Project CARS

[Happenstance]

Updated Quotes:

 

UPDATE 27/2/15 1.40pm: Project Cars developer Slightly Mad Studios has responded to the outcry from Nintendo fans at the news that the racer's Wii U port may never be released.

 

Yesterday, the studio stated that the game's latest build was struggling to run on Nintendo's platform - currently at 720p23fps.

 

Studio boss Ian Bell explained that the game may now launch on Nintendo's forthcoming NX console instead, whenever that is released.

 

Today, in a statement to our friends at Nintendo Life, Bell defended the studio's decision and reminded fans that the Wii U version had always been a "maybe".

 

"Project Cars/Weapons of Mass Development opened funding initially as a free-to-play PC only racing game. This is when the bulk of the funding arrived. Funding was closed late 2013," Bell explained.

 

"By vote of the members, it changed to a boxed product PC/Xbox 360/PS3 and 'maybe Wii U' game. It was always 'maybe' as we had no knowledge of the system.

 

"It was again changed, by vote of the members, to a PC/Xbox One/PS4 next-gen game with still 'maybe Wii U' and Steam OS. The funding, as I said above, was closed long before this.

 

"We still haven't given up on Wii U 100 per cent but if we can't make it work we will move to the next Nintendo machine."

 

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2015-05-26-project-cars-wii-u-development-stalled-may-be-delayed-until-nx

[Sheikah]

 

As for your film comment, I don't know even know where to begin with it. So making a film is easier? (not sure this IS what you're saying but seems it)

 

Oh come off it. How did you interpret that from what I said?

 

I was pointing out the comparison you made is not a very good one, in the context of things. A film will play the same on any Blu Ray player, so you could make a kickstarter saying "I will make a film and release it on Blu Ray", and nobody will kick up a fuss because everyone with a Blu Ray player can play it. Whether the film or crap or not is a completely separate issue.

 

It's not the same for games as all games consoles are different, both in terms of power, architecture and difficulty to develop for. You could pitch a game, say it's coming to Wii U, then partway through development find out that actually the machine isn't really as capable as you'd initially thought.

 

Fact is, it's all time and money, that is all it is. They COULD make it work on the wii u. All art forms are the same, with time/money you know what you are capable of achieving. They knew the game, the knew the hardware, they can work it. They are choosing not to. Exactly the same as a film, you know what kind of film you want to make (always surprises along the way), you know your budget and the promises you made. You don't do it that is an unbelievable failure.

 

"It's all time and money" - two finite resources. Who is to say they don't have the money/staff to produce such a scaled back separate Wii U version? Maybe their initial pledge was based on the belief the Wii U was more capable. As I say, this is all round bad for them (they don't honour their pledge in bringing it to Wii U and piss people off, or they scale back their game and people get pissed off), so it's not like they would have deliberately set out to deceive. So let's just say, perhaps, they are telling the truth and this is an unfortunate thing to happen?

 

Using kickstarter as an excuse is so pitiful. What if they pitched the same thing to a publisher - they agreed a budget, the systems, they can just say - you know what, we can't do it? I really don't think so, and if they did they'd struggle for work afterward. Fact is, they CAN get away with it, because people accept it, like you - it's kickstarter! It's fine. Or even worse like you did, blame Nintendo - now that was hilarious!

 

It's a shame you're back to mockery! What I accept is reality - that not everything always goes as planned. What seems possible on a specific budget may not be possible months later when you find out the machine isn't quite capable. Just recently, The Witcher 3 graphics were downgraded on consoles as the machines couldn't manage such PC-like graphics. Again, is this 'ignorance', or is game development a teensy bit complicated and impossible to know everything about in advance?

 

* Also, "people like me" do not accept shoddy kickstarters because people like me very rarely use kickstarter anyway. So less of the prejudging, eh?

[liger05]

Surely it's not that difficult to grasp that the wii u is just an underpowered system which makes running this game a difficult task. There is no agenda or conspiracy.

 

If Nintendo released a capable system it would be getting the game.

[gaggle64]

I love my WiiU to bits but if that's the console you bought hoping to play games like Project Cars you bought the wrong one.

[dazzybee]

@Sheikah I think film/game is an absolutely fine comparison. It isn't just about the end product, it's not about a film plays on a blurry player, it's about creating the product you promise. On a film anything from effects to the actors, to scripting issues, and a number of other things can delay, get in the way, compromise a film shoot. In the same way the technicality of a console can affect a game. Do you know your medium, or don't you?! (not a question to you)

 

Fact is, if they were paid by a publisher and said they'd make the game for the wii u under the budget promise they would have. They don't have to, so they won't.

