Sexism, Football & Extremism

[Flaight]

Following the recent accusations of Mario Peach being sexist, today the BBC London accused the FA of being sexist when an 11 year old girl was told to join girls' football team, instead of the boys team she's been playing for. It was on at 10 o'clock news.

 

While I understand that 2 contrasting views opposing each other is the way of the world today, sometimes I think both ends go too far resulting in extremism. Human rights principles exist to combat those who take advantage of differences, not to exploit it to accuse everyone of being sexist. I think some people are missing the point of this whole "human rights" issues today.

 

Narrowing it down to this story, the crux of the story is that this girl who has been playing for a boy's team is now asked to join girl's team, although she's been doing well for the old team. BBC London accused the FA of being sexist by telling her to join the girls' team.

 

FA defended this on the BBC by saying that girls develop differently later on and the way they develop would be aided better in a properly guided girls team, leading up to (hopefully) joining women's national team.

 

What do you all think?

 

Personally, while I can understand the girl's point of view, I think it's silly to call it a sexism. There are some profound differences of physiology between men and women (uh-oh, am I a sexist now?), which are natural and perfectly alright. Nothing to be afraid or ashamed of. Yet, I seem to hear at every corner now that anything that makes women different from men is sexism.

 

I could exeggerate it and say, is it sexism that men can't go into women's toilets and changing rooms? Surely it is, if the two must not be distinguished. God (or mother nature) must be a sexist as men can't give birth. Why is it that mothers get more rights with children than men when dealing with their own kids after divorce? That's surely sexism then?

 

Generally, we now live in a world where "difference" must necessarily be a bad thing. Should it be so?

[Hellfire]

It's a touchy subject, but most of the times, sexism is in the minds of the supposed victim. Women are equal, yet there are things such as chivelry and men being supposed going to war and women not. I really don't care about such things and they're kind of hard to discuss, but it just seems that the people that accuse others of being sexist in situations such as the ones you describe are simply uncapable of recognizing and accepting the obvious differences between men and women.

[Pestneb]

I think it is important to acknowledge differences when they arise.

I think issues where people are treated differently because of their age/race/sex should be looked into and justified, if they can be justified down to differences then fair enough.

The problem, I think, is people who are thick. they think a difference naturally means one is inferior to the other, which, basically, isn't true.

Perhaps this rather dense ideology actually comes from the media.

 

but the inferiority can switch, and a trait which in one situation is a hindrance may in a different situation be an aide.

 

so really people should look at their differences, and be taught not to deny them and pretend they don't exist.

Infact, the whole point of society is that we use our strengths to help those who are weak in areas we are strong in, and in return they use their strength to help us in areas we are weak in.

 

so really, weakness should be acknowledged, and if possible/neccessary worked around, and strengths should also be acknowledged and used.

 

The FA may be wrong to separate males and females, but if they are then people such as this girl, rather than kicking up a fuss and throwing a tantrum with the media about who its unfair, and throwing around a retard friendly word "sexism" they should prove themselves.

so find why the FA think this action is necessary, and conclusively prove this to be true or false, and then act from there, in a mature and sensible way.

obviously she's just a kid, so I blame the parents :P

[mike-zim]

ok so what is the point of her playing in a boys team for the next 4 years or so to then be told to play in a girls team? is it not better now that she does so? she can get used to her new team mates and make new friends. now is she not being sexist by saying she should be playing for the boys team? is she too good to play football for a girls team? so the sexism is starting with her.

[Jav_NE]

Regarding the FA's decision, what position are they in to change the regulations for one girl?

 

On the contrary, who can say that one day we wont see mixed football teams. Its the same with all sport though, in fact i can only think of one sport that has good interest than mixed doubles tennis. If men and women can compete in a sport on the same physical level, that meaning duration, fitness and physical build to the style of the game, then there shouldnt be a rule that stops that from happening.

[Eenuh]

There are more important matters that these people should be looking at in regards of sexism. For one thing, in a lot of cases women still don't get paid the same amount as men do for the same kind of job. Now -that- is sexism. Why do women get paid less for doing the same job? They'd do better to look at this than make some fuss over a little girl playing football. Who in my opinion should just go play with the girl's team (she's only 11 now but it'd get more difficult for her to keep playing with the boys when she gets older).

[Space]

I'm a big football fan and think women should be allowed to play alongside men. Women's football will always suffer until it is regarded as one and the same thing. If women want to play in their own league that's fine, but they should be allowed to choose.

 

Football is ran by old men, in 50 years time things will be even.

 

When it comes down to kids the subject is far simpler. If a child of mine wasn't allowed to play in a team just because of her gender I'd be very unhappy.

[Kurtle Squad]

I'm a big football fan and think women should be allowed to play alongside men. Women's football will always suffer until it is regarded as one and the same thing. If women want to play in their own league that's fine, but they should be allowed to choose.

 

Football is ran by old men, in 50 years time things will be even.

 

When it comes down to kids the subject is far simpler. If a child of mine wasn't allowed to play in a team just because of her gender I'd be very unhappy.

 

I agree...For one, Football is a non-contact sport (one reason there aren't very many mixed gender sports is for 'safety reasons').

