EU Referendum - In/Out?

[Ashley]

I know what you mean. Much as I dislike him I remember thinking 'Oh come on!' at that sort of 'reporting'.

 

I don't get the endgame for Momentum. Purge Labour of Blairite scabs and then what? Do they seriously believe Corbyn can win a GE?

 

I don't know if that is their goal or just to have their/the left voice heard more?

 

Well at least Jeremy Hunt lost his cabinet position over this. One positive.

 

His current position. He's still in the cabinet, just in an unannounced position.

 

...apparently he's staying.

Edited July 14, 2016 by Ashley

[Fierce_LiNk]

I don't know if that is their goal or just to have their/the left voice heard more?

 

 

 

His current position. He's still in the cabinet, just in an unannounced position.

 

...apparently he's staying.

 

Yeah, it's just been confirmed that he's keeping his post.

 

So close.

[Charlie]

Yeah, it's just been confirmed that he's keeping his post.

 

So close.

 

His post as Health Secretary or another cabinet position? As long as he isn't the Health Secretary. I know he wasn't really calling the shots but was more of a focal point for a decision that was clearly made by people above him but he was shocking and is hated by the nation now.

[Ashley]

Still Health Secretary.

[Choze]

I know what you mean. Much as I dislike him I remember thinking 'Oh come on!' at that sort of 'reporting'.

 

I don't get the endgame for Momentum. Purge Labour of Blairite scabs and then what? Do they seriously believe Corbyn can win a GE?

 

Yes its not looking good. Big problems ahead. No effective opposition at all. Yesterdays news was pure gushing of the amazing government. Labour fully absent.

 

Momentum are definitely not providing any answers. Corbyn really should go but he wont. He knows his position. Which says an awful lot about his character. He also fails to really do much.

[sumo73]

I'm still following the aftermath of the EU referendum with the SNP myopic about another referendum, UKIP without a leader, the Conservative leadership race won because everyone else had fallen out or quit and with the Labour party at an impasse fighting their true enemy, themselves.

 

Regardless of the mess, I will give this new PM a bit of time to sort things out since Dave resigned earlier than I thought. However I'm hoping that Jeremy Hunt goes whenever there is the next cabinet reshuffle whenever that is!

 

[Rummy]

Wee bump. Pound falls further following an announcement by the BoE to cut base rates to yet another historic low of 0.25%.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/business/news/pound-sterling-bank-of-england-cuts-interest-rates-mark-carney-brexit-eu-referendum-a7171686.html

 

My economics is pretty rudimentary, but surely this is all pretty bad? I mean it's kinda great for me as I'm tracking on my mortgage(sadly not on as much money as I'd like, this'd be a great time to have some spare cash on the lend) but other than for that, or people with debts linked(assuming the cut gets passed on, which it should) - I can't see how this is a good thing?

[Ashley]

I have some money (essentially savings) in the Santander 123 account because it was the best rate I could get, better than any ISA (without locking it away for a set number of years) and that's supposed to be the type of account I should be saving in but the rates were shit. This is going to make them shitter.

 

Mortgage rates might go down, but the costs of getting property is still going up substantially more so it doesn't benefit me.

 

It just feels like my adult working life (i.e. post graduation in 09) I've worked through either recessions or austerity. It feels like we're constantly being told "we need to get through this for the country" and now with this fuck up its suddenly several more years down the line (5? 10? Nobody really knows because there isn't a fucking plan).

 

I understand today's measures have been designed for the country as a whole but as a 'young person' it just feels like another kick. Another case of the 'life achievements' you're supposed to strive for being pulled away. And the ability to think "well its good for the country as a whole, let's go with it" is difficult when it feels like the country as a whole didn't think about what is good for the country as a fucking whole a month ago so why the fuck should I?

 

I've tried to do the sensible thing (both in terms of my finances and my career choices) and it feels like what's the point?

[Eenuh]

Things are just getting worse and worse it seems. Stupid Brexit, messing everything up.

 

I feel quite unlucky about this:

Oh look, mortgage rates are dropping...

We just got ourselves a fixed mortgage deal for two years.

 

Oh look, house prices might drop after all this...

We just bought a house.

 

Oh look, the Pound has dropped significantly against the Euro...

The Euros my parents transferred to me a few months ago for our deposit, would've been worth a lot more now.

 

 

Saving money is just going to be even more difficult now. Rates on savings accounts were already shit, now it's just not going to be worth having one at all I think. I've been using a current account with a decent interest rate, am going to have to keep my eyes open for any other good accounts that show up (if any).

