DCK Posted December 24, 2007 Posted December 24, 2007 It's already here on PC (and has been for a few years now), check out the TrackIR video I linked to in my previous reply. I'm really tempted to get it, but I only have about 10 games that support it and at £110 it's a little hard to justify. I'm still fighting the temptation though! Saw it. This, headtracking in general, must definetely be in the Wii2, especially that racing game was fantastic. There are some design issues though; console gaming is different from PC gaming - there's no 'fixed' position you have in front of your console. Also, for third person games I can imagine this works slightly awkwardly. This however will probably bring as much revolution to control as the Wiimote itself.
c0Zm1c Posted December 24, 2007 Posted December 24, 2007 There are some design issues though; console gaming is different from PC gaming - there's no 'fixed' position you have in front of your console. A solution to that might be for the game to ask players to define their fixed position when the game starts - I think the TrackIR software is configured in a similar fashion - maybe even give players the option to redefine it from the pause menu should they decide they want to sit somewhere else (change their fixed position). It might even be possible for future systems to intelligently sense where players are sat/stood on the fly by continually monitoring their actions and configure a fixed position based on the extent of their movements.
Oxigen_Waste Posted December 24, 2007 Posted December 24, 2007 Why are people going on about Wii2? This needs to get done THIS generation, not the next. The time is NOW, damnit!
Fierce_LiNk Posted December 24, 2007 Posted December 24, 2007 Why are people going on about Wii2? This needs to get done THIS generation, not the next. The time is NOW, damnit! "No, the time is right when both you and I are standing outside those walls." Kudos to whoever gets this reference. I agree though. I don't see why we can't implement it now. Try it out now, and refine it for next generation.
Fierce_LiNk Posted December 24, 2007 Posted December 24, 2007 Prison Break. yay. Good man. That's all I had to say, so technically the rest of this post is-
DCK Posted December 26, 2007 Posted December 26, 2007 Why are people going on about Wii2? This needs to get done THIS generation, not the next. The time is NOW, damnit! Aye, but the way it works is not very user-friendly and just plain weird. Technology needs to be improved, and that'll only happen through add-ons (not a smart move as history shows, Wii Balance Board is daring enough). For it to become a game standard, it needs to be in a new console, and therefore the Wii2. If the NDS2 gets a camera, it could use eye tracking as well, which would be equally awesome. This isn't limited to TVs.
c0Zm1c Posted December 26, 2007 Posted December 26, 2007 NaturalPoint on eye tracking technology... Could TrackIR follow my eyes instead of my whole head? Reply : No. Not yet. NaturalPoint Inc. actually started out as a creator of Eye tracking (or "gaze tracking") systems, but we moved away from developing these systems because of all the insurmountable problems in the approach (key problem : your eyes move constantly), and because we wanted to make products that people could actually afford. Gaze tracking systems do exist, but they are still very imprecise, require a lot of patience, and cost many thousands of dollars. If the technology finds its way to a reasonable level of quality and ease of use, we'll be sure to reconsider.
DCK Posted December 26, 2007 Posted December 26, 2007 Eh? I could've sworn the technology was more advanced than that, as it was planned to be implemented in 3D televisions. If this headtracking is going to find its way to console gaming, it must not need any headgear.
c0Zm1c Posted December 26, 2007 Posted December 26, 2007 If this headtracking is going to find its way to console gaming, it must not need any headgear. Xbox Live gamers have worn headsets for years without complaints. In fact it's pretty much regarded as compulsory to wear a headset whilst gaming on Live! NaturalPoint have an infrared headset attachment for use with their TrackIR.
DCK Posted December 26, 2007 Posted December 26, 2007 The Wii's target audience isn't exactly the type of gamer the Xbox Live gamer is. It'd be annoying to use headsets and it's impossible to market. This mustn't be a niche thing.
c0Zm1c Posted December 26, 2007 Posted December 26, 2007 You said 'console gaming', not specifically the Wii. I don't think that matters though. As long as it's small, easy to pop on your head (or around your ear?), and comfortable to wear, I really don't see a problem with it - whatever the console. EDIT: What about Guitar Hero? Those controllers are designed to be hung around your torso, but it didn't stop the series becoming a major success.
Fierce_LiNk Posted December 27, 2007 Posted December 27, 2007 Nothing is more annoying than wearing a headset. Years of telesales has taught me that.
c0Zm1c Posted December 27, 2007 Posted December 27, 2007 Well I suppose you can't please everyone. I've used headphones (only a microphone short of being a headset) for many years now - I play games, watch television, etc. a lot at night and so have to consider other people in the house and the neighbours next door - and it really doesn't bother me.
