Digital Economy Bill

[MoogleViper]

edit: yes nightwolf yesssssss!!! I need my internets! I'll buy an island and make my own damn laws!! Yeaaah! /crazy

 

Can I live on your island please?

[martinist]

I'll vote this bill down like a raise for school teachers!

 

I need my south park and animes god damn it! >__<

[dwarf]

Has anything radical come of this bill yet? Apart from it getting through in the first place?

[Emasher]

I'll vote this bill down like a raise for school teachers!

 

I need my south park and animes god damn it! >__<

 

Is there really no way to watch South Park online legally in the UK? Who owns the broadcast rights?

[Debug Mode]

Just caught up to speed with whats happened and I'm fucking livid.

 

I've heard all this bollocks about New World Order, how we'l all be under corporations, controlling our lives how they see fit, took the piss out of every person who even mentioned the possibility of it, but after reading this passing and the ISP's in America winning their case, I cant help but start to believe it.

 

The thing that in a way, united us all, the final platform for free speech, is drastically going to change. Yeah, it prevents illegal downloading, whoop de fucking doo, I agree, I should probably stop stealing shit, but the copyrighted content is way too fucking vague and too much power is going into these companies, the big deal is when America's ISP ideals leak over to here, then we're in deep fucking shit.

 

Once you have the ISP's in control of what they want you to see or not, the companies will clearly do what they did to the politicians, bribe em. Block shit that'd be detrimental to their success such as competitors, negative discussions regarding their products etc.

 

Fuck you Labour and every one who supported this, if only the average person knew what power was really granted to companies with this law, there's no fucking chance in hell you'd ever get back into power. Fucking fuming.

[Dante]

Has this been posted?

 

[Cube]

Surely the flexible nature of IP addresses means that they can't be used as evidence in court?

[Ashley]

Yeah but that would require them to listen to an expert on the field, and I'm sure David Nutt would be the first to tell you that's unlikely.

 

Furthermore, so they download the illegal stuff in the process of deciding? I hope they delete it afterwards

[Emasher]

Surely the flexible nature of IP addresses means that they can't be used as evidence in court?

 

That's not the point. The Point is that the office of the person in charge of this is saying that the "IP" in IP Address stands for Intellectual Property.

[danny]

I cant even read this entire thread some of you people should be in the x files or something.

 

 

Something has to be done to stop people stealing digital media.

As for the collateral murder debate and wiki leaks, (i aint getting in to the debate on te subject again) but where is the line for stealing state secrets and putting them on the internet? People should not be stealing anyting from defence sites and anyone that does should be punished for doing so as you could unknowingly be putting people lives at risk.

[Mr_Odwin]

I cant even read this entire thread some of you people should be in the x files or something.

 

 

Something has to be done to stop people stealing digital media.

As for the collateral murder debate and wiki leaks, (i aint getting in to the debate on te subject again) but where is the line for stealing state secrets and putting them on the internet? People should not be stealing anyting from defence sites and anyone that does should be punished for doing so as you could unknowingly be putting people lives at risk.

 

Dude, do you have permission to post that image from the X-Files? That could very well be copyrighted material. So ... er ... you're the stealerer.

 

Copyright doesn't just apply to music/films.

[danny]

Dude, do you have permission to post that image from the X-Files? That could very well be copyrighted material. So ... er ... you're the stealerer.

 

Copyright doesn't just apply to music/films.

 

Well i guess i will be going to priso then wont i. I still stand by the comment that something needs to be done to stop the teft of media online. And you know exacty what i mean lol.

[Daft]

I cant even read this entire thread some of you people should be in the x files or something.

 

 

Something has to be done to stop people stealing digital media.

As for the collateral murder debate and wiki leaks, (i aint getting in to the debate on te subject again) but where is the line for stealing state secrets and putting them on the internet? People should not be stealing anyting from defence sites and anyone that does should be punished for doing so as you could unknowingly be putting people lives at risk.

 

Maybe you should read the entire thread. The issue isn't about stopping people stealing, I don't think anyone would argue against that (Although I easily could), it's about the manner in which this is being attempted.

 

As for belonging to the X-files, maybe you should look at historical precedent like how asylums in 18th C. (?) France were used to get poor and unemployed people off the street. Or how the legitimacy of psychology by the state classed homosexuals as being mentally ill. Or how the 2000 Terror Act has been used to reprimand anyone carrying a camera without any 'reasonable suspicion'. Or any of the other myriad examples instead of swallowing what your told.

 

As I think Bill Hicks said (or maybe it was someone talking about him), “That’s what being a patriot means…that you question the power.†I probably wouldn't use the word patriot.

[Rummy]

Piracy does not equal theft/stealing. I know people know that, but for those who might not, I'm re-stating it. I won't explain here how, but I would say that yes, I would download a car.

 

 

Anyway, so this bill has gone through? Who decides these things? How does it just get through like this with no sort of public consultation? I'll be honest, I'm actually a little dissappointed in the internet, I'm suprised they let something like this even happen.

