NINTENDO @ E3: Let the Hype juices flow

[Blade]

You know you can quote me, don't have to disagree with my opinion in secret

 

Each to their own of course, however I stand by thinking it was solid!

 

As I said I've got Yoshi (already reviewing but you know what I mean) Xenoblade and Starfox to look forward to for the rest of the year and I am absolutely happy with that

 

I'm not defending the presentation based on Shenmue being out in two years, but that's fact. You want hype, that's absolutely fine but while you're looking at an empty screen save for the words "HYPE" written on it for two years, I'll go play some games in the here and now

 

(I'm being facetious I know, but I'm happy with what I'll be playing on U for the rest of the year, you're not. No need to bash my opinion for it )

 

 

Its good that you are happy with the three games, Yosh, Xenoblade and starfox.

 

What you going to play next year? Im so glad I have a PS4 to make up for the lack of games.

 

Also on a side note, it is disgusting that after 2 and a half years Nintendo has basically pulled the plug on the Wii U. I feel short changed.

 

I'd now love them to go 3rd party so I no longer have to spend money on a backwards console in the hope I get decent Nintendo games.

[Serebii]

Let's not pretend that E3 is the only time for Nintendo game announcements. There's still stuff to come. One game in particular that I know outright is coming, and is wanted by many here. I was actually surprised it wasn't shown.

[Mr-Paul]

Let's not pretend that E3 is the only time for Nintendo game announcements. There's still stuff to come. One game in particular that I know outright is coming, and is wanted by many here. I was actually surprised it wasn't shown.

 

Pokkén Wii U?

I reckon they're holding that back at the moment to keep Smash in the limelight.

[Kav]

Sony didn't have to show what's coming up immediately because they've already shown things prior and more importantly, they have the 3rd Parties showing games coming soon. That's why they can show thing further down the line!

 

Nintendo did not have a solid showing, it was poor. Very poor. Padded out with too much talk about the games we had too much talk about last year.

 

Let's not pretend that E3 is the only time for Nintendo game announcements. There's still stuff to come. One game in particular that I know outright is coming, and is wanted by many here. I was actually surprised it wasn't shown.

 

But they said they wouldn't show Zelda. :p

Edited June 17, 2015 by Kav
Automerged Doublepost

[Kaepora_Gaebora]

Let's not pretend that E3 is the only time for Nintendo game announcements. There's still stuff to come. One game in particular that I know outright is coming, and is wanted by many here. I was actually surprised it wasn't shown.

 

I was saying to a friend earlier how if they had announced N64 VC games here we'd be over the moon, but they let Shibata announce it in a direct in January! (Or whenever it was) so we get good announcements quite often throughout the year, whereas most other publishers save it up for e3

 

@Blade I think I'll still be playing Xenoblade next year, supposed to be well over 100 hours! I do get it though, for some people gaming IS their past time, and they want lots of new content and experiences continuously, which is understandable!

 

For me, I'm still playing Splatoon and will be for a long while with the continual updates to it, Batman is out next week (I don't just play Nintendo games) and Yoshi, which is me sorted for summer gaming, then potentially Mario Maker (I'm not into making levels etc so I'll see how that fairs) Starfox and Xenoblade by Xmas hopefully, possibly Gears of War remake thrown in, that's more than enough to be getting on with in my life, both time and finance wise!

[Rummy]

I was saying to a friend earlier how if they had announced N64 VC games here we'd be over the moon, but they let Shibata announce it in a direct in January! (Or whenever it was) so we get good announcements quite often throughout the year, whereas most other publishers save it up for e3

 

@Blade I think I'll still be playing Xenoblade next year, supposed to be well over 100 hours! I do get it though, for some people gaming IS their past time, and they want lots of new content and experiences continuously, which is understandable!

 

For me, I'm still playing Splatoon and will be for a long while with the continual updates to it, Batman is out next week (I don't just play Nintendo games) and Yoshi, which is me sorted for summer gaming, then potentially Mario Maker (I'm not into making levels etc so I'll see how that fairs) Starfox and Xenoblade by Xmas hopefully, possibly Gears of War remake thrown in, that's more than enough to be getting on with in my life, both time and finance wise!