 

As for finite rescources, yep, agreed, definitely the reason it's become an issue, my problem though is they knew the boundaries (being platforms and finances) they were working to, they failed. Running out of money is only an excuse. A cheap excuse.

 

Surely it's not that difficult to grasp that the wii u is just an underpowered system which makes running this game a difficult task. There is no agenda or conspiracy.

 

If Nintendo released a capable system it would be getting the game.

 

No one has every disputed that. Not once. Not that this discussion is about. That's exactly the issue.

 

The problem is if they promised people a wii u version, continued to promise that, then it's an awful act to then abandon it.

[Happenstance]

The problem is if they promised people a wii u version, continued to promise that, then it's an awful act to then abandon it.

 

They've confirmed they didnt promise a Wii U version, they said "maybe a Wii U version" because they didnt know the system architecture etc.

[liger05]

They've confirmed they didnt promise a Wii U version, they said "maybe a Wii U version" because they didnt know the system architecture etc.

 

Not sure that's exactly true. From what I remember back when the other versions were delayed and they said the wii u version would come later. They didn't really need to say that and by then they must of known the wii u system.

 

Remember when they originally said the wii u version was still coming many people were worried then and thought the game would get cancelled and hey presto looks like that's what happened.

 

If anything as soon as the 360/ps3 versions were cancelled the writing was on the wall.

Edited May 27, 2015 by liger05

[Sheikah]

Fact is, if they were paid by a publisher and said they'd make the game for the wii u under the budget promise they would have. They don't have to, so they won't.

 

Actually not at all true. Going back to the publisher and asking for more money/time happens all the time. And you can bet your ass the publisher, like all the others, would have dropped the Wii U due its current status 10 times quicker than they did themselves!

 

Game delays happen all the time (with staff obviously continuing to be paid while said game is polished). It's really not incompetence, it's just reality. At least having done a kickstarter they can make their own mind up and choose quality over cutbacks. Maybe a publisher would have forced them to make cutbacks if the Wii U was popular, but we'd probably be left with a shitter game. Ifs and buts.

 

As for finite rescources, yep, agreed, definitely the reason it's become an issue, my problem though is they knew the boundaries (being platforms and finances) they were working to, they failed. Running out of money is only an excuse. A cheap excuse.

 

Nobody knows the boundaries! That's the point. They could only manage 23 FPS, so clearly they didn't know at the very beginning that the Wii U would not be able to handle what they had in mind.

 

I also don't know how you can say losing money is just an excuse. If I ran out of money I can assure you I would not be able to do very much, either.

 

The problem is if they promised people a wii u version, continued to promise that, then it's an awful act to then abandon it.

 

Really? Where was your voice when they abandoned the PS3/360 versions, out of interest?

 

 

They've confirmed they didnt promise a Wii U version, they said "maybe a Wii U version" because they didnt know the system architecture etc.

 

Then I guess we really can't blame them at all. I was looking for their original crowdfunding page but couldn't find it.

Edited May 27, 2015 by Sheikah
Automerged Doublepost

[Happenstance]

Not sure that's exactly true. From what I remember back when the other versions were delayed and they said the wii u version would come later. They didn't really need to say that and by then they must of known the wii u system.

 

Remember when they originally said the wii u version was still coming many people were worried then and thought the game would get cancelled and hey presto looks like that's what happened.

 

If anything as soon as the 360/ps3 versions were cancelled the writing was on the wall.

 

I cant say if its true or not. I did check on their site to see if the crowd funding pages were still there but they didnt seem to be. I'm willing to take them at their word though that it was the wording used in the original pitches.

[khilafah]

This was from an interview. Just seems like the further they got on with development the problems arose. Remember the PS4/Xbox one/PC kept being delayed.

 

I think SMS have tried to be honest even though I believe they knew this month's ago. Without cutting back lots the Wii U version's runs like crap. SMS could have said this month's ago but least they have finally come clean.

 

Statements from Andy Tudor of Slightly Mad Studios...

Tudor wrote:

We always prefer to aim for 30fps generally in order to keep gameplay-specific features like having more cars on track or better weather effects etc.

 

So that’s standard across all consoles, and we’re more likely to utilize the native 720p support of the Wii U for launch especially since our physics and rendering systems demand a lot of processing power in order to deliver a truly next-gen experience.

 

All you need to know is that when you get the game, it’ll look and feel amazing and you’ll want to show it off to your friends.

 

Tudor wrote:

the gamepad just screams new innovations for gameplay and is a perfect match when thinking about using the gyroscope as a handheld wheel like in mario kart wii and showing data on the screen such as a map, telemetry, speedo, or rear view mirror. When you couple that with miiverse functionality and community it’s a no-brainer.

