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Shaze_Nab

No HD? Oh well...

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Which is the second console? The 360 or the Rev?

 

The Revolution seems more a family console to me.

 

Nintendo probably doesnt care as long as you buy one. They said they arent trying to control your livingroom

 

And yeah, cartridges>disks, but thats a whole 'nother debate. A hybrid would be nice. Nothing is more of a killjoy than a 'now loading' bar.

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How long is it until you have to have a HD TV to play 360 games? Many new GC games require a 60hz TV, many people here don't have one of those, let alone a HD TV.

 

You don't need a 60Hz TV with a lot of TVs. 60Hz runs fine on my TV and it's primarily 50Hz. It can just handle 60 aswell.

Maybe once I start earning decent money I'll get an HDTV though, depends what else there is to buy!!

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ok, found this site, seems to be no biased. here is some of what it says about EDTV (480p), which Rev will support:

 

"EDTV is a major advance

 

EDTV, or 480p, doesn't sound like much compared to HDTV. But it is in fact a major step forward in picture quality. On a big screen it looks closer in quality to HDTV than it does regular television. "

 

"So let's forget about HDTV for a moment. The big leap forward that is accessible to everyone right now is EDTV, which is simply progressive scanning. I had friends over recently and I put on the Eagles "Hell Freezes Over" DVD, displaying it on a 120" diagonal screen. They were stunned at the picture quality—"I've never seen ANY big screen ever look that good," said one. "So that's HDTV huh?" Nope. That's just regular DVD my friends, played on a progressive scan DVD player."

 

http://www.projectorcentral.com/video_signals.htm

 

sounds good to me. it makes sense, and they don't seem to have a hidden agenda. and it seems to match up with what Nintendo were saying...

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You don't need a 60Hz TV with a lot of TVs. 60Hz runs fine on my TV and it's primarily 50Hz. It can just handle 60 aswell.

Maybe once I start earning decent money I'll get an HDTV though, depends what else there is to buy!!

 

What?

 

I was saying that you need a 60Hz TV to play some games, like Metroid Prime 2, for example.

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HD doesnt improve graphics, there is a clear visual improvement but its not to the graphics themselves, and as long as nintendo do 480p they'll be fine. i dont think anymore really needs to be said

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HD doesnt improve graphics, there is a clear visual improvement but its not to the graphics themselves, and as long as nintendo do 480p they'll be fine. i dont think anymore really needs to be said

So how is a visual improvement not an improvement of graphics? Of course they will be fine now, but they would be finer with HD.

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So how is a visual improvement not an improvement of graphics? Of course they will be fine now, but they would be finer with HD.

 

Because the graphics would actually be better at a lower resolution, outputing at a higher resolution takes resources away that could have been used to make the game look better.

 

Look at it this way when you record a film in HD what do you add to the real world?? Nothing all you've done is increase the resolution, this allows everything that was ALREADY THERE to be seen in greater detail.

 

I dont know how we got into the thought that HD actually adds to the graphics, when in reality it takes away from them as the higher resolution takes graphical power away from the game.

 

But there is clearly a graphical improvement right? Of course the x360 is more powerful than current gen consoles so of course there will be an improvement, but its not because of HD.

 

The final point is there is a clear difference between SD and HD images. Yeh there is a difference but its really not the difference we think it is. The graphics are actually the same on an SDTV but they appear worse because they are being viewed at the incorrect resolution (over the same distance)

 

All in all HD is uneccessary for this generation and if you read the link about hd that someone posted above you might get a better understanding of the points im trying to make.

 

Im not saying there is no difference, because there clearly is all im saying is that its not the difference we perceive it to be. Just using your eyes will give you the wrong impression. Its why microsoft and sony are incorrectly telling people that HD improves graphics and they are getting away with it.

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i personally think that hd isnt in it, because what they are trying to do with the graphics is is too expensiove to implement with HD...me and stocka discussed this, take for example those 3d gif images, if you had a 60hz tv, and the game would run at 30fps with the 2 frames jitering back and forth to create the 3d image?

 

i mean nintendo didnt spend billions on 1 control now did they?

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i personally think that hd isnt in it, because what they are trying to do with the graphics is is too expensiove to implement with HD...me and stocka discussed this, take for example those 3d gif images, if you had a 60hz tv, and the game would run at 30fps with the 2 frames jitering back and forth to create the 3d image?

 

i mean nintendo didnt spend billions on 1 control now did they?

 

after reading the link above about HD im confident they aren't implementing it because its simply a waste of money this gen, the returns arent worth the investement. I get the feeling that switching to a higher resolution will only be truly worth it when graphics are a lot better than they currently are or will be this gen.

 

And they are going to support 480p so it shouldnt look that bad on big screen tvs or pc monitors.

 

Also given the size of the machine id say they invested a lot in making it cheap but efficient given their performance claims

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after reading the link above about HD im confident they aren't implementing it because its simply a waste of money this gen, the returns arent worth the investement. I get the feeling that switching to a higher resolution will only be truly worth it when graphics are a lot better than they currently are or will be this gen.

 

And they are going to support 480p so it shouldnt look that bad on big screen tvs or pc monitors.

 

HD for me = cinema viewing

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sorry i didnt quite catch what you meant

 

well right now, sony are boasting 2million fps and some over the top HD viewing, what he is describing isnt gaming...its film viewing, the purpose i would buy HDTV for is for films, and not games

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well right now, sony are boasting 2million fps and some over the top HD viewing, what he is describing isnt gaming...its film viewing, the purpose i would buy HDTV for is for films, and not games

 

Ah true, even then its only really worth it if ya get a bigger sized tv

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I have a 70 cm widescreen and I'm really bothered by the raw pixels I see when playing Resident Evil 4 and Metroid Prime 2. I would easily give a way a few million polygons for a higher resolution because I think the current generation has already reached a point on which 480p doesn't do the graphics justice anymore, and it'll only be worse next gen. Of course I won't see it on my TV now, but I think Nintendo can really enrich the game experience for others by adding HD support.

