Has Nintendo really lost it?

[Shino]

So, you're saying that what is on release lists now, is definitely what is all we'll be seeing throughout the year?

 

It doesn't work like that either.

 

As a Nintendo fan, you should know better that Nintendo are always planning their next move. The next big thing.

 

Like Serebii says, gamers have the "if it isn't shown, it doesn't exist" attitude. There are two types of people: Pessimists and Optimists.

 

I'm an Optimist. At E3, I saw the online voice chat, the confirmation of a new Pikmin, a new WiiSports, and Animal Crossing confirmed.

 

Pessimists saw No new Zelda, no new Mario, no new franchises, and no huge announcements.

 

Pessimist is what an optimist calls a realist. :p

 

Personaly I never expected Zelda, Mario or Metroid, in fact I never even want them, this 3 franchises need some cool down time. I did expect a Kid Icarus or a F-Zero something more to my tastes besides the now mainstream casual. But I can live with that, I know Nintendo has very special things reserved for us. But the problem is I don't think we'll have many games this year, specially "core" games and specially in Europe. Even Animal Crossing, how long will it take them to localise it?

 

I think everyone here is forgetting something....

 

When did Nintendo ever really attempt to please the 'core' or 'hardcore' gamers? Over the GameCube's lifespan how great games did we get from Nintendo for the 'core' gamers? I think by the end of the Wii's lifespan the number will be very different. The only difference between now and when the GameCube was around is that the Wii has hit mainstream because of the Wiimote.

 

If you want games for 'core games' head over to Microsoft or Sony, if you want casual games with the occaisional AAA title made by Nintendo, go for a Wii.

 

I think your definition of core games is different from ours.

[Emasher]

Pessimist is what an optimist calls a realist. :p

 

Personaly I never expected Zelda, Mario or Metroid, in fact I never even want them, this 3 franchises need some cool down time. I did expect a Kid Icarus or a F-Zero something more to my tastes besides the now mainstream casual. But I can live with that, I know Nintendo has very special things reserved for us. But the problem is I don't think we'll have many games this year, specially "core" games and specially in Europe. Even Animal Crossing, how long will it take them to localise it?

 

 

 

I think your definition of core games is different from ours.

 

There are still a few games though. Wario Land, Disaster(maybe). Why not just import Animal Crossing?

 

And there are tons of 3rd party games coming out this year.

[Tellyn]

I think everyone here is forgetting something....

 

When did Nintendo ever really attempt to please the 'core' or 'hardcore' gamers? Over the GameCube's lifespan how great games did we get from Nintendo for the 'core' gamers? I think by the end of the Wii's lifespan the number will be very different. The only difference between now and when the GameCube was around is that the Wii has hit mainstream because of the Wiimote.

 

If you want games for 'core games' head over to Microsoft or Sony, if you want casual games with the occaisional AAA title made by Nintendo, go for a Wii.

 

The 'core'/casual thing is beginning to piss me off now, what the hell does it matter as long as you enjoy what you're playing? I'm not going to pick up Wii Sports Resort and think "Oh, this should have been Zelda, I'm going to buy a PS3 for some HARDCORE GAMING!" If you begin being so picky as to sell up one console for another because it doesn't have an endless stream of first person shooters or because it's 'casual', then you don't really understand the point of gaming.

[Hero-of-Time]

The 'core'/casual thing is beginning to piss me off now, what the hell does it matter as long as you enjoy what you're playing? I'm not going to pick up Wii Sports Resort and think "Oh, this should have been Zelda, I'm going to buy a PS3 for some HARDCORE GAMING!" If you begin being so picky as to sell up one console for another because it doesn't have an endless stream of first person shooters or because it's 'casual', then you don't really understand the point of gaming.

 

Yeah, but as its been said before it really comes to what games you class as fun.

 

I said this during E3 in one of the MSN convos how I really cant get into the AC games as I get bored with them very quickly. The same goes for Wii Sports, great game in its own right but its just not for me.

 

Being a multiconsole owner this gen has really paid off for me as I been able to find the games that I do enjoy playing, such as RPGs, FPS etc on other consoles while at the same time I still get to play on the Wii when a title does come out that I really want to play, like Zelda, Mario etc.

