripping PS1 games and loading them on to your PSP instead of buying them on the PSN store. Your justification for this is that you aren't cheating the developer out of any money Correct, because they shouldn't be charging a previous cutomer for the same game they have already bought. I fully support PSP games on the PSN store as they are a great means to obtain games that people may have since sold or never played before (FFVII is a good example in that it is cheaper to purchase on the store than buy the discs, as well as the game being slightly rare these days). However, for people who have those games already on their shelf, collecting dust (perhaps they do not own a PS3, or wish to play the games on their PSP) - it's foolish to cough up money again when you already own the game. Please don't try and think this is crazy, because then I'll think I'm crazy. I'll think that there's a huge conspiracy where everyone else thinks it's perfectly reasonable to pay a second time for the same game! Surely it's up to the developer/publisher if they want to re-release one of their titles on a new format (even if it is played by emulation)? The methods that the PSP uses to play the games are irrelevant, it's the tools that Sony have laid down and the developer/publisher can't do much about that. What you're doing is not only illegal it's also immoral. Regarding PS1, I'm not even sure of the illegality, since the BIOS is not acquired (already present on the PSP). But immoral? Come on. Seriously. You already have the PS1 game. How on Earth is it immoral to put it on a different device. Do you consider it immoral to transfer an MP3 from CD to iPod? Don't be silly! Also, you don't own a game. You own a lisence to the game. When you bought a PS1 game you bought a liscence to play that game on the PS1, you didn't buy the rights to the game. Hmm, out of interest, how is it legal to play your PS1 games on PS2 and PS3, then? I am actually genuinely interested in how that works, when at the time of PS1 production they had no idea they'd make future consoles with backwards compatibility. It is illegal and you are talking about partaking in illegal activity. The fact that the legal ramifications of illegally creating copies of software are pretty much zilch doesn't change that. N-E have had complaints from people in the industry in the past with regards to similar discussion, hence you are to zip it before you get yourself an infraction. OK? The actual discussion that has taken place here is perfectly legal, but sure thing; censor away. And no, I'm not asking for an infraction, but that is pretty much censorship. I recall this topic on the forums asking what people had stolen before, and people admitted to things they had stolen in the past. What followed was several accounts of actual theft; people admitting to crimes - illegal activity. To be honest, double standards like this do piss me off. But hey, life's a bitch! I'll shut up now. Edited June 7, 2009 by Sheikah
McPhee Posted June 7, 2009 Posted June 7, 2009 The stuff in General ain't my problem, tell it to the MOdwin. Hmm, out of interest, how is it legal to play your PS1 games on PS2 and PS3, then? I am actually genuinely interested in how that works, when at the time of PS1 production they had no idea they'd make future consoles with backwards compatibility. So you view what you are doing as the same as backwards compatability on the PS2, PS3, Wii, DS, GBA, GBC etc? Despite the fact that in order to do it you need to illegally rip the game files off the PS1 disk, then illegally convert those ISOs to a format that the PSP can play and finally copy these files across to your PSP running illegal (see the EULA) firmware? You also don't find a shred of immorality in doing all that so you don't have to pay to play the game on the PSP, thus cheating the developer, the publisher and Sony out of money that is rightfully theirs? Fair enough, now i know why the "ignore user" button was invented.
Sheikah Posted June 7, 2009 Posted June 7, 2009 (edited) Heh, so in other words, pass the blame. :p Sorry, I do appreciate that you don't moderate that particular forum, but it'd be cool for each board to have the same set of rules and standards, and equal treatment. You also don't find a shred of immorality in doing all that so you don't have to pay to play the game on the PSP, thus cheating the developer, the publisher and Sony out of money that is rightfully theirs? Fair enough, now i know why the "ignore user" button was invented. No, I don't understand the immorality of not paying the developer a second time for a game I already own, and I'd imagine if I posed that question to most other people, neither would they. It's exactly the same ethics as not paying for a song on iTunes and instead transferring the same MP3 from a legally purchased CD to iPod. Edited June 7, 2009 by Sheikah
Pit-Jr Posted June 7, 2009 Author Posted June 7, 2009 Sooooo.....did E3 convince you to buy another console?
Sheikah Posted June 7, 2009 Posted June 7, 2009 Sooooo.....did E3 convince you to buy another console? lol - I have to give it to you, I loved this post. To be fair I already own them all, but in terms of games I'm more interested in those coming out for PS3. Particularly FFXIV.