Interviewer: regarding the wii u version, how are you going to use the gamepad? Will it have off-tv? Will it use the gyro sensor? Will you be able to use the touch screen to change the camera angles?

 

Tudor: as soon as the wii u was announced we were like `oh my god, this looks amazing! We need to work on this´. There are loads of ways to use the gamepad: As the rear-view mirror, or the parameters screen or for storing all hud elements, or using the gyro to control the car...

 

There are lots of opportunities with the wii u gamepad, and we want to use it as much as we can because it´s so cool! There´s also miiverse, which lets people post screen and post their thoughts on a game... The wii u is full of opportunities.

 

Interviewer: what features of the madness engine will be cut down for the wii u version in comparison to the pc build?

 

Tudor: well, you´ll need to talk to our code team about that (laughs). But i can tell you that we´re making all the versions at the same time, so it´s not like we´re making the pc version and then we port it to consoles afterwards.

 

But obviously, each console has its strengths and weaknesses, so the code team will have to make compromises and work out what suits each platform´s strengths better. The pc version, on the other hand, is going to be amazing! It will have the best resolution and the best graphics, obviously.

 

What we´re going to make sure is that the wii u version is not the worst one, it won´t be a crappy version. We want people to get the game and say `holy s***, that looks amazing!´

 

Tudor wrote:

we obviously delayed until 2015, and there were some passionate people who got in touch with us about that. There's no conspiracy here - we announced the wii u very early on in our development cycle, and some people think because we've been working on it a lot longer so it should be out now.

 

The xbox one version looks wicked, the pc version looks awesome, so does the ps4 version. It's not our goal to rush the wii u version and have it not look as good as the other ones.

 

The nintendo fans we've got are crying out for a game like this. They don't really have that experience currently, and there hasn't really been anything like it on wii previously. It's not our job to disappoint those guys. So when we say the wii u version is delayed in 2015 because we need a little more time, that's all it is.

 

We just want to make sure it's of the same standard of all the other games. To do that, we just need a little more time. I've seen the wii u version, i've seen it quite regularly. It's got dynamic time of day, weather - it looks phenomenal. And the actual console itself is quite good.

[Fierce_LiNk]

This is a strange situation, but ultimately, nobody cares.

 

Yup. I'm being serious. Nobody really cares. The industry has got a new next/now-gen racing sim. Slight Mad Studios have got their name out there and have created a great game that has reviewed pretty well and has been received well by gamers.

 

So where does that leave Nintendo gamers. Well...they were already fucked to begin with, tbh. The Wii wasn't blessed with an abundance of good racers and the racers it did get (third party efforts) were massively inferior to what the other systems offered. (I'm including PC in this, too) The WiiU is continuing with that trend. Hardware that is doomed from the beginning and now a console that isn't selling.

 

The question is how funding would've gone if they had not promised to release it for the system.

 

It wouldn't have made a difference.

 

Let's look at a number of scenarios. First of all, if you own more than one system, you wouldn't buy the WiiU version because it would have been inferior anyway. Unless there was some massive change in direction with the WiiU version which we don't know about, of course, but that's extremely unlikely at this stage. So, already that rules out this sort of audience. When you're buying a racing sim of this kind, you're going to want to buy the best or at least the more technologically advanced version of it.

 

So, what about WiiU only gamers? Well, the install base isn't that big to begin with and it's not growing all that much. So, at the start, potential sales aren't going to be great. But, is there an audience for this type of game? The answer has to be a resounding no. At this point, the only real people who are sticking with the WiiU are either gamers who want to play EVERYTHING (and who are more likely to get CARS on another more advanced system) or the pure Nintendo-only gamers...who probably won't get the game. Need for Speed Most Wanted has sold just over 201 thousand copies on the WiiU...it sold about 2.7million on the PS3. The audience for this type of game isn't there. If you want this type of experience, you're more likely to find it somewhere else.

 

I love my WiiU to bits but if that's the console you bought hoping to play games like Project Cars you bought the wrong one.

 

Pretty much this. I covered this thought in the above post.

 

So, to sum up: nobody cares. PC/PS4/One owners have got their game and this will just go down as another game that isn't coming to the WiiU (The Witcher, Batman, Fifa, Destiny, etc) or will come but be massively gimped and an inferior product (Watch Dogs). I don't blame Slightly Mad for holding their hands up and saying "we tried" because it was a whole heap of work and it probably isn't worth it for all they could have gained. Yes, it's shitty to say there's a WiiU version in the works and then not to come out with it, but I don't think many will kick up a fuss over this one. So few will be affected by this.