 

Sure Nintendo will have the Pikimins, F-zeros, Stafox games in development but as it stands my Wii will continue to gather dust until a games comes out which I find fun.

[Guest Jordan]

A 'core game' seems to be a game with a goal or an ending of some sort.

 

Nintendo's new Wii games do not have this. Open ended gameplay is something i do not enjoy, at all. Animal Crossing was a complete turn off for me, Wii Sports got boring very quickly and I will not be a fan of Wii Music. If i want a music game, i'll be playing Rock Band. Rock Band is fucking awesome, nothing touches it with a 20 foot metal pole in terms of the excellence of fun you can have with that game.

 

There are new games coming out, Nintendo no longer uses E3 as a 'core' event. They use it to attract mass media attention, heck some US morning TV shows probably mentioned "zomg new Wii games". Me? I'll be waiting for Leipzig or TGS. For all we know, Pikmin is coming along very, very well and it might even be out Q4 this year.

[Ren of Heavens]

we all agree that there has been a sudden lack of nintendo games compared to gamecube for instance but..

Really? Do we forget that easily?...

I remember long waits and much complaining about stuff like Metroid Prime and Wind Waker being delayed over and over and 6 months game droughts from Nintendo. The launch was pretty bad with Luigi's Mansion as their big game. Mario Sunshine and Mario Kart DD was perhaps the worst in the series as well as disappointments like Pokemon XD and Kirby's Air Ride. Nintendo released only 2 (!) games worth getting the last 2,5 years (Metroid Prime 2, Fire Emblem) before the Wii arrived.

[steggy]

A 'core game' seems to be a game with a goal or an ending of some sort.

 

Ah, but I would consider Sim City to be a "core" game but that didn't have an ending. : peace:

[DCK]

Following on that, it was a risk to come out with a console that deliberately didn’t court hardcore gamers, and with such a different control scheme — particularly after the GameCube (which enjoyed only moderate success). At what point did you know that the risk had paid off?

Miyamoto: The first that I’d want to clarify is that the concept that Wii intentionally does not cater to core gamers is probably a misconception, and perhaps one that’s almost a PR tactic used by some of the other companies to paint us as a company that’s not targeting core gamers. But in fact, while we may not be focusing on the high-end graphics and technology that core gamers would typically be drawn to, the types of games we create, and continue to create, are certainly games that people who play games would certainly want to continue playing.

I think that there’s probably one other element to it, and that’s that our view of how we use E3 has changed. For a very long time, E3 was an event where — and certainly Nintendo included — catered specifically to the core gamer. Now we look at more …an opportunity for us to introduce new concepts and new types of play that we intend to bring to the broader audience, particularly because of the media that gathers at E3 now.

So while attending an E3 event like this, they might be given the impression that Nintendo is no longer focusing on the games that appeal to the core gamer, in fact we’re still working on many of those titles, but it’s just not the type of event where we’ll be showcasing that anymore.

This. This is exactly the vibe I got when I saw the conference.

 

You've got to admit that if this is what they intended, they did more than awesome.

 

We still need more stuff this Q4. I think Nintendo's overestimating third parties.

[Tellyn]

I don't know, we do have some awesome third party stuff coming up towards the end of the year. If titles such as Force Unleashed, De Blob, Deadly Creatures, Call of Duty, Sonic Unleashed and Guitar Hero fare well, then it might make other developers more optimistic and motivated to make more high quality games and to spend more time on them rather than doing a rush job.

[killer kirby]

Nintendo has done well, IMO. It's obvious that Nintendo want to give more room to the 3rd party companies with thier games, the only thing we saw was the what the English companies have. Just wait until TGS, I am sure there will be plenty of A titles (I am sick of the whole AAA title crap).

 

But I still so many games coming out for us this year.

 

Animal Crossing

Wii Music

Final Fantasy IV

Dragon Quest IV

Little King's story

Harvest Moon Wii

Chocobo Dungeon

Chrono Trigger

Final Fantasy Tactics: A2

 

Most of all those titles will be out before this year (Hopefully)

We are at the last half of the year so all those titles will be more than enough for me until next year ^_^

[Emasher]

You know, I'm sure everyone here hasn't purchased every Nintendo game through history that interests them. Why not use this as an opportunity to get something you missed out on?