[Pestneb]

There are more important matters that these people should be looking at in regards of sexism. For one thing, in a lot of cases women still don't get paid the same amount as men do for the same kind of job. Now -that- is sexism. Why do women get paid less for doing the same job? They'd do better to look at this than make some fuss over a little girl playing football. Who in my opinion should just go play with the girl's team (she's only 11 now but it'd get more difficult for her to keep playing with the boys when she gets older).

 

broadly it looks wrong that women get paid less, but two possibilities

 

1)sexism at education.

There are some sectors that are strongly associated with a certain gender.

for arguments sake we'll create Sector F, which is associated with gender 2.

a person who is gender 1 may receive an education biased towards other sectors, but not sector F.

When they pursue a career in Sector F, they are left with less relevant qualifications than most of their colleagues who happen to have received a more relevant education.

 

2)lower expectations

If lower pay is expected then lower pay will be accepted.

Men I believe tend to over estimate themselves, whereas women tend to have a more realistic approach. This can be bad for men - for example driving safety wise - or it can be good - possibly reflected in pay expectations.

 

 

I'm not saying sexism doesn't exist, nor that unfair inequalities are abundant, but just there may be reasons other than sexism coming from the employers.

 

I do agree with you though, simple statistics saying "this is how it is" isn't really useful, it needs to be followed up by "why" and "this is how it can be changed"

although awareness is a good first step.

[Shino]

I agree...For one, Football is a non-contact sport (one reason there aren't very many mixed gender sports is for 'safety reasons').

 

It should be a non-contact sport, but it's not always like that, men (normally) tend to be phisacly more strong than woman and in some sports that makes the diference.

 

There are more important matters that these people should be looking at in regards of sexism. For one thing, in a lot of cases women still don't get paid the same amount as men do for the same kind of job. Now -that- is sexism. Why do women get paid less for doing the same job? They'd do better to look at this than make some fuss over a little girl playing football. Who in my opinion should just go play with the girl's team (she's only 11 now but it'd get more difficult for her to keep playing with the boys when she gets older).

 

Totally agree with you, one time, one of my teachers brought a job proposal for a management company wich most girls in my class wanted, but ironically it was only aimed at male students, because (as he sayed) "girls tend to cause trouble". I was quite shocked, I tought that kind of things didn't happen anymore (innocent me :p).

[mike-zim]

bollocks!!!!

 

why should it change? it is not like we are saying women cant play football ( as in being allowed to, because i have seen womens football lets just say it doesnt fill stadiums). what is wrong with a womens league and a mens league. there would have to be 4 changing rooms. AWAY mens AWAY womens. women wouldn't want to share changing rooms (understandably) so why should they share the same team? it is much easier the way it is.

[Fields]

A girl told to play in a girls' football team? Whatever next?!

 

Actually, a few years back one of the top Italian teams (Atalanta I think, but don't quote me on it) wanted to sign some Swedish woman, but it was blocked by FIFA.

[Flaight]

Very good points there lads, to be honest I found myself nodding with 2 rather different standpoints. I don't know what to make of it now. lol.

 

Sticking to this footballing issue, say, if a boy wanted to play in a girls' team, should that be allowed? If you were a parent of a boy who wanted to play in girls team and wasn't allowed to, would that make you angry?

 

For that matter, if a man wanted to play in woman's league, shouldn't that be allowed too? It'd be interesting if a real case of that was ever brought to court. I can't imagine how it will turn out with today's political correctness.

[Kurtle Squad]

It should be a non-contact sport, but it's not always like that, men (normally) tend to be phisacly more strong than woman and in some sports that makes the diference.

 

Well most football playing girls are tougher than pooftas like Beckham or Ronaldo anyway...

[MoogleViper]

But if she had kept playing for the boy's team and had a serious accident then they would say the FA should have made her play for a girls team.

 

I hate it when women moan about women's football not getting as much coverage as men's.

1. Men are better at football than women (don't call me sexist it's true)

2. Most football fans are men.

[bob]

I have to admit, if women were suddenly allowed onto the mens teams and leugues, not many would actually make the team. This is judging by watching womens FA cup finals and suchlike.

[Flaight]

But if she had kept playing for the boy's team and had a serious accident then they would say the FA should have made her play for a girls team.

I almost forgot about this thread, but I think that's SUCH a good point. There is a double standard in some ways, and often criticism will come whichever-way we go.

 

It's a catch-22 situation for the male popoulation. Feminists will often complain whatever way it turns out. It's almost as if the facts are unimportant; it's driven for the sake of putting down the male side, and some people would go a great distance to seek out & fashion an argument which suit their needs.

 

At least in this instance, I feel that there isn't a problem - but it's made into a problem by a human perception. An artificial creation of a problem for the sake of making a point.

[jayseven]

I don't have much to say here except that the whole point of extremism is to go too far. I just thought that was a silly thing to have said in the first post. *swooshes back into the shadows*

[Flaight]

Yeah that is quite right Emo. I've rephrased that to "both ends go too far resulting in extremism".

 

Well, you know what I meant. I think it was clear enough from the flow of the post at any rate.