Posted June 14, 2009 They're here because they want to escape. Yet adhere to many of their religious beliefs. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted June 14, 2009 Yet adhere to many of their religious beliefs. That's not what I meant. Read my posts. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted June 15, 2009 I can only hope that these stupid ignorant people are shot or something. What a complete bunch of utter twats. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted June 15, 2009 My personal belief is that if a country lets you in you should have adhere to their rules, and laws. Im not saying they have to be christian, or shouldnt have their palces of worship..but they should follow our laws. One thing that annoys me is the fact thtat muslim wome can wear that 'thing' when they are in the airport and were refusing to remove it for the passport officer to see. Theres probobly countless other ones too. When we go to another country, we have to follow their rules.. England has become a push over to other countries. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted June 15, 2009 Islam - 1000 years behind the rest of the world Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted June 15, 2009 I would say real stupidity and narrow mindedness on the part of the parents! They should have properly investigated the matter, before deciding to punish that 'women'. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted June 15, 2009 Where the hell are you getting this information? People have been going in and out of Islam for years. I've seen plenty of people here in Egypt who've converted to Christianity as well as Athiesm (which is considered worse). The only thing close to what you're saying was a story I read in the paper about a man in Saudi Arabia who openly announced his conversion to Christianity. The worst that had happened to him was that he was exiled. It's strange how people seem to forget that if it weren't for the golden age of Islam the 21st century would be terribly different. That's because Egypt is surprisingly liberal for a Middle Eastern country, and because of its 15-20% Christian minority, it kinda has to be. But the Egyptian government, despite being an example to Egypt's far more conservative neighbours, still has its problems. The government is all too happy to accept Christian converts to Islam, but makes the lives of people trying to convert from Islam to Christianity very difficult. In Islam, apostasy is called "ridda" ("turning back") and is considered to be a profound insult to God. A person born of Muslim parents that rejects Islam is called a "murtad fitri" (natural apostate), and a person that converted to Islam and later rejects the religion is called a "murtad milli" (apostate from the community).[citation needed] According to most scholars, if a Muslim consciously and without coercion declares their rejection of Islam and does not change their mind after the time given to him/her by a judge for research, then the penalty for male apostates is death, and for women, life imprisonment. However, this view has been rejected by a small minority of modern Muslim scholars (eg Hasan al-Turabi), who argues that the hadith in question should be taken to apply only to political betrayal of the Muslim community, rather than to apostasy in general.[10] These scholars regard apostasy as a serious crime, but argue for the freedom to convert to and from Islam without legal penalty, and consider the aforementioned Hadith quote as insufficient justification for capital punishment. Today apostasy is punishable by death in the countries of Saudi Arabia, Yemen, Somalia, Iran, Sudan, Afghanistan, Mauritania and the Comoros. In Qatar apostasy is a capital offense, but no executions have been reported for it.[11] The hadith has been used both by supporters of the death penalty as well as critics of Islam. Some Islamic scholars[citation needed] point out it is important to understand the hadith in proper historical context. The order was at a time when the nascent Muslim community in Medina was fighting for its very life, and there were many schemes, by which the enemies of Islam would try to entice rebellion and discord within the community.[12] Clearly any defection would have serious consequences for the Muslims, and the hadith may well be about treason, rather than just apostasy. It must also be pointed out that under the terms of the Treaty of Hudaybiyyah, any Muslim who returned to Mecca was not to be returned, terms which the Prophet accepted. Despite this historical point, Islamic law as currently practiced does not allow the freedom to choose one's religion. The Qur'an says: Let there be no compulsion in the religion: Clearly the Right Path (i.e. Islam) is distinct from the crooked path. —Qur'an, [Qur'an 2:256] A section of the 'People of the Book' (Jews and Christians) says: "Believe in the morning what is revealed to the believers (Muslims), but reject it at the end of the day; perchance they may (themselves) turn back (from Islam). —Qur'an, [Qur'an 3:72] But those who reject