RUMOUR: New NiGHTS & Skies of Arcadia at Sega Gamers Day 2008

[pedrocasilva]

This is the game I want the sequal to the most. Ever since I started Shenmue, it was just fantastic. I can't describe the feeling I got when playing through it. Then the second game was woah. Just a fantastic experience and game in my eyes.

 

I think I might actually prefer the second to the first. Then there's all those theories flying about the air regarding people in the game, like Ryus father and Lan Di training together, from the origins to the white leaf that hasn't dried out to the elixer.

 

It's just wow. I really hope that this turns out true.

Well the offtopic is my fault but I'll aggravate it... Yes, of course I also want Shenmue 3 the most, and preferably for a console I own... But I also find it very important to keep the franchise alive even if shenmue 3 is not coming yet... If anything to prove it's viability and grow the Shenmue userbase...

 

Truth is... Shenmue has never been profitable for them, so they're weary of investing in it, I'd also argue that their core userbase are kinda delusional in the message they're passing outside, expecting that a Shenmue coming out in 2008 would be like in 2001 regarding impact (graphics package for example)... Sega is not what it once was (neither are they doing killer apps for their consoles), so competing in, for example a HD console in graphics (for example), on a franchise that was never profitable might not be a option, as well as a big risk; and not having top range graphics in such graphics driven platforms might hamper it's performance and reception outside of the fan circles, like it most likely did to Shenmue 2 Xbox.

 

In short... instead of asking for their wet dreams, they should be offering Sega propositions of easy profit, stuff that seems simple enough for them and that keep Shenmue alive; if you wait 10 years without a single game out and then release Shenmue 3... Will it be a success? and if newcomers have no way to play the predecessor games? Of course not... It's the recipe for a flop, even if there's cult following. (point being, cult following only cares for themselves and will ask for the most unviable thing just because)

 

At least keeping the franchise alive and growing it's popularity must be of Sega's interest, even if they don't want to spend that much, so... it's a really good idea... finding mutual interests and pressing on that. Of course, I'd wish they'd upgrade the games visually (always joked that if Shenmue team got their claws on a GC and done the game from the ground for it rather than a DC we'd have Shenmue 2 with RE4 graphics in open areas), and I'd love them to do Shenmue 3 from the get go too, but point is we're not in position to demand even that.

Guessed I missed something earlier as ive just read that both a Wii and PS3 version are rumoured to be in the works.

The way I've read it is: Wii, it's coming... PS3, they're thinking about it. But it's all a matter of interpretation; and like in the Castlevania thread, I think they need to focus on one platform, the Wii.

[ShadowV7]

It cost a fair bit to create Shenmue, 150/180 million dollars. Though it was indevelopment for a long time. Was supposed to be out for the Saturn, then did they not have to create it again in a different engine? Then it got constant delays and took a while to actually get completed but cost a lot. Now though, it shouldn't nearly be as expensive to create a 3rd or redo the first 2 now should it? The graphics are good already, but it would be easy to make it a bit better, or use an already existing engine.

 

Then if they actually do it in this generation and they know what they're doing with more experience, it would be done quicker and cheaper would it not?

[pedrocasilva]

It cost a fair bit to create Shenmue, 150/180 million dollars. Though it was indevelopment for a long time. Was supposed to be out for the Saturn, then did they not have to create it again in a different engine?

I wouldn't be surprised at all if they actually ported the engine instead of starting from ground. But yeah, it cost so much also because of that.. but it was not only because of that. If you look at shenmue it's still more ambitious than any next gen title that I know of; in stuff like every NPC having his own voice.

Then it got constant delays and took a while to actually get completed but cost a lot. Now though, it shouldn't nearly be as expensive to create a 3rd or redo the first 2 now should it? The graphics are good already, but it would be easy to make it a bit better, or use an already existing engine.

A game of the magnitude of Shenmue would always get delays if done right, just like a Zelda does.

 

Not as expensive now? but... Development costs have increased, specially for the HD's, if 30 million last gen was the cost of a Final Fantasy, including FMV's and all that... 30 million this gen is a pretty easy goal to achieve. which brings the question... what is FFXIII costing? (for example) and what would a proper unconstrained Shenmue 3 cost. and even if those lower costs were 30 million... wouldn't it be too much for Sega and this franchise? bare in mind that ~30 million is what FFXII costed; it's a load of money for Wii development; not so much for HD's.

 

Also, do we really want them to take years to remake shenmue 1 and 2? I'd rather have optimized ports (I'd wish really optimized and upgraded, but not a remake from ground), something that wouldn't suffice for HD systems due to obvious reasons.

 

Using their already existing engine in HD wouldn't suffice either, not without rewriting it until it was not the same engine anymore, the scope and features needed wouldn't even be comparable; so doing that, or building one would be a pain, making the cost and development time higher, while using a licenced middleware would mean they'd need to get trained personnel (and given that most middlewares are American... get people to deal with them for documentation) and start from ground.