[Ashley]

I doubt house prices would drop because of other factors (such as demand, building rates etc) keeping them high. It may slow a bit, but doubt it'll go down personally.

[Shorty]

I feel quite unlucky about this:

Oh look, mortgage rates are dropping...

We just got ourselves a fixed mortgage deal for two years.

 

I'm sure your rate was incredibly low anyway. They have recently been at a point where they could hardly get lower. You don't know what it'll be like in 6-12 months when it fluctuates on something this unpredictable so I imagine you're still better with fixed. My parents paid something like 11-14% once upon a time.

[Ashley]

Yeah the change is so small I don't think there's much difference you would have seen. I'm sure I read somewhere (probably Guardian) that said the average mortgage would be £22 a month cheaper which while obviously nice I don't think it's huge enough to worry about.

 

There's plenty of other things to worry about :p

[Goafer]

From a purely selfish view, I'm kind of glad. Hopefully it means our mortgage will stay at a low rate when the fixed term runs out in another year, meaning we can fix it for another 2 years at a low rate (or maybe longer if it's still very low).

 

It just feels like my adult working life (i.e. post graduation in 09) I've worked through either recessions or austerity. It feels like we're constantly being told "we need to get through this for the country" and now with this fuck up its suddenly several more years down the line (5? 10? Nobody really knows because there isn't a fucking plan).

 

This is the same for me pretty much. I had a few years working before the recession, but it does seem that for the majority of my working life, it's been all doom and gloom.

 

But that said, I haven't really noticed any restrictions. I've had to stay with my parents a bit longer than I'd have liked, but I've still managed to save up for a house deposit (didn't even need help to buy schemes etc), get a mortgage and buy a house. At no point have I struggled financially. I know I'm probably luckier than most, but it does feel like the best way to look at it is to look at what you do have, rather than what you could have.

 

Geniune question: Are any of us actually struggling financially? Not just "It's going to be a little harder to get a mortgage", but really counting pennies and living off Aldi noodles?

[Rummy]

It's all well and good until the savings you're making on your mortgages are negated by the increased everyday prices of things we import due to the fallen value of the pound :p

 

Again, my economics is rudimentary especially compared to many others here I'm sure - but my understand of rate cuts are to encourage borrowing and spending/investment and discourage saving in order to get more money circulating and trading and hopefully increase the value of a currency. It's far more complicate than that, of course, and many things are almost so interlinked that it's difficult to simplify so much.

 

Having said all this about mortgages though, and as Shorty+Ashley mentions I'm sure my parents/rates were much worse back when they bought, which I believe was around another slump in the 80s. Yet having said that though - the higher percentage rates of interest then were against a relatively much lower valued property. Of course it's all, again, interlinked, but if house prices are say...10 times as much now than they were then, that 10% of then compared to 1% of now is in absolute terms surely a bit more on par...?

 

Things are just getting worse and worse it seems. Stupid Brexit, messing everything up.

 

I feel quite unlucky about this:

Oh look, mortgage rates are dropping...

We just got ourselves a fixed mortgage deal for two years.

 

Oh look, house prices might drop after all this...

We just bought a house.

 

Oh look, the Pound has dropped significantly against the Euro...

The Euros my parents transferred to me a few months ago for our deposit, would've been worth a lot more now.

 

 

Saving money is just going to be even more difficult now. Rates on savings accounts were already shit, now it's just not going to be worth having one at all I think. I've been using a current account with a decent interest rate, am going to have to keep my eyes open for any other good accounts that show up (if any).

 

Ironically I was at lunch with friends today and talking about houses/mortgages etc and I said I track and blah and then even speculated a potential rate cut in the future and how it would be good for me. At the same time talking to my other friend(two of us with houses, third contemplating buying) - they've fixed their mortgage very recently at a rate that's actually still lower than what I'm paying on a tracker from two and a half years ago even with the base rate drop; so as much as it may seem bad here and there, each case needs to be considered in context of others. A 0.25% base rate cut may still only translate into less on a fixed rate cut - and as Ashley says how much will that change the real money costs of the interest atm?

 

As for saving - a lot of the current good deals will probably disappear/get cut now(I've just done a regular saver at 5% which no doubt is gonna get buggered now). Yet, whilst there is an importance to save, you do need to consider what you're saving for and whether it's really something worth doing when you've got debts at a higher percentage than that of what you're getting on your savings. It doesn't feel very common sense/human, but it's something to be considered. I do feel an exception to mortgages though - and tbh right now I wish I had actually taken/borrowed more money from the bank. I'm going to stop overpaying as much as I was(as I also owe my parents some money I need to pay now :p)..