 

Also, what are the actual implications of this now? If I torrent a TV show, do I lose my internet? What if I watch it on youtube? Who's making these decisions about whether I should be cut off? Is it this retard who doesn't even know what an IP address is?

 

This country is starting to scare me. How the fuck are these things managed to happen, and why is it I always seem to only find out about it AFTER it's happened?!

 

It's not one mans decision though is it? Obviously. It's no coincidence this is being rolled out in a few countries.

 

If this is to stop illegal downloading then fine, that's okay with me. I don't agree with it, but I can understand it. Just because we can argue very succesfully that illegal dowloading doesn't (or doesn't have to) have detrimental effects; the fact is, the people who own it, if they want to stop it fine.

 

My worry is how information can be used, all the copywrite bullshit, and the censorship it could entail... that's worrying but hopefully common sense will prevail.

 

I quote the whole post because I agree with it, I bold that bit because it reminds me of the supposed, and from what I understand still updated, Anti-Terrorism laws that have far too wide-ranging power. Sure, they were there to help stop and counter terrorism, but I do not doubt they have knowingly been used in a situation outside of that(in fact, a video in the thread about the police indicated as such).

[danny]

Piracy does not equal theft/stealing.

 

Yes it does. You can dress it up all you want but it just is.

[Cube]

Would you also class recording songs from a radio onto a cassette as stealing?

 

It's still illegal, but it's different to stealing.

[dwarf]

I really dislike Danny.

[danny]

Would you also class recording songs from a radio onto a cassette as stealing?

 

It's still illegal, but it's different to stealing.

 

I just dont see how you think its ok to have something for nothing. In the days of recording on cassetes it wast to the scale it is now. Yes it is theft but i think nobody worried about it. As the inpact was minimal.

But now dowloads is impacting massivley on peoples buisness.

Nothing is free in this life, and why should it be?

[Fierce_LiNk]

I really dislike Danny.

 

Aww, but he thinks you're great.

 

 

How could you say no to that face?

[danny]

Dont let people think thats me

[Fierce_LiNk]

Dont let people think thats me

 

It's Dannyboy the Dane. Don't worry, we know what he looks like!

[Rummy]

Yes it does. You can dress it up all you want but it just is.

 

No, it is not. Piracy and Copyright Infringment is not the same as stealing, just as ABH and GBH are not the same, grand theft auto and robbery are not the same etc. I didn't say anything about illegality, I just want people to not call it stealing because it isn't. I EVEN said I would download a car in the hopes it would make anybody with some sense actually put some thought into it and work it out for themselves. Just ask yourself, how would one even begin to download a car? The difference is with theft, an actual item is stolen and there is nothing left in its place(or maybe a smelly turd if you're really mean), that doesn't happen with what we're talking about, and thus it is not stealing. I'm not addressing any aspects of legality here, however, just the concept.

[Supergrunch]

I just dont see how you think its ok to have something for nothing.

Nobody said it was okay, they just said illegal downloading something wasn't stealing. The difference is that you don't deprive anyone of a physical product. Also currently (unchanged after the DEB) it's not a criminal offence, whereas stealing is.

[danny]

No, it is not. Piracy and Copyright Infringment is not the same as stealing, just as ABH and GBH are not the same, grand theft auto and robbery are not the same etc. I didn't say anything about illegality, I just want people to not call it stealing because it isn't. I EVEN said I would download a car in the hopes it would make anybody with some sense actually put some thought into it and work it out for themselves. Just ask yourself, how would one even begin to download a car? The difference is with theft, an actual item is stolen and there is nothing left in its place(or maybe a smelly turd if you're really mean), that doesn't happen with what we're talking about, and thus it is not stealing. I'm not addressing any aspects of legality here, however, just the concept.

 

Ok well in my eyes it is exactly the same thing. And this just sounds like someone trying to justify it. I see no difference. I noticed the comment about downloading a car just thought it was a daft comment and ignored it.

You are still stealing the artists work etc. You have no right to own a digita copy of it. And in my eyes it is exactly the same thing.

[Mr_Odwin]

When I was a lad, taping off the radio, taping mates tapes/CDs, creation of mix tapes, etc were all the rage. Massive amounts of that was going on. To me it doesn't feel that different these days.

 

The music business claims massive losses, but I've read other sources that say otherwise. Is there less music available these days? If labels are dying, then good, but the artists seem alright.

 

Buy my biggest point on this is that people aren't hoarding away money from the music industry and thinking "hee hee I have £40 extra in my account this month because I downloaded 6 albums!" People spend their disposable income; dvds/bds are purchased more than ever before and videogame sales are massive compared to what they were, we all have big flatscreen tvs. Everyone still spends all their money just it's distributed differently. The music industry cannot believe that though - they must be losing money to piracy, it's got to be the piracy!

Edited April 15, 2010 by Mr_Odwin