Edited May 27, 2015 by Fierce_LiNk

[bob]

Maybe they could have spent some of that extra money on coming up with a better name.

 

Project CARS sounds like something you'd come up with while stoned.

[Hogge]

 

It wouldn't have made a difference.

 

Let's look at a number of scenarios. First of all, if you own more than one system, you wouldn't buy the WiiU version because it would have been inferior anyway. Unless there was some massive change in direction with the WiiU version which we don't know about, of course, but that's extremely unlikely at this stage. So, already that rules out this sort of audience. When you're buying a racing sim of this kind, you're going to want to buy the best or at least the more technologically advanced version of it.

 

So, what about WiiU only gamers? Well, the install base isn't that big to begin with and it's not growing all that much. So, at the start, potential sales aren't going to be great. But, is there an audience for this type of game? The answer has to be a resounding no. At this point, the only real people who are sticking with the WiiU are either gamers who want to play EVERYTHING (and who are more likely to get CARS on another more advanced system) or the pure Nintendo-only gamers...who probably won't get the game. Need for Speed Most Wanted has sold just over 201 thousand copies on the WiiU...it sold about 2.7million on the PS3. The audience for this type of game isn't there. If you want this type of experience, you're more likely to find it somewhere else.

You're right in what you're writing. However, we're talking about the crowdfunding situation and not potential sales.

I don't think that I'm the only one who was interrested in Project Cars solely because it was a Gran Turismo-ish game that would come out for a Nintendo system. With the Wii U version cancelled, I see no draw in this game, because I already own Forza 2, 3 and 4. As a matter of fact, I do know that there are people who funded this project for this very reason. I can't tell how large of a percentage of the funding came from people like this, it may very well be insignifficant. However, it may also be so much that the game would not have been able to reach its current level of sophistication without those funds.

 

In all likelyhood we'll never know. And as I said: this is a sound business decision.

[khilafah]

project cars 2 crowdfunding announced. no Wii U

 

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2015-06-22-project-cars-2-announced-launches-crowdfunding-campaign

[Wii]

project cars 2 crowdfunding announced. no Wii U

 

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2015-06-22-project-cars-2-announced-launches-crowdfunding-campaign

 

That's because it'll be on the NX.

 

I'd say the first game in in the dumpster as far as Wii U is concerned. We might get a double pack for the NX instead.

[Fierce_LiNk]

That's because it'll be on the NX.

 

I'd say the first game in in the dumpster as far as Wii U is concerned. We might get a double pack for the NX instead.

 

Why bother going to the effort?

 

By the time NX rolls around, everybody who wants to play the game will have already done it by then. Also, the NX won't have the install base of the other systems by then, as it'll be just released (possibly)

 

(also, we don't even know what the NX is or if it could even handle the game)

[Wii]

Ye mightn't know what the NX is but I do. It can handle it.

 

By the time NX rolls around, everybody who wants to play the game will have already done it by then.

 

Isn't that already the case? It may be easier to port to the NX than cutting and limiting it so it can run on the Wii U. They've previously expressed a desire to running the game on Nintendo's next console. We've seen absolutely 0 assets from a Wii U version and the game's been out over a month on PS4/XB1.

[Wii]

Project CARS Studio Head “Really Dislikes Nintendo Users”

 

Project CARS gets more heat that most third-party developers from Nintendo fans. Developer Slightly Mad Studios is not blameless in the matter — they initially promised a Wii U version of the game in their crowdfunding campaign and made numerous statements regarding the “fine” progress on the Nintendo version. Then, out of the blue, they put the Wii U version of Project CARS on an indefinite hiatus, pointing to serious optimization issues.

 

With this in mind, many Wii U owners and backers have flocked to the Project CARS forums asking for answers. While most responses have been civil from the developers, Slightly Mad’s Head of Studio, Ian Bell, had enough with one particular Wii U rant and went on to say “we really dislike Nintendo users.” Check out the entire conversation below.

 

 

Project CARS has been released for Xbox, PlayStation, and PC — Slightly Mad is hoping to bring over the game and series to Nintendo NX.

 

http://mynintendonews.com/2015/06/25/project-cars-studio-head-really-dislikes-nintendo-users/

[Cube]

From what I heard, loads of their fans are pretty annoyed. Especially due to them kickstarting the second one before loads of bugs are fixed with the first.

 

Some indie developers/teams really need to get a PR agency to handle stuff for them.

[liger05]

http://mynintendonews.com/2015/06/25/project-cars-studio-head-really-dislikes-nintendo-users/

 

Sarcasm. He wasn't being serious.