[Serebii]

I have some money (essentially savings) in the Santander 123 account because it was the best rate I could get, better than any ISA (without locking it away for a set number of years) and that's supposed to be the type of account I should be saving in but the rates were shit. This is going to make them shitter.

 

Mortgage rates might go down, but the costs of getting property is still going up substantially more so it doesn't benefit me.

 

It just feels like my adult working life (i.e. post graduation in 09) I've worked through either recessions or austerity. It feels like we're constantly being told "we need to get through this for the country" and now with this fuck up its suddenly several more years down the line (5? 10? Nobody really knows because there isn't a fucking plan).

 

I understand today's measures have been designed for the country as a whole but as a 'young person' it just feels like another kick. Another case of the 'life achievements' you're supposed to strive for being pulled away. And the ability to think "well its good for the country as a whole, let's go with it" is difficult when it feels like the country as a whole didn't think about what is good for the country as a fucking whole a month ago so why the fuck should I?

 

I've tried to do the sensible thing (both in terms of my finances and my career choices) and it feels like what's the point?

 

Don't worry mate, the housing market will crash in 2 years due to this. That's when I'm jumping in.

[Ashley]

Don't worry mate, the housing market will crash in 2 years due to this. That's when I'm jumping in.

 

Pff doubt it.

[bob]

We're thinking about moving to Canada.

[Ashley]

My head says Canada because it seems like the best place for my career but my heart says Italy because...well...

 

[bob]

Is your career in maple syrup?

[Ashley]

Is your career in maple syrup?

 

I'm a mounty.

[bob]

You can be a mounty in Italy. I hear that have some great ones in the north.

 

The Alps, they call them.

[sumo73]

I know that it clearly looks like there were no plans made by David Cameron and George Osborne because they believed the polls and themselves that they would win. They had the backing of big businesses, big business owners and financial institutions with acronyms most people can't remember. I blame our previous PM for some of this mess and yet he has the cheek to send out an honour's list, half of which I would scrap.

 

The Bank of England clearly had contingency plans (which we have seen over the last month or so) and they would have spoken to the government during the EU referendum about them. Regardless of where politicians were during EU debates, the civil service should have drawn up contingency plans as well and these would be some kind of plan. Since article 50 has not been invoked it does however give the government time to try and sort things out.

 

Over the last month of so there have been some scare stories about Brexit. The one that comes to mind is Lloyd's bank (partly owned by the government) that said that Brexit was the cause of them closing down branches and cutting staff which turned out to be not true. The chief executive of the bank - Antonio Horta-Osorio said back in February 2016 that his company would 'thrive' outside the EU and yet the media say Lloyd's have record profits but are closing banks because of Brexit. What's next Nintendo to delay NX because of Brexit?

 

I spoke to a friend in Japan via Skype earlier this week who asked me about Brexit and they said that Brexit would affect the Japanese economy. I didn't mention to them however that their PM isn't doing such a great job on the economy that everyone thinks he is doing. However Japanese firm Softbank did buy out ARM from the UK recently.

 

I said to them well what about the Asian stock market crash in the 90's or the housing market/banking crash in America in the 00's? That had nothing really to do with the UK and yet we had to suffer. I don't want Japan or anywhere else to suffer because of this UK result but in an increasing globalised world there is often a ripple effect.

 

Had the UK voted to stay in the UK, the poor would have had the two barrels of George Osborne's (soon to be CH honoured) austerity measures thrown at them. It's nice that some people here are thinking of moving abroad but for myself I can't afford to move abroad. I'm stuck here and so are many others who don't have that chance.

 

My only hope is that with this new PM if she truly meant what she said outside No 10 a few weeks ago then it is not a continuation of the status quo under Cameron and Osborne. If this EU result says anything it says that the status quo and the disconnect between the political elite and the electorate can not continue.

 

Of course since there isn't really any real opposition to this government apart from the SNP and they just want to return back to the EU. So at present this government can pretty much do whatever they want. Labour please sort yourselves out.

Edited August 6, 2016 by sumo73

[MoogleViper]

My only hope is that with this new PM if she truly meant what she said outside No 10 a few weeks ago then it is not a continuation of the status quo under Cameron and Osborne.

 

It was a good speech, but I wouldn't get your hopes up.

[Kav]

[tweet]794118732922650625[/tweet]

 

 

My favourite comedic tweet relating to this:

 

[tweet]794125351878348800[/tweet]

Edited November 3, 2016 by Kav

[Shorty]

I don't think brexiters wanted parliament to have more of a say than its people... /devils-advocate

 

I also don't think this will stop brexit.

 

But hopefully it will at least prevent us leaving without a proper plan.