[Retro_Link]

You know, I'm sure everyone here hasn't purchased every Nintendo game through history that interests them. Why not use this as an opportunity to get something you missed out on?

Yeah, I'm just thankful I've yet to pick up Prime 3 and Boom Blox, because atm the rest of the year is empty for me I think!

[Ren of Heavens]

Just for comparison, the first two years of GC and Wii in Europe:

 

GC

---

Luigi's Mansion

Waverace Blue Storm

Super Smash Bros. Melee

Pikmin

Doshin the Giant

Super Mario Sunshine

Eternal Darkness: Sanity's Requiem

StarFox: Adventures

Mario Party 4

Metroid Prime

Legend of Zelda: The Wind Waker

Wario World

F-Zero GX

Mario Kart: Double Dash!!

1080: Avalanche

Mario Party 5

Kirby Air Ride

Pokemon Channel

 

 

Wii

---

Wii Play

Wii Sports

Legend of Zelda: Twilight Princess

WarioWare: Smooth Moves

Excite Truck

Mario Strikers Charged

Mario Party 8

Big Brain Academy for Wii

Super Paper Mario

Metroid Prime 3: Corruption

Endless Ocean

Super Mario Galaxy

Pokemon Battle Revolution

Links Crossbow Training

Wii Chess

Donkey Kong Jet Race

Battalion Wars 2

Fire Emblem: Radiant Dawn

Mario Kart Wii

Wii Fit

Super Smash Bros. Brawl

Wario Land: The Shake Dimension

Wii Music

Mario Super Sluggers

Animal Crossing: City Folk

+WiiWare titles

 

Better Nintendo support than last generation IMO...

[IMJ]

I wonder if Nintendo is leaving the gap open for third parties to fill they obviously left open. Last year, we all focused on SMG and MP3. This year they only got Wii Music and AC.

 

Will you be starting to look at what EA, Ubisoft, Activisions etc. has to offer? I, for one, may be more likely to purchase COD5 now...

[Guest Jordan]

Just for comparison, the first two years of GC and Wii in Europe:

 

GC

---

Luigi's Mansion < Bad Ass

Waverace Blue Storm < Bad Ass

Super Smash Bros. Melee < Bad Ass

Pikmin < Bad Ass

Doshin the Giant < less said the better

Super Mario Sunshine < pretty good!

Eternal Darkness: Sanity's Requiem < Not played...

StarFox: Adventures < I liked this personally

Mario Party 4 < Mini games...

Metroid Prime < Bad Ass

Legend of Zelda: The Wind Waker < Bad Ass

Wario World < Not great

F-Zero GX < Bad Ass

Mario Kart: Double Dash!! < Fun, i thought

1080: Avalanche < Bad Ass

Mario Party 5 < Mini games...

Kirby Air Ride < Not played

Pokemon Channel < Will never play

 

 

Wii

---

Wii Play < Mini Game Compliation

Wii Sports < Mini Game Compliation

Legend of Zelda: Twilight Princess < Wind Waker was better...

WarioWare: Smooth Moves < Mini Game Compliation

Excite Truck < Short racer

Mario Strikers Charged < Made harder because it was short.

Mario Party 8 < Mini Game Compliation

Big Brain Academy for Wii < Mini Game Compliation

Super Paper Mario < Short

Metroid Prime 3: Corruption < Not as a good as Prime 1, but still great.

Endless Ocean < Pointless (i own it...)

Super Mario Galaxy < pants droppingly fantastic!

Pokemon Battle Revolution < Essentially Pokémon Stadium without the extras

Links Crossbow Training < Mini Game Compliation

Wii Chess < A freaking chess game

Donkey Kong Jet Race < Terrible apparently

Battalion Wars 2 < not played... but i've heard its good

Fire Emblem: Radiant Dawn < Essentially a GCN game

Mario Kart Wii < Stupidly cheap AI

Wii Fit < Bought it, stopped playing after a few days. Technically a mini game compliation

Super Smash Bros. Brawl < Great, but it took a freaking age to come out here

Wario Land: The Shake Dimension < looks awesome

Wii Music < A "toy"

Mario Super Sluggers

Animal Crossing: City Folk < If this hits Q4 i'd be supprised.

+WiiWare titles

 

 

Hmmm... Quite a few mini game... games.