 

Even your own earlier example highlights it - the content is thin. There isn't tons of it. Basically if you're WiiU only there just probably isn't enough to keep you going all the time. I don't have your luxury of filling gaps with Batman or Gears, and of the few showings by Nintendo - not all of them appeal either.

[Kaepora_Gaebora]

Even your own earlier example highlights it - the content is thin. There isn't tons of it. Basically if you're WiiU only there just probably isn't enough to keep you going all the time. I don't have your luxury of filling gaps with Batman or Gears, and of the few showings by Nintendo - not all of them appeal either.

 

Indeed as I said I can see why people who want that masses of new games would be disappointed, but I'm happy with my gaming time+what's shown= enough to keep me entertained playing games I love!

 

I mean, Mario Maker is potentially endless! Splatoon is the gift that keeps giving and Xenoblade is potentially an epic of...epic proportions!

 

I've barely touched on the 3DS stuff either, some of that looks cracking, been hankering for another Zelda multiplayer since four swords!

[Serebii]

I was saying to a friend earlier how if they had announced N64 VC games here we'd be over the moon, but they let Shibata announce it in a direct in January! (Or whenever it was) so we get good announcements quite often throughout the year, whereas most other publishers save it up for e3

 

@Blade I think I'll still be playing Xenoblade next year, supposed to be well over 100 hours! I do get it though, for some people gaming IS their past time, and they want lots of new content and experiences continuously, which is understandable!

 

For me, I'm still playing Splatoon and will be for a long while with the continual updates to it, Batman is out next week (I don't just play Nintendo games) and Yoshi, which is me sorted for summer gaming, then potentially Mario Maker (I'm not into making levels etc so I'll see how that fairs) Starfox and Xenoblade by Xmas hopefully, possibly Gears of War remake thrown in, that's more than enough to be getting on with in my life, both time and finance wise!

Thinking about it, let's assume that they didn't have the Direct two weeks ago and they left the Smash stuff and Earthbound for this. That'd have made the Digital Event have:

 

Starfox

Super Mario Maker

Mario Tennis

Zelda: TriForce Heroes

Hyrule Warriors Legend

Dr. Mario Miracle Cure Available after the event

Chibi Robo: Zip Lash

Yoshi's Woolly World

Xenoblade Chronicles X

Fire Emblem Fates

SMTxFE

Smash DLC - Ryu, Roy & Lucas Available after the event

Earthbound Beginnings Available after the event

Metroid Prime: Federation Force

Metroid Prime: Blast Ball

Mario & Luigi: Paper Jam

Animal Crossing Happy Home Designer

Animal Crossing amiibo Festival

Fatal Frame: Maiden of Black Water

Art Academy Atelier/Home Studio

Pokémon Super Mystery Dungeon

Yo-Kai Watch

Bravely Second

Little Battlers Experience

Mario & Sonic at the Rio Olympic Games

Devil's Third

Sonic Boom

Project Treasure

Skylanders amiibo stuff

Indie Sizzle Reel

Maybe Monster Hunter X & Monster Hunter Village + Dragon Quest 8 (though these are Japan only for now)

 

This would have been a seriously solid, albeit not megaton dropping performance and there would not have been complaints. Nintendo messed up by having the Direct two weeks ago. It's not that Nintendo lacks content, it's just they spaced this stuff out too much over the past few weeks and that worked to their detriment.

 

There Nintendo, I fixed your marketing for you. If you have a time machine, go fix it. If not, BLOODY LEARN FOR NEXT YEAR. Don't do a Direct within a bloody month of E3

Edited June 17, 2015 by Serebii

[peterl0]

I am also not that worried to the end of the year, in terms of the amount of stuff to play, but its frustrating that there is very little new that is also online and worrying for the Wii U in 2016 that the only game that we currently know of past spring 2016 is Zelda.