Oxigen_Waste Posted December 27, 2007 Posted December 27, 2007 Aye, but the way it works is not very user-friendly and just plain weird. Technology needs to be improved, and that'll only happen through add-ons (not a smart move as history shows, Wii Balance Board is daring enough). For it to become a game standard, it needs to be in a new console, and therefore the Wii2. That type of mentality is gonna render us retarded. Nintendo doesn't have the balls to do this, I know... but it should be done now...
c1a2w3t4 Posted December 27, 2007 Posted December 27, 2007 aand if we could playu a zelda game with this....wow
DCK Posted December 27, 2007 Posted December 27, 2007 That type of mentality is gonna render us retarded. Nintendo doesn't have the balls to do this, I know... but it should be done now...Well, it makes the most sense. I'd love to have it now, but I'd rather have it done perfectly - and that means building a console around it. Some Wiimote accessory isn't going to make it popular enough for it to work well, and it wouldn't live up to its potential.
c0Zm1c Posted December 28, 2007 Posted December 28, 2007 It's a peripheral, so you don't have to build the console around it - especially as the Wii has everything a head tracking system like this needs out of the box (Bluetooth, spare USB ports). I can't see Nintendo doing this, but I think with the right marketing and an effort to keep it supported it could be a huge success. If it were bundled with an appealing game that does a great job of demonstrating how it works - as Wii Sports did with the Wii remote (and Wii Fit might do with the Balance Board) - that alone could see sales soar. And as I said before, Guitar Hero is a huge success and its controller doesn't come as standard with any console.
DCK Posted December 28, 2007 Posted December 28, 2007 Peripherals don't do well. Maybe only when they bundle it with some Mii game (like Wii Fit), but even then you won't get games for it, simply because no-one wants to make a game for a market of people who happen to have a peripheral. Things don't become a success just because they're awesome. It needs intelligent product placement to ensure it gets used, and making it a peripheral won't do that. It won't work unless it's an integral part of a console.
c0Zm1c Posted December 28, 2007 Posted December 28, 2007 no-one wants to make a game for a market of people who happen to have a peripheral. That depends on how many have the peripheral. Like I said, if they market it right and bundle the right game with it I think it would sell really well. And the more it would sell the more the userbase for it would grow and, in turn, the more developers will want to support it (cash in on its success). Just because something is sold separate from the console it's designed to work with doesn't mean it's always destined to fail, they have to work at making it a success. Most peripheral manufacturers don't, or don't have the means to.
DCK Posted December 28, 2007 Posted December 28, 2007 Chances it will succeed as a general addition to the console are very slim. Even then, developers have the choice to develop for a whole console user base, or the part of the console userbase that has the peripheral. If I was in it for the money (which they are), I'd know which to pick.
c0Zm1c Posted December 28, 2007 Posted December 28, 2007 Chances it will succeed are probably nonexistent, since this was just someone's project and isn't being made by Nintendo, and it's impossible to tell if the company has any plans to put out a similar device. I hope they do but, if they do, I think (and I'm sure Nintendo would think so too) that it would need to be much more affordable than NaturalPoint's TrackIR. It would probably not sell to more than 50% of the console's userbase, but as long as it managed a decent userbase I think they would deem it worth developing for. If developers/publishers had the mentality that only the biggest userbase is worth developing for then I think it would be difficult to get any new product off the ground, including the console itself.
DCK Posted December 28, 2007 Posted December 28, 2007 Chances it will succeed are probably nonexistent, since this was just someone's project and isn't being made by Nintendo, and it's impossible to tell if the company has any plans to put out a similar device. I hope they do but, if they do, I think (and I'm sure Nintendo would think so too) that it would need to be much more affordable than NaturalPoint's TrackIR.I don't think that's the problem to be honest. Nintendo could just release a Wiimote stand and a pair of them goggles the guy used in the video. It's apparently accurate enough and shouldn't cost much.It would probably not sell to more than 50% of the console's userbase, but as long as it managed a decent userbase I think they would deem it worth developing for.Freebie controller game Wii Play has trouble enough selling around 60% and it has been out since launch. 50% would mean that the game and peripheral has to sell 8.5 million units if it were to be released on New Year's Day. I'd be very surprised if Mario Galaxy or Wii Fit would make it to such a staggering amount. I'd say 30% is a very optimistic estimate, and that probably wouldn't be enough for the development of killer-apps for the device, bar the pack-in game it comes with.If developers/publishers had the mentality that only the biggest userbase is worth developing for then I think it would be difficult to get any new product off the ground, including the console itself.It is difficult, look at the current support for Wii - most developers thought it would flop. Point is, a peripheral just narrows the target audience for a console, it's simply not very attractive to develop for.
c0Zm1c Posted December 28, 2007 Posted December 28, 2007 I said "it would probably not sell to more than 50% of the console's userbase." Wii Play, being bundled with a controller already included with the console, would only really sell to people wanting an extra controller - e.g. for multiplayer games. If it's true that it has sold to 60% of the userbase, then I'm quite surprised by that. Still, as a controller plus a free game I've often heard it referred to as a great bargain. I'm not just talking about the Wii, and developer anxiety over the Gamecube's failure. I'm talking about all the consoles in this and any generation as a whole. The PS2 had a huge userbase when the 360 was launched and continued to sell well into this generation, but developers didn't ignore the new consoles and stick only with the most successful.
DCK Posted December 28, 2007 Posted December 28, 2007 I know, but you should've estimated 30%, that's what I pointed out. It's obvious it won't sell 50%. Also, you can't compare the console market and the console peripheral market.
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