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I really don't think lack of 3rd party support is much about bad relations. You can always turn that around if your system is selling and developing for it is as cost efficient as possible. These are businesses at the end of the day.

 

Not bad relations, just not necessarily good ones. Nobody associates Nintendo consoles with sports games, so nobody buys the console for them. So why bother bringing the games to them? That's how the line of thinking goes - how do you go about breaking that?

 

For every article that is excited about VR that I have read (mostly Eurogamer) there is always a significant 'but' in the review. Even the most exciting Steam/HTC variant comments had the caveat that people would nee to design very specific games for the system. It might even be a simple as gamers not wanting to wear the thing or the use of motion style controls that put people off.

 

I've read reviews on a fair few blogs and they're pretty much all saying it's absolutely amazing. Not just great, but genuine levels of 'oh my fucking god this is amazing'. That kind of excitement tells us an awful lot; these guys see games day in day out, to get that excited about something must mean it really is special.

 

Obviously there will be limitations - Steam's VR requires you to move around, how are they going to make that work in a confined space? It's uncertain how that would ever work but even fixed view VR (e.g. Morpheus) combined with a joystick for movement would be a huge step up.

 

I personally think many people have dreamed about having a VR experience where it feels like you're really in a game, so I don't think people would be too averse to wearing a headset.

Edited by Sheikah

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Not bad relations, just not necessarily good ones. Nobody associates Nintendo consoles with sports games, so nobody buys the console for them. So why bother bringing the games to them? That's how the line of thinking goes - how do you go about breaking that?

 

Nobody buys Nintendo consoles for sports games??

 

Wii Sports? The biggest selling game ever made... a sports game, that was exclusive to a Nintendo console??

 

Plus the Tiger Woods golf games sold best on the Wii, outselling the PS3 and 360 versions.

 

Keep going...

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Yeah. We know that's coming. Maybe that's what the X is to represent, the crossing of handheld and console.

 

28lrsudw.jpg

 

Crossplatform user accounts <3

 

I was just glancing over the notes on the presentation a moment ago and saw mention of the 'NX', before I was aware of this thread :heh: When I noticed this topic, I was about to come in and post something similar. As soon as I saw the 'X', I immediately assumed it was related to 'crossplatform' :smile:

 

Now does anybody still think the Wii U will be Nintendo's main console in 2018 or later? I told you all this was coming and I still maintain it'll release circa December 2016.

 

Dude.. you've neglected a serious chunk of time there between December 2016 and 2018! Many of us, myself included, looked at 2017 as being likely for the successor to Wii U.. and that still looks likely :heh:

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Nobody buys Nintendo consoles for sports games??

 

Wii Sports? The biggest selling game ever made... a sports game, that was exclusive to a Nintendo console??

 

Plus the Tiger Woods golf games sold best on the Wii, outselling the PS3 and 360 versions.

 

Keep going...

 

Oh wow, really? We're going to go down the road where you pretend that's what I meant? K. You know exactly what I meant; sports games as in FIFA, not a game that was designed for and bundled with the Wii. Hardly anyone was buying the Wii U to play the latest FIFA, and sales were dire.

 

How about you provide some sales figures of Wii U FIFA titles? I'm betting you won't, because it'll prove just how utterly clueless you are. Picking out Wii examples also smacks of desperation; motion controls are for the most part dead now, and the Wii U doesn't sell like the Wii so there's no install base on which to sell other games.

Edited by Sheikah

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For third parties - I think if you kick off a console with strong 3rd party support and you moneyhat it at the start you could change perspectives. The Wii did continue to have 3rd party support for quite a bit (brilliant compared to the Wii U) and it could have had better with performance parity.

 

As for VR, I want it to be as good, and I agree that the excitement is palpable from people who have played it, but I have not read of a killer app game yet. I thought VR was the dream as well, but trying to get any of my gaming mates excited about it is proving very difficult - hence my previous comment.

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For third parties - I think if you kick off a console with strong 3rd party support and you moneyhat it at the start you could change perspectives. The Wii did continue to have 3rd party support for quite a bit (brilliant compared to the Wii U) and it could have had better with performance parity.

 

As for VR, I want it to be as good, and I agree that the excitement is palpable from people who have played it, but I have not read of a killer app game yet. I thought VR was the dream as well, but trying to get any of my gaming mates excited about it is proving very difficult - hence my previous comment.