faith after they accepted it, and then go on adding to their defiance of faith, never will their repentance be accepted; for they are those who have (of set purpose) gone astray. —Qur'an, [Qur'an 3:90] Those who blasphemed and back away from the ways of Allah and die as blasphemers, Allah shall not forgive them. —Qur'an, [Qur'an 4:48] Those who believe, then reject faith, then believe (again) and (again) reject faith, and go on increasing in unbelief,- Allah will not forgive them nor guide them on the way. —Qur'an, [Qur'an 4:137] O ye who believe! If any from among you turn back from his faith, soon will Allah produce a people whom He (Allah) will love as they will love Him lowly with the believers, Mighty against the rejecters, fighting in the way of Allah, and never afraid of the reproachers of such as find fault. That is the Grace of Allah which He will bestow on whom He (Allah) pleases. And Allah encompasses all, and He knows all things. —Qur'an, [Qur'an 5:54] The Hadith (a collection of sayings attributed to Muhammad and his companions) includes statements taken as supporting the death penalty for apostasy, such as: Kill whoever changes his religion. Sahih al-Bukhari 9:84:57 The blood of a Muslim who confesses that none has the right to be worshipped but Allah and that I am His Apostle, cannot be shed except in three cases: In Qisas for murder, a married person who commits illegal sexual intercourse and the one who reverts from Islam (apostate) and leaves the Muslims. Sahih al-Bukhari 9:83:17 Javed Ahmad Ghamidi, a Pakistani Islamic scholar, writes that punishment for apostasy was part of Divine punishment for only those who denied the truth even after clarification in its ultimate form by Muhammad (he uses term Itmam al-hujjah), hence, he considers this command for a particular time and no longer punishable.[13] In 2006, Abdul Rahman, the Afghan convert from Islam to Christianity has attracted worldwide attention about where Islam stood on religious freedom. Prosecutors asked for the death penalty for him. However, under heavy pressure from foreign governments, the Afghan government claimed he was mentally unfit to stand trial and released him. Islam Online, a website,[citation needed] contains a fatwa dated 21 March 2004 and ascribed to 'IOL Shariah Researchers' says: "If a sane person who has reached puberty voluntarily apostatizes from Islam, he deserves to be punished. In such a case, it is obligatory for the caliph (or his representative) to ask him to repent and return to Islam. If he does, it is accepted from him, but if he refuses, he is immediately killed."[14] No one besides the caliph or his representative may kill the apostate. If someone else kills him, the killer is disciplined (for arrogating the caliph's prerogative and encroaching upon his rights, as this is one of his duties). http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apostasy That's where I'm getting this crap from. And, despite having its issues, Wikipedia is the closest thing to an unbiased, reliable online encyclopedia we have. Even in the West, it was only a year ago on BBC radio 4 that they were interviewing a female convert from Islam who fears for her life. The 21st century may look different if it were not for Islam, but it would also look different if it hadn't been for the Romans, or the Greeks, or even the British. Doesn't mean to say that if I travelled to Ancient Greece it would be modern. My personal belief is that if a country lets you in you should have adhere to their rules, and laws.Im not saying they have to be christian, or shouldnt have their palces of worship..but they should follow our laws. One thing that annoys me is the fact thtat muslim wome can wear that 'thing' when they are in the airport and were refusing to remove it for the passport officer to see. Theres probobly countless other ones too. When we go to another country, we have to follow their rules.. England has become a push over to other countries. Personally, I find the 'veil' intimidating, and very few Western Muslim women choose to wear it, for obvious reasons. But each to their own, you've got to respect religions and all that. Yet adhere to many of their religious beliefs. I know that if I ended up in another country and by some strange turn of events had to permantly settle there, I'd want to keep my (lack of) religious beliefs. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted June 15, 2009 It's strange how people seem to forget that if it weren't for the golden age of Islam the 21st century would be terribly different. No AL fucking Qaeda Islam - 1000 years behind the rest of the world Actually Islam is trying to take us back 1000 years as some nutters are trying to start nuclear war Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted June 15, 2009 (edited) Poor woman, hopefully she'll be taken on in another school that isn't so restrictive. Its a shame that such a society and group of people, come to england looking for hope, somewhere to live, only to shun those who are teaching them, helping them and generally being part of their lives. Religion or not, it seems incredibly silly what she does outside of the school. I wish people muslim or not would realise that if you act like an idiot it'll be returned and that is why they are a close knit community rather than branching out, why they have to have special schools rather than allowing more languages at standard schools, I don't think it'd be a problem to learn eastern languages at high school, it'd been pretty cool to have that option. Edited June 15, 2009 by nightwolf Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted June 15, 2009 One thing that annoys me is the fact thtat muslim wome can wear that 'thing' when they are in the airport and were refusing to remove it for the passport officer to see. Honestly, can't the passport officers just find a female officer to do it and be done with it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted June 16, 2009 No AL fucking Qaeda Actually Islam is trying to take us back 1000 years as some nutters are trying to start nuclear war at that post Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted June 16, 2009 Honestly, can't the passport officers just find a female officer to do it and be done with it. I believe they refuse to 'show' to female officers, something like only showing themselves to their husbands or something if I recall. Its a hypocritical society, a woman who is christian may not be allowed to wear a cross, yet a muslim can practise their religion very freely. I see no fairness in it all. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted June 16, 2009 No AL fucking Qaeda Actually Islam is trying to take us back 1000 years as some nutters are trying to start nuclear war The heck is this shit?! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted June 16, 2009 Its a hypocritical society, a woman who is christian may not be allowed to wear a cross, yet a muslim can practise their religion very freely. I see no fairness in it all. Ah yes, the victim complex. Everyone's a victim. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted June 16, 2009 Its a hypocritical society, a woman who is christian may not be allowed to wear a cross, yet a muslim can practise their religion very freely. I see no fairness in it all. I don't either Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted June 16, 2009 Its a hypocritical society, a woman who is christian may not be allowed to wear a cross, yet a muslim can practise their religion very freely. I see no fairness in it all. I can't see anyone being banned outright from wearing a Crucifix. There's a difference between practising religion (wearing a Crucifix isn't a definite part of Christianity, by the way) and a company (presuming you're referring to the BA story) not wanting to be seen associating itself with a particular religion. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted June 17, 2009 This baffles me, it really does. I don't know the language, so do these two numbers sound similar? http://uk.news.yahoo.com/4/20090617/twl-tattoo-girl-wakes-to-see-stars-41f21e0.html Plus... that tattooist... fucking hell. Anyone having plans on getting tattoos? Stay awake if you can. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted June 17, 2009 That's a very strange one. Like you, I don't know the language but I seriously doubt that '3' and '56' sound similar enough for that to happen. And I would doubt that anyone would want 56 stars tattooed across their face like that, even though there are people that would do it it just sounds like this girl isn't the kind of person who'd ask for it. To me, there must have been some mis-communication but I don't think falling asleep did her any good. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted June 17, 2009 i think she wanted him to do it. then realised what a fool she looked and is trying to blag him paying for laser treatment. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted June 17, 2009 Seriously though... how can you fall asleep when your having inked-up needles pressed into your skin? I would have thought you'd be more awake than ever in a situation like that. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted June 17, 2009 (edited) why would you want a tattoo on your face Edited June 17, 2009 by or else you will DIE Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted June 17, 2009 Obviously lying. I'm gonna get a tatto, but words, so there won't be much margin for this kinda thing. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted June 17, 2009 Yea a tattoo artist isn't going to intentionally mix that up. I mean an 18 year old girl, giving her 56 stars? He would know that would come back around unless he thought it was what she wanted. Either mis-communication or lies on the girls part. She does seem genuinely upset though in that video but then again, stars on your face doesn't look as pretty as it sounds. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted June 17, 2009 The heck is this shit?! It is missing the original quotes from the original post Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