[Emasher]

Hmmm... Quite a few mini game... games.

 

I agree with what you said partially.

But...

Just because WW was better, doesn't make TP a bad game.

Excite truck was awesome, one of the most fun Wii games there is.

PBR wasn't that bad. The online battling was much better than D/P.

With Fire Emblem, perhaps it was a good thing it didn't have motion controls. They wouldn't make sense for it.

MK Wii, is pretty bad in single player, but the online is the best so far on Wii.

[Guest Jordan]

I agree with what you said partially.

But...

Just because WW was better, doesn't make TP a bad game.

Excite truck was awesome, one of the most fun Wii games there is.

PBR wasn't that bad. The online battling was much better than D/P.

With Fire Emblem, perhaps it was a good thing it didn't have motion controls. They wouldn't make sense for it.

MK Wii, is pretty bad in single player, but the online is the best so far on Wii.

 

Oh yeah, i totally agree with everything you've said. I was just doing a quick few thoughts .

[darkjak]

Try to put it in to perspective...

 

I would say Nintendo has never released so many "big" games in such a short while as the first 18 months of the Wii: Super Mario Galaxy, Zelda: Twilight Princess, Super Smash Bros. Brawl, Metroid Prime 3 and Mario Kart Wii. Then we have more hardcore stuff like Battalion Wars 2 and Fire Emblem and the underrated Excite Truck. They're even all out in Europe.

 

We know a new Zelda, Mario, Animal Crossing and Pikmin is on the way, so is there any reason to complain?

 

As I said before it's third parties that has messed up. So far over 60% of my Wii games are Nintendo published. That shows something is very wrong.

 

Let me put it like this: we've allways KNOWN OF more kick ass games in development after 18 months of the market. After 18 months of Gamecube we knew (and already had, if I remember correctly) about Metroid. We knew about 1080, we had waverace, we had Starfox adventure and "Starfox Armada" was mentioned, although it was later renamed to Starfox Assault, and turned out to suck, which however doesent matter. We had seen the first video of Zelda: Wind Waker and Soul Calibur was well under way. We had recieved Eternal Darkness and Smash Bros, and Nintendo had give Factor 5 a dev kit earlier than anyone else so that we would get the visually stunning Rogue Leader in time for release.

 

Games that will be released this year are mostly already announced. There'll be few Wiiware games, and some crappy minigame compilations, but a new core title that'll turn out to be good? Very, VERY slim chances.

 

 

And to the guy whom said that we should buy a Sony or MS-console if we want core games: go f*** yourself. The N64 was the main console for core games back in the day, and hopefully this is a phase in the Wii's lifespan that'll pass.

[Retro_Link]

Also, Endless Ocean isn't a Nintendo franchise!

[Smowza]

Why couldn't nintendo show what they showed to cater for the more casual audience and also show some stuff for the core gamers? showing a few trailers doesn't add much time to a conference.

[Tellyn]

Also, Endless Ocean isn't a Nintendo franchise!

 

I think they're going through Nintendo published franchises. I think Arika are second-party like Camelot and Ambrella, so it's close enough.

[daftada]

Iwata said a year or two ago that they wouldn't be announcing games too far in advance any more, which is why games like Fatal Frame and Warioland Shake seemed to come out of nowhere. There are going to be other opportunities for Nintendo to make big announcements like TGS (although they don't typically have a big presence there), Leipzig, E for All. They've got to have plenty of titles in the works for retail and wiiware just have patience!

[Ren of Heavens]

Sure, they could have showed CG trailers of Mario, Zelda and Pikmin, but would it make any difference? We know they're coming now. That's whats important.

[Smowza]

Sure, they could have showed CG trailers of Mario, Zelda and Pikmin, but would it make any difference? We know they're coming now. That's whats important.

 

It would have made a huge difference.

[Emasher]

It would have made a huge difference.

 

Actually It probably would have, though, there's a good chance Mario and Zelda aren't far enough along in development to be able to make a trailer that will represent the final game well enough. Pikmin could very well be quite far in development, but a Pikmin trailer alone wouldn't have changed the show that much I don't think. I'd rather they saved it for Leipzig or TGS as they don't really say that much then so a trailer of a major game could really excite people coming unexpectedly like that.