 

Not to say that a cheaper Shenmue wouldn't be possible... Planning stages are done, at least for Shenmue 1 and 2... But costs have increased, so if Sega was really going for a "cheap shenmue" they'd either do a Shenmue 3 with real cost constraint pre-set budget (and still would be a expensive game given the scope), or possibly throwing away stuff like the extensive voice-over cast and other signs of Shenmue ambition. Too much of a risk; fans need to give them prospects of easy money.

Then if they actually do it in this generation and they know what they're doing with more experience, it would be done quicker and cheaper would it not?

Remaking (from ground, not port) Shenmue 1 and 2 and doing Shenmue 3 this gen? If it's a 5 year generation like before I don't think they have the time if they were to start now; we also don't know if they still have their experience intact, a lot of years have passed... It's like saying SF4 is a easy endeavor for Capcom, when they actually don't have a arcade/beat them up focused team now (they had to outsource it to Dimps); Shenmue team was really big, but how many have left since Sega left the console business?

 

Sega got downsized multiple times, studios got merged, a lot of people left... Sega is not exactly the image of stability (I'm actually impressed Yu Suzuki is still there)... All we know is that Ryu ga Gotoku team is a small fragment of Shenmue team and the only left doing F.R.E.E. system games, and... are they available? Then there's AM2, how many of them actually worked on Shenmue?

 

Then there's console differences, right now I still feel Shenmue has to be console exclusive; allow me to explain... Wii to X360/PS3 development for a game like shenmue is not viable, it needs focus or at least very similar hardware all around; and if we were to enter a high quality cross development with proprietary engine like Capcom did this gen... They'd actually be held back with X360 no less... The planning needed to make Shenmue 2 a 4 disc game, for example was nothing short of amazing, as the game had no fmv's (comparing to PSone RPG's)... but doing it for X360 in order to fit it all, and then doing a PS3 version without those constraints... well, the constraints would be there like the notion they had of "we can't put more voices in this DVD" and stuff like that (as well as having to optimize such a big scope game for the PS3 for no loadings), it's a complex matter and the bigger magnitude the game has the bigger it gets. Getting rid of the multiple disc planning would be a blessing for them and for the development costs though.

[Olympic Gamer]

...Has Sega Gamers Day been yet? I'm so desperately hoping for a Skies sequel..

 

Edit: Missed out most of this thread, sorry for the bump, seems its already gone =( *sulks*

[ShadowV7]

Yea it's been. Nothing interesting. Just showing off their games.

 

Link

[pedrocasilva]

Ok, kinda insubstancial but... since the news was given here, that website's Admin, Sega ON who broke the Skies of Arcadia 2 news had this to say regarding the news:

 

Us here are also all Skies of Arcadia fans, we'd slit our wrists if we were widespreading a lie. All of us await a new Skies of Arcadia.

Source: http://www.sega-magazin.de/segaon/2008/05/07/exklusiv-skies-of-arcadia-2-definitiv/

 

Hurray?

[LazyBoy]

Would this work online? I mean I want this on the Wii just because I prefer playing stuff on the Wii, it's easier. But if an online could work (clans become crews, raiding others ships, work for the empire, or either of the pirates, capturing islands) then it would have to be 360. That's unless you could do that on the Wii.

[Jonnas]

Would this work online? I mean I want this on the Wii just because I prefer playing stuff on the Wii, it's easier. But if an online could work (clans become crews, raiding others ships, work for the empire, or either of the pirates, capturing islands) then it would have to be 360. That's unless you could do that on the Wii.

 

That would be an MMO. A logical entry for the franchise, but it surely wouldn't be for the Wii.

Unless that's one of the games Nintendo has been working on for the "Pay & Play" feature. Which I highly doubt.

[LazyBoy]

In reality i'd like two games. One MMO (360) and one single player (WII). I find that when you try to both, both come out under-developed. Though i'd settle for either. No screw that, i'd kill for either.

[pedrocasilva]

That would be an MMO. A logical entry for the franchise, but it surely wouldn't be for the Wii.

Unless that's one of the games Nintendo has been working on for the "Pay & Play" feature. Which I highly doubt.

I really think MH3 will be close to a MMO and that Capcom wouldn't step up if they hadn't had the warranties for it.

In reality i'd like two games. One MMO (360) and one single player (WII). I find that when you try to both, both come out under-developed. Though i'd settle for either. No screw that, i'd kill for either.

I pretty much doubt they'll make a MMO, for that they have Phantasy Star who already has a name for itself...

 

Also X360 doesn't sell in Japan, so unless moneyhatted or was cross platform with something else... they'd be doing a better bet if it was to be for PS3.

 

 

I can't say I want SoA turning into a MMORPG though, but that's just me.