Wii had good support as there was a large install base due to the popularity of motion controls and Wii Sports. It would be unwise to assume they will have a miracle success again on which to float.

 

Also, even the success of the Wii did not make FIFA continue to sell as well on Wii as the other consoles. The only way the next 'Wii' would have even a chance to sell FIFA as well as the other consoles would be if Nintendo repositioned their image and had parity on console features and online. And why would they do that, if their best selling games are Mario and their policy is to be family friendly? Even if they did all that, why would people who buy Sony or MS consoles for FIFA normally switch to buying the next Wii? People have built up friends lists, accounts, and most of all...these are the sorts of people who are stubborn. They like sticking to a particular control scheme and brand.

 

How would they even go about making their console appear to be the 'go to' for sports? So long as the majority buy these games on PS4/X1, why would they bother making sports games for Nintendo's consoles anymore?

 

It's a difficult situation and I see moneyhatting early in a console's life as no more than a temporary fix.

Edited by Sheikah

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It's worth remembering that Wii games required 3rd parties to create separate dev teams. It's remarkable how much exclusive content it regularly got given that it couldn't run 360/PS3 engines and therefore needs separate teams.

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I was only really citing the example of the Wii as a case in which sales of consoles encourage third party developers.

The next console might have a USP that means it initially floods out of the gate or Nintendo might manage it by just executing everything about the launch well and building momentum. A new system usually generates some good will and interest amongst gamers and the media and it is up to the company to build on that.

 

At this stage of the consoles lifespan I don't think something like this can be ruled out definitively. Nintendo building games for mobile does at least show that some level of change is possible at the company.

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Oh wow, really? We're going to go down the road where you pretend that's what I meant? K. You know exactly what I meant; sports games as in FIFA, not a game that was designed for and bundled with the Wii. Hardly anyone was buying the Wii U to play the latest FIFA, and sales were dire.

 

How about you provide some sales figures of Wii U FIFA titles? I'm betting you won't, because it'll prove just how utterly clueless you are. Picking out Wii examples also smacks of desperation; motion controls are for the most part dead now, and the Wii U doesn't sell like the Wii so there's no install base on which to sell other games.

 

The Wii had a massive install base, and hence sports titles sold well on it. It continued to get FIFA titles after they had stopped on Wii U.

 

If a next gen Nintendo system sells well, I'm sure third parties would continue to release sports titles on it. The Wii U is the first Nintendo system not to be littered with sports titles, it's no coincidence that's it's also the worst selling.

 

If a Nintendo console sells well, it will get the games. Simple. And just because certain games sell more copies on a certain system doesn't mean those games won't be released elsewhere. FIFA sold better on the PS3 than on the Wii. Tiger Woods sold better on the Wii than the PS3.

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And therein lies the problem; you're relying on it being successful like the Wii was in order to sell the games off the back of it. That level of success was madness, and don't expect that again. The golf game sold because of motion controls and the golf club peripherals, which are now pretty much dead. And even with all the Wii's success, FIFA didn't sell as well on it.

 

Now they don't make FIFA at all for Wii U. Your argument is 'if the console sells well, FIFA will sell well'. I don't think it will, particularly. People do not view Nintendo's consoles with their behind the curve attitude towards online as a good place to play these sorts of games. Also, Nintendo don't market themselves as being a platform for these games. Have you ever seen a football game and a PlayStation advert on the pitch?

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VR is not the gaming of the near-future. You thought the Wii's motion controls were impractical and ultimately clunky? If a console goes VR as their main selling point, they'll get those same criticisms tenfold.

 

(Though it is true that Nintendo came up with a way to play in 3D without any extra peripherals. If any company figures out how to do that but for VR, I'll change my tune)

 

Anyway, this NX thing is probably the 3DS's successor, not the Wii U's. Exciting prospects all around, Nintendo's handhelds do not disappoint.

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Anyway, this NX thing is probably the 3DS's successor, not the Wii U's. Exciting prospects all around, Nintendo's handhelds do not disappoint.

 

I actually have a feeling that due to some sort of connection between the home console and handheld side that it'll all be revealed together, further emphasizing the connectivity, and that they'll have a similar look and branding to each other :smile:

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No doubt VR's not going to become the de facto method of gaming any time soon, but I don't doubt it'll be huge the future. In contrast to Wii's motion controls, which in their current format have mostly died out.