[liger05]

Game cancelled.

 

The end of the road

 

Slightly Mad Studios has confirmed to Nintendo Life that the Wii U version of Project CARS has been cancelled.

The status of the game had been thrown into doubt by recent developer comments which suggested that the team was experiencing problems porting the incredibly ambitious racer to Nintendo's system. This followed news that the Wii U version would launch later than its siblings.

 

Studio head Ian Bell then clarified the situation by stating that Project CARS on Wii U was always a "maybe", and that the release was not part of the original crowdfunding pitch. He did, however, end with a statement which suggested that the team would continue to work on the version, but were waiting to see if E3 would bring any hardware announcements from Nintendo - which, as we all know, didn't come.

 

With E3 now a distant memory, we approached Bell regarding the status of Project CARS on Wii U and received this reply:

The official line is that we're awaiting an announcement from Nintendo on new hardware. As of now pCARS is simply too much for the Wii U.

 

Project CARS is available now on PS4, Xbox One and PC, and has been a critical and commercial success. The Xbox 360 and PS3 versions were dropped midway through development.

 

Slightly Mad Studios has recently confirmed that a sequel is now in development.

 

No surprise many predicted this outcome at the initial delay.

 

Have to say the studio handled this pretty badly. Why didn't they just cancel it when they canned the 360/PS3 versions?

 

They kept saying the game was coming when they clearly had given up on a Wii U version. For the studio to claim it was always a 'maybe' is pretty bad considering as late as September 2014 they said:

 

We obviously delayed until 2015, and there were some passionate people who got in touch with us about that. There’s no conspiracy here...It’s not our job to disappoint those guys. So when we say the Wii U version is delayed in 2015 because we need a little more time, that’s all it is.

 

We just want to make sure it’s of the same standard of all the other game. I’ve seen the Wii U version, I’ve seen it quite regularly. It’s got dynamic time of day, weather – it looks phenomenal. And the actual console itself is quite good.”

 

With the Wii U port due out next year. It won’t hit the performance highs of the Xbox One and PS4 versions, though Tudor is happy with the progress Slightly Mad is making.

Edited July 21, 2015 by liger05

[Glen-i]

It was a foregone conclusion, but I still think it's incredibly scummy, considering it was originally pitched as a WiiU/PC/PS3/360 game. They should have announced it was scrapped along with the 360/PS3 versions instead of stringing people along.

 

Lovingly nicked from GAF, you wanna check page 28.

 

http://www.wmdportal.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/02/WMD_Overview_160212.pdf

 

It's inexcusable! They should be getting more flak for this.

Them saying the WiiU version was "always a maybe" is even worse.

They flat out lied. End of!

 

EDIT: This post from GAF is worth reading as well.

 

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=172555901&postcount=130

Edited July 21, 2015 by Glen-i

[liger05]

It was a foregone conclusion, but I still think it's incredibly scummy, considering it was originally pitched as a WiiU/PC/PS3/360 game. They should have announced it was scrapped along with the 360/PS3 versions instead of stringing people along.

 

Lovingly nicked from GAF, you wanna check page 28.

 

http://www.wmdportal.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/02/WMD_Overview_160212.pdf

 

It's inexcusable! They should be getting more flak for this.

Them saying the WiiU version was "always a maybe" is even worse.

They flat out lied. End of!

 

EDIT: This post from GAF is worth reading as well.

 

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=172555901&postcount=130

 

I'm trying to think of a reason to why they wouldn't just announce it was cancelled when the PS3/360 versions were. They would of know the Wii U capabilities and known that if the PS3/360 wasn't up to scratch the Wii U wasn't but they still kept mentioning how good the Wii U version would be.

 

Why do that?

[Glen-i]

I'm trying to think of a reason to why they wouldn't just announce it was cancelled when the PS3/360 versions were. They would of know the Wii U capabilities and known that if the PS3/360 wasn't up to scratch the Wii U wasn't but they still kept mentioning how good the Wii U version would be.

 

Why do that?

 

Because they were lying!

 

OK, a more sensible response...

 

My guess would be that the WiiU version never existed until the second half of 2014. They were just pretending they were working on it.

Now of course, I'm just guessing, but the impression I get is that they never actually started working on a WiiU version until the XBone/PS4 versions were pretty much done, and that's when they realised it wasn't going to work.

 

Either way, they were still lying, and it's still a big middle finger to anyone who helped to fund it and stated they would get it on the WiiU.

[Happenstance]

I haven't followed this enough to know if there's actually more to it but why do you think they were lying? All it seems to me was that they were working on different versions and the Wii U just wasn't up to snuff power wise to let them do what they wanted?