 

The thing is, I already knew before E3 what I was planning to play until the end of this year - not much has changed.

[Rummy]

Classic Serebii tactic.

[Serebii]

Classic Serebii tactic.

To combine all the announcements they made in the last two weeks and say that if they hadn't been stupid and separated them, that things would be better?

 

Yeah, classic.

[Kaepora_Gaebora]

Thinking about it, let's assume that they didn't have the Direct two weeks ago and they left the Smash stuff and Earthbound for this. That'd have made the Digital Event have:

 

Starfox

Super Mario Maker

Mario Tennis

Zelda: TriForce Heroes

Hyrule Warriors Legend

Dr. Mario Miracle Cure

Chibi Robo: Zip Lash

Yoshi's Woolly World

Xenoblade Chronicles X

Fire Emblem Fates

SMTxFE

Smash DLC - Ryu, Roy & Lucas

Earthbound Beginnings

Metroid Prime: Federation Force

Metroid Prime: Blast Ball

Mario & Luigi: Paper Jam

Animal Crossing Happy Home Designer

Animal Crossing amiibo Festival

Fatal Frame: Maiden of Black Water

Art Academy Atelier/Home Studio

Pokémon Super Mystery Dungeon

Yo-Kai Watch

Bravely Second

Little Battlers Experience

Mario & Sonic at the Rio Olympic Games

Devil's Third

Sonic Boom

Project Treasure

Skylanders amiibo stuff

Indie Sizzle Reel

Maybe Monster Hunter X & Monster Hunter Village + Dragon Quest 8 (though these are Japan only for now)

 

This would have been a seriously solid, albeit not megaton dropping performance and there would not have been complaints. Nintendo messed up by having the Direct two weeks ago. It's not that Nintendo lacks content, it's just they spaced this stuff out too much over the past few weeks and that worked to their detriment.

 

There Nintendo, I fixed your marketing for you. If you have a time machine, go fix it. If not, BLOODY LEARN FOR NEXT YEAR. Don't do a Direct within a bloody month of E3

 

Absolutely agree, in blowing their load too early with a Direct, they've faced a backlash over their e3 presentation! If it hadn't have been leaked at all then the Ryu announcement should def have been in yesterday's showing.

 

Remember last years, which was really good, then all of a sudden in a treehouse showing Miyamoto is going on about Starfox, dropping bombshells left and right!! If he hadn't have mentioned that last year imagine the excitement of that opening!

So yes I agree they need to work on their message and timing of announcements somewhat :p

 

What do you think, Serebii, of this 'company in transition' that Reggie mentioned at the start? Any ideas/theories as to what he may be talking about, if it's something big or not, perhaps?

[Rummy]

Quantity does not equal quality and that list is clearly fluffed to make things look newer and fresher than they are to bump up its numbers to support a weak defence.

 

And that's the issue here. The quality of it all.

[Serebii]

Quantity does not equal quality and that list is clearly fluffed to make things look newer and fresher than they are to bump up its numbers to support a weak defence.

 

And that's the issue here. The quality of it all.

But the games shown off that people are complaining about still look like top quality games, and play well based on first impressions coming in

[Daft]

ACTUALLY Nintendo could indeed run on the 3DS fumes alone. It's basically what they have been doing anyway. It's what bugs me when western third parties shun it, japanese third parties refuse to translate games for it, and Nintendo themselves cut funding for it to focus on Wii U games that as far as I can tell barely exist. 3DS (and portables in general) ARE Nintendo in this modern age, and the sooner they accept it and pursue it with full vigour the better they'll be for it. If the NX isn't Fusion (super quality HD portable with 3DS extras and more, with ability to display on HD TV as good as a modern console, promoting the handheld side more as there's ZERO faith in their home consoles these days) then Nintendo is lost. They can't afford to keep splitting their focus and giving neither console the true focus they deserve/require.

 

To be fair, Western third parties don't really do handheld games at all.

 

Nintendo are stuck in an awkward position of not being able to do home consoles, while Western third parties don't really do portables any more.