 

I'm not sure what you mean by the extra peripherals thing - you mean you want them to bundle the headset with the console?

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VR won't be the future of gaming, but as an extra to co soles I couldn't be more excited, it's obviously very limited to what games it would be good for, but a headset to accompany the ps4 or nx sounds perfect!

 

As for nx. I'm worried this announcement means one hybrid console. What I want is 2 consoles, acting exactly like iphone and iPad. So all handheld games work on the main console, Upressed or whatever, but home console exclusives don't work the other way around, so we still get home console, powerful games, not comprised to work on a handheld.

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Really, you don't think it could one day be the future of gaming? I'd say that desire to be immersed in a world almost entirely favours the possibility that it could one day be the future of gaming. At the very least, in its current stage it is bowling people over. In terms of what games it could apply to, it seems like it would work with almost anything (if you still retain character movement with a joystick and use the headset for on the spot turning combined with hand/arm movements). Who knows where it could lead?

Edited by Sheikah

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Bit harsh considering we have no details of what the said platform actually is yet.

 

Not really because a new console would by itself - at the most - remove the power differential. You'll still be left with a massively introverted Nintendo, unable to forge fruitful third party relations or acknowledge global regions and cultural trends (these problems aren't an issue of power).

 

What 'details' in the NX do you think would tempt anyone away from Playstation/Xbox/PC?

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Not really because a new console would by itself - at the most - remove the power differential. You'll still be left with a massively introverted Nintendo, unable to forge fruitful third party relations or acknowledge global regions and cultural trends (these problems aren't an issue of power).

 

What 'details' in the NX do you think would tempt anyone away from Playstation/Xbox/PC?

 

Have you seen the news today?

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Yes, I have. Thanks.

 

Nintendo has formed a partnership with a single Japanese company to get into the mobile market - a trend if this were still 2009. Unconfirmed for the West too, I believe. It really does nothing to address my concerns. The news has very little to do with the 3DS and Wii U, too. So yes, it absolutely doesn't address my concerns.

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As long as they annouce the console first and what it can do BEFORE showing off the controller (which i hope won't be another gimmick-based one) then i'll be happy enough.

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Yes, I have. Thanks.

 

Nintendo has formed a partnership with a single Japanese company to get into the mobile market - a trend if this were still 2009. Unconfirmed for the West too, I believe. It really does nothing to address my concerns. The news has very little to do with the 3DS and Wii U, too. So yes, it absolutely doesn't address my concerns.

It's not unconfirmed for the west. They said outright that this is a global strategy

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Okay, so yes, I saw the news this morning and my point still stands.

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Have you seen the news today?

 

As they're still keeping their console division, what does this have to do with allaying the concerns Daft levelled at the system?

 

All you've done is shown they've done it, but not remotely in a way that would challenge Daft's point.

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Really, you don't think it could one day be the future of gaming? I'd say that desire to be immersed in a world almost entirely favours the possibility that it could one day be the future of gaming. At the very least, in its current stage it is bowling people over. In terms of what games it could apply to, it seems like it would work with almost anything (if you still retain character movement with a joystick and use the headset for on the spot turning combined with hand/arm movements). Who knows where it could lead?

 

A huge portion of gamers (especially "casual" gamers) play with other people around them (friends, family, kids). VR is quite simply a "no go" for situations like that. For VR you have to be able to cut yourself away from everything else for a decent amount of time.

 

It's simply not a convenient way to play.

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A huge portion of gamers (especially "casual" gamers) play with other people around them (friends, family, kids). VR is quite simply a "no go" for situations like that. For VR you have to be able to cut yourself away from everything else for a decent amount of time.

 

It's simply not a convenient way to play.

 

Nah, it's all about online gaming now. You hear all about how many games don't even have local play options anymore. You could say the same thing about headsets - that people won't use them as they can't talk to people around them. Truth is, people use them. And a lot of people, a lot of the time...game alone.

 

You're also assuming that the experience wouldn't be good enough for people to go to the extent of donning a headgear. Of course people would don a headset if VR turns out to be awesome (which it kinda sounds like it is shaping up to be already). People go to cinemas and sit in dark rooms where they can't talk in order to enjoy films. People will also do this if it's a worthwhile experience they can't have any other way.

Edited by Sheikah

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Nah, it's all about online gaming now. You hear all about how many games don't even have local play options anymore.

 

I'm not talking about them playing with others. They play with other people in the room.

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