McPhee Posted June 7, 2009 Posted June 7, 2009 (edited) Yup, i'm passing the blame. Never seen that thread in my life before. I guess i could argue though that you weren't just discussing illegal stuff but were in fact encouraging people to buy a PSP and engage in illegal activity with it instead of buying a Go. Suddenly the moderation across forums is more consistant and in fact you're lucky to be getting away without an infraction. Also, that thread is from AGES ago, moderation standards change over time. We've even had a rules re-write since then so the point is pretty moot. No, I don't understand the immorality of not paying the developer a second time for a game I already own, and I'd imagine if I posed that question to others, neither would they. Is anyone making you pay twice though? You can still play the game on the PS1. The only reason you'd be paying twice is if you want to play the game on the move, but was that the premise you were sold the game on in the first place? Paying twice and breaking the law to play the game on the PSP are two separate issues. If you don't want to pay for the game twice then you simply don't get to play it on the PSP. It's not difficult. For some reason you seem to believe that you're entitled to play the game however you see fit and use the contents of the game disk however you like. For what it's worth i'd agree that making you pay for the same title twice is crappy. However i don't agree that this fact entitles you to modify game and console to get to the same effect. Edited June 7, 2009 by McPhee
Sheikah Posted June 7, 2009 Posted June 7, 2009 (edited) Is anyone making you pay twice though? You can still play the game on the PS1. The only reason you'd be paying twice is if you want to play the game on the move, but was that the premise you were sold the game on in the first place? True, you could play it on the PS1. But that's just more mess by my TV, and to be fair, I could just play it on my PS3. Meh, I have a portable device, and I'd like to play it on that. Just like how people have a portable MP3 player, and want to play their CD music on that, instead of the traditional CD player. Also, there's no way for me to play the PS1 games I actually want to play on PSP, because they're not even on the store! This is unlike music, where you can pretty much always purchase a track off iTunes instead of ripping from CD! Paying twice and breaking the law to play the game on the PSP are two separate issues. If you don't want to pay for the game twice then you simply don't get to play it on the PSP. It's not difficult. For some reason you seem to believe that you're entitled to play the game however you see fit and use the contents of the game disk however you like. Provided I am not selling, making a profit on, distributing or screening the game, I have no moral qualms with it. I've bought the game. People have bought a music CD. They want to rip said data and play it on a different device. When you can discredit this as any different to digital music then I will concede to your point. Edited June 7, 2009 by Sheikah
MATtheHAT Posted June 7, 2009 Posted June 7, 2009 My Gamespot experiment:http://uk.gamespot.com/pages/forums/show_msgs.php?topic_id=26909960&msg_id=312783963#312783963 Yeah i played it and thought 'meh'. Didn't understand how to do Ryu's hadouken it was so hard, was amazed at my skills when I managed to shoot a fireball though! it was incredible I don't know what I pressed. But overall it just was boring and ps3 is better than xbox really. Nice bit of Trolling there Matt. Will be keeping an eye on that one.
McPhee Posted June 7, 2009 Posted June 7, 2009 My Gamespot experiment:http://uk.gamespot.com/pages/forums/show_msgs.php?topic_id=26909960&msg_id=312783963#312783963 Post something like that in this cess pit and watch what happens :p http://uk.gamespot.com/xbox360/action/streetfighteriv/forum.html
Aimless Posted June 7, 2009 Posted June 7, 2009 When you can discredit this as any different to digital music then I will concede to your point. You've had to crack your device, breaching the terms of use. There is no sanctioned method of doing what you have done, it is not an advertised feature. Honestly I don't think anyone cares that you're ripping PSOne games to use on your hacked PSP. However, when you're advocating this usage to other users and leaning on it as an argument as to why no one should buy this new device it's hardly surprising that you're ruffling some feathers. We could argue the morality of your actions indefinitely, but what you are doing is illegal whether you like it or not.
Sheikah Posted June 7, 2009 Posted June 7, 2009 You've had to crack your device, breaching the terms of use. There is no sanctioned method of doing what you have done, it is not an advertised feature. With most music CDs the same applies: 1. It is not advertised on the case to rip the contents, and; 2. An additional program or tool for ripping is often required for many CDs (at least in my case). Given you're not acquiring any BIOS files, I really don't see Sony throwing a major fuss if people wish to play their own games. If you illegally downloaded games, I'm sure they'd care. Anyway, gonna shut up about this now. It's just going around in circles and getting a bit silly.
dwarf Posted June 7, 2009 Posted June 7, 2009 With most music CDs the same applies: 1. It is not advertised on the case to rip the contents, and; 2. An additional program or tool for ripping is often required for many CDs (at least in my case). Given you're not acquiring any BIOS files, I really don't see Sony throwing a major fuss if people wish to play their own games. If you illegally downloaded games, I'm sure they'd care. Anyway, gonna shut up about this now. It's just going around in circles and getting a bit silly. Well it isn't often required anyway. iPods and Zens allow you to rip, and it is actually legal, key difference. But yeah, your last sentence was called by me. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ I think if Microsoft's exclusives were more 'must haves' then E3 might've convinced me, but at the end of the day there's more than enough on PS3 and Natal really isn't working on me.
The Lillster Posted June 7, 2009 Posted June 7, 2009 It may get a bit busier, and I guess it all depends if people decide to make more threads or something. If its all compressed into one thread, then...it's not going to make a huge difference, heh. Yeah, it's quite a nice forum as a whole, I think. There were always be a few pricks here and there, but there's considerably less than other forums. Ever want a laugh? Look at the GameSpot forums. Bluddy awful. They make a new thread for eveeeerything. Why have one thread talking about something? Why not six?! Gah. Exactly bigger doesn't necesserely mean better. Neogaf is the worst, so many pricks who think there some kind of experts or professional analysts.
Choze Posted June 7, 2009 Posted June 7, 2009 Exactly bigger doesn't necesserely mean better. Neogaf is the worst, so many pricks who think there some kind of experts or professional analysts. I think at neogaf and many forums they know fanboy wars bring in the hordes. Look at the motion stuff there... Makes you sick of it.
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