[Zechs Merquise]

I don't understand the excuses people are making for Nintendo. Nintendo are the oldest console manufacturer in the business. They have been doing these E3 conferences longer than anyone - they know what is expected.

 

I watched bits of both Microsoft's and Sony's conferences and both got it very right. They announced big games, showed the fan service that their customers want through the right remakes, they showed partnerships with third parties, indie games and a whole lot more - especially in the case of MS who announced backwards compatibility. All of that awesomeness was wrapped up in glorious footage which is just what people wanted to see.

 

Now back track a year. Nintendo had a killer showing and were applauded for it! This article summed it up perfectly: http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2014-06-13-directly-to-you-nintendo-wins-e3-on-its-own-terms

 

A year on and it's an unmitigated disaster. The kind that leaves you scratching your head.

 

It's not just a lack of games that is shocking - but the games Nintendo chose to actually give us is equally perplexing. Whereas Sony gave the fans a FF7 remake - something they have been crying out for. Microsoft announced a new Gears of War and a 10 year anniversary of the original. Nintendo on the other hand gave us a cheap, nasty and frankly insulting Metroid spin off. Who actually wanted this? An Animal Crossing board game - not a single person I know would have had that on their wish list. Mario Tennis is great when it's an addition to a packed conference, but as the one stand alone new Wii U reveal it's pathetic - almost insulting.

 

As I watched the Microsoft press conference I was wowed by the Halo footage and thought Recore looked great. When I watched the Nintendo conference I saw the same footage of Yoshi that I've seen for a year now. I saw the same Xenoblade footage. Then to top it off I was treated to footage from the 80s and 90s of old Mario games and people messing around dressed as Mario.

 

Don't get me wrong - a 25 minute presentation at the show of how classic Mario games were made and what they meant to the people involved would have been fantastic and something I would have enjoyed very much. But it's not for the main conference - when placed in that context it's frustrating and feels like padding.

 

This all leads back to where I started - Nintendo are the oldest and arguably the greatest games producer of all time and they should know better. This direct was filmed and planned weeks or months in advance. Didn't anyone sound the alarm? Didn't those filming, editing and watching it give feed back? Do they live in such a bubble that no one can see what is going wrong? If the sales figures weren't grim enough the reaction to yesterday should be!

 

E3 is the place for big reveals, for giving the fans what they want, for wowing the gaming world with your future plans. Nintendo have totally lost sight of this. Their presentation was wrong in almost every way.

 

They seem to be a company trapped in a time warp and insulated from the realities of the rest of the gaming world. This echoes through their bizarre design choices, missing features in games, the games they decide to produce, the games the decide to not produce and way they approach these public events.

 

That 51 minute E3 presentation was illuminating - as for me it showed everything that was wrong with Nintendo today and just how they have lost touch with the industry, the public and even their own fans.

[Guy]

If Nintendo had skipped the insulting Metroid spin-off and revealed Ryu (and successfully kept him a secret) during the E3 conference, with him available right after, I think their showing would have been a bit more acceptable to people. I can forgive a holiday cash-in Animal Crossing, but Federation Force is just... a huge middle finger to dedicated Metroid fans. Ugh.

 

Not revealing Federation Force as a Metroid and keeping people speculating would have probably also been more exciting. Biggest fail of the show by far - those YouTube dislikes are very telling of the perception of the latest entry.

Edited June 17, 2015 by Guy

[Ronnie]

These presentations are about creating hype. They are to show the world what your vision is for the next 12-24 months.

 

Nintendo's vision is fuck all.

 

Sony and Microsoft show their vision for the next few years. Nintendo chose to show what's coming out in the next 9 months. It was an obvious tactic, and I'm sure they have a vision beyond that. Unfortunately the quality simply isn't there.

 

Sony didn't have to show what's coming up immediately because they've already shown things prior and more importantly, they have the 3rd Parties showing games coming soon. That's why they can show thing further down the line!