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I don't need HD; I have an RGB cable for my 'Cube and the games look beautiful, crisp and clear on my normal telly, HD is simply too expensive and insignificant to garner my interest.

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(alothugh i have read somewhere the gov wants us to switch to HD by year 2009 or something... i'm not sure)

 

are you sure? i dont think they want us to swith to High Deffinition Televisions (HDTV) but Intergrated Digital Televisions (IDTV) so they can stop the analog signal and so the whole country will pick up digital instead.

 

Anyway if these consoles need HDTV to make that much of a graphical improvement then they are not that great anyway. if they used SDTV and it looked that much better than i would say fair enough but for people to say you need an HDTV to notice the difference between current and next gen then they have failed us.

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What?

 

I was saying that you need a 60Hz TV to play some games, like Metroid Prime 2, for example.

 

Yeah, and I was saying my TV aint 60Hz!!! Neither is one of my best mates, but they can handle Metroid or Geist.

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Then is probably IS 60Hz...or is it something like 15 years old? Even my 7year-old-cheapy-crappy-portable has 60H

 

Also, i doubt ill be alowed to play games on the "families" HD projector or brand new (well, it arrived in a few weeks) £2500 HD Plasma TV.

 

I still think graphics can get much better on SD. It just depends if games are optimised for HD or SD.

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Saying "I won't get a HDTV" is selfish. So you have a good TV already, or you can't afford one. So that means you shouldn't care about HDTV because YOU won't have it, other people who put their money together for some quality resolutions don't matter. HDTV is becoming more accesible over time and there will be a time, like it or not, that you'll have a HDTV because it's the standard. It could be in ten years, or it could be in two years, but either way, when you get your old dusty Revolution out for a spin, it'll just be a shame to see the archaic 640x480 resolution.

 

About the graphical improvements - those who haven't seen the difference, stop talking. The difference between 480p and 720p is big. Even in Resident Evil 4 you see raw strips of pixels simply because the resolution is not good enough to match up to its graphical quality, no matter how much full-scene anti aliasing they've done on it. 1280x768 or 1920x1080 does so much better in displaying good graphics.

 

I have a feeling that Nintendo is missing an opportunity here. I mean, HD is better than no HD right?

 

Aren't you being selfish in demanding that everyone else pays more for their console and games, just so you can play on your HDTV? It's called a choice, Nintendo is offering you one without HDTV support, MS and Sony are offering you one with HDTV support. If HDTV is essential to you, then Nintendo is not your choice, plain and simple.

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Aren't you being selfish in demanding that everyone else pays more for their console and games, just so you can play on your HDTV? It's called a choice, Nintendo is offering you one without HDTV support, MS and Sony are offering you one with HDTV support. If HDTV is essential to you, then Nintendo is not your choice, plain and simple.

Just to get things clear, I don't have an HDTV, and I'm not expecting one anytime soon (heck, I'm 16), I just think that HDTV should become the standard because it's amazing.

 

HD doesn't cost more - it's just another socket more in the back of the console that outputs a higher resolution. In games there's barely an extra cost, it's just a larger videobuffer that is used. Console games ported to PC run in 1280x1024 no problem - games need little modification to run in HD resolutions.

 

I have a feeling Nintendo is missing a chance here. Right now, there aren't many HDTVs, but the console war doesn't last a week, it lasts more than five years.

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Just to get things clear, I don't have an HDTV, and I'm not expecting one anytime soon (heck, I'm 16), I just think that HDTV should become the standard because it's amazing.

 

HD doesn't cost more - it's just another socket more in the back of the console that outputs a higher resolution. In games there's barely an extra cost, it's just a larger videobuffer that is used. Console games ported to PC run in 1280x1024 no problem - games need little modification to run in HD resolutions.

 

I have a feeling Nintendo is missing a chance here. Right now, there aren't many HDTVs, but the console war doesn't last a week, it lasts more than five years.

 

If this was true, then there would be no debate about HD. There would be no discussion about the cost to consumers or the cost to developers, and nintendo would have just made HD Standard, same as everyone else.

 

But if it really doesnt cost a developer anything significantly more, what is the need for MS and Sony to force developers to create game in HD as standard??? It would have just been standard anyway.

 

Where as if it does cost more it would take a (software) gen or 2 to become standard.

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DCK, sorry, but thats complete rubbish.

take a 600*500 bmp, and compare it to a 1000*700 bmp. the 1000*700 bmp is larger. so thats where you get the buffer increase from. fair enough.

so how does this data reach the buffer? it just magically teleports there does it?

nope. so the rest of the machine has to be built to deal with the additional flow of data.

hence it costs more.

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I have a 70 cm widescreen and I'm really bothered by the raw pixels I see when playing Resident Evil 4 and Metroid Prime 2. I would easily give a way a few million polygons for a higher resolution because I think the current generation has already reached a point on which 480p doesn't do the graphics justice anymore, and it'll only be worse next gen. Of course I won't see it on my TV now, but I think Nintendo can really enrich the game experience for others by adding HD support.

 

are you sure your tv and the games you were playing were 480p as opposed to 480i ???

 

i think nintendo will be good enough with 480p from what ive read about HD / ED / SD

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