 

Let's be fair here, Sony have very little coming in the next 6 months. After that however there seems to be a great deal.

 

To combine all the announcements they made in the last two weeks and say that if they hadn't been stupid and separated them, that things would be better?

 

Yeah, classic.

 

It wouldn't have changed anything. Sure a few fans might have been appeased but the quality still wouldn't have been there. The party game Animal Crossing that no one asked for, the middle finger mulitiplayer spin off Metroid that no one asked for, the dated looking Starfox, the lack of a dedicated amiibo game....

[Dcubed]

You know, say what you like about the event as a whole and how disappointed you are in them focusing on spinoffs and experimental ideas over traditional/safe sequels, but anyone who complains about Animal Crossing Amiibo Party is a massive hypocrite!

 

Just a week ago, everyone was groaning at the thought of them making a standard AC game for Wii U (myself included) and that they should do something completely different on console because the series is a better fit for handhelds. Now you're all moaning that it's not a bog standard AC game; did you all want another Let's Go to the City situation again!?

 

the lack of a dedicated amiibo game....

 

Err... You got it with Animal Crossing Amiibo Party...

 

What do you think, Serebii, of this 'company in transition' that Reggie mentioned at the start? Any ideas/theories as to what he may be talking about, if it's something big or not, perhaps?

 

That's obviously referring to how Nintendo as a whole is going through a transitional phase; starting to make tie-in mobile games, preparing for the NX, partnering with outside companies in new ways (like with Universal as they mentioned during the E3 video) and the way in which they've moved towards making console games almost entirely through collaborating with outside companies. It's a big period of change for them.

 

Next year is going to be the big one really. We'll be seeing a completely new Nintendo that is going in a very different direction from before...

[drahkon]

This direct was filmed and planned weeks or months in advance. Didn't anyone sound the alarm? Didn't those filming, editing and watching it give feed back? Do they live in such a bubble that no one can see what is going wrong?

 

This is what baffles me the most.

 

Someone must've thought this direct was bad/needed improvements. Is no one allowed to give feedback?

 

Err... You got it with Animal Crossing Amiibo Party...

 

But it's a freaking Party game...the most uninspired, uncreative game you can make...If they made a brown, gritty third person shooter called Animal Crossing Amiibo Deathmarch, the party game would still be more uncreative :p

Edited June 17, 2015 by drahkon

[Ronnie]

Err... You got it with Animal Crossing Amiibo Party...

 

Joy. I'm talking about a Skylanders/Disney Infinity style game that ties together the Nintendo universe in an arcadey platformer/shooter/RPG/whatever using amiibo you already have. Not an Animal Crossing party game that forces you to buy dedicated new ones.

[Kav]

Fantastic post @Zechs Merquise!

 

Also, @Serebii, people would have still complained had the earlier Directs not been shown and were instead included in the Digital Event. Talking about DLC for games in the main E3 shpwing and having that as a major point is NOT acceptable!

New game announcements are what's required, not padding for games already out!

[liger05]

I don't understand the excuses people are making for Nintendo. Nintendo are the oldest console manufacturer in the business. They have been doing these E3 conferences longer than anyone - they know what is expected.

 

I watched bits of both Microsoft's and Sony's conferences and both got it very right. They announced big games, showed the fan service that their customers want through the right remakes, they showed partnerships with third parties, indie games and a whole lot more - especially in the case of MS who announced backwards compatibility. All of that awesomeness was wrapped up in glorious footage which is just what people wanted to see.

 

Now back track a year. Nintendo had a killer showing and were applauded for it! This article summed it up perfectly: http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2014-06-13-directly-to-you-nintendo-wins-e3-on-its-own-terms

 

A year on and it's an unmitigated disaster. The kind that leaves you scratching your head.

 

It's not just a lack of games that is shocking - but the games Nintendo chose to actually give us is equally perplexing. Whereas Sony gave the fans a FF7 remake - something they have been crying out for. Microsoft announced a new Gears of War and a 10 year anniversary of the original. Nintendo on the other hand gave us a cheap, nasty and frankly insulting Metroid spin off. Who actually wanted this? An Animal Crossing board game - not a single person I know would have had that on their wish list. Mario Tennis is great when it's an addition to a packed conference, but as the one stand alone new Wii U reveal it's pathetic - almost insulting.

 

As I watched the Microsoft press conference I was wowed by the Halo footage and thought Recore looked great. When I watched the Nintendo conference I saw the same footage of Yoshi that I've seen for a year now. I saw the same Xenoblade footage. Then to top it off I was treated to footage from the 80s and 90s of old Mario games and people messing around dressed as Mario.

 

Don't get me wrong - a 25 minute presentation at the show of how classic Mario games were made and what they meant to the people involved would have been fantastic and something I would have enjoyed very much. But it's not for the main conference - when placed in that context it's frustrating and feels like padding.

 

This all leads back to where I started - Nintendo are the oldest and arguably the greatest games producer of all time and they should know better. This direct was filmed and planned weeks or months in advance. Didn't anyone sound the alarm? Didn't those filming, editing and watching it give feed back? Do they live in such a bubble that no one can see what is going wrong? If the sales figures weren't grim enough the reaction to yesterday should be!

 

E3 is the place for big reveals, for giving the fans what they want, for wowing the gaming world with your future plans. Nintendo have totally lost sight of this. Their presentation was wrong in almost every way.

 

They seem to be a company trapped in a time warp and insulated from the realities of the rest of the gaming world. This echoes through their bizarre design choices, missing features in games, the games they decide to produce, the games the decide to not produce and way they approach these public events.

 

That 51 minute E3 presentation was illuminating - as for me it showed everything that was wrong with Nintendo today and just how they have lost touch with the industry, the public and even their own fans.

 

It's called operating in a bubble ignoring what happens outside of that bubble and ignoring trends.

 

You are right it is pretty sad to see people make excuses for the poor showing when beforehand they were aboard the 'hype' train expecting to see all those titles Iwata said were due out in 2015-2016.

[Zechs Merquise]

Just a week ago, everyone was groaning at the thought of them making a standard AC game for Wii U (myself included) and that they should do something completely different on console because the series is a better fit for handhelds. Now you're all moaning that it's not a bog standard AC game; did you all want another Let's Go to the City situation again!?

 

I think people would have been far happier with a fully fledged AC game that took advantage of the Wii U hardware. Visiting other towns, interacting with other players, chatting, trading and using the gamepad as virtual bag filled the wares you want to trade and share. That has to be preferable to a board game that looks made to whore out more Amiibo and comes on the back of Mario Party? How many board games do we need?

 

If they wanted another board game - they should have made a board game or party game or Skylanders style Nintendo Universe game that involved all the Amiibo and was a bit of a love letter to the hardcore collectors - I would have totally respected that decision.

[Goron_3]

I'm disappointed but the fact that the only new Wii U games they showed were that awful Animal Crossing game and Mario Tennis makes it clear where their development is focused. If their available teams started work on big projects as late as 2013/early 2014 it would be too late due to long development cycles. Hell, Zelda has virtually missed the entire generation and will come out right at the end. Xenoblade is in the same boat.

 

It's better to push smaller, less exciting titles onto teams (or even better, to external developers AKA Platinum) so everyone can get used to development tools for NX. As Reggie said, Nintendo are in a period of transformation. The last thing they want is to arrive at E3 2016 in the same place they were at E3 2011/12, with nothing to show but HD sequels to Wii titles. They know they need to wow the public again and I'm sure they will be hoping to show off some kind of software strategy next year. They were about 18 months late with everything on Wii U and didn't release enough groundbreaking content. I can only hope they address this next year. Until then it's slim pickings.

 

To be honest, I wouldn't be so frustrated if it wasn't for the fact that Zelda, Metroid and Starfox all look horrendous. What happened to Nintendo's famous art styles? Starfox looks okay given its rushed development cycle but this is Nintendo we're talking about - Where's the love and attention to detail?