Formula 1 2008

[Retro_Link]

That doesn't sound like a bad idea in theory but then if drivers only needed a point to clinch the title they could get it in qualifying rendering the race pointless.

Also, you support kimi right? Because I think the point system made things very hard for him in 2007. He won 3 races in a row at the end of the season and barely won the title. Same for Massa earlier this season where he got 2 wins in a row and was still first. I dunno, would be nice to see winners rewarded more. The only reason the point system was changed was to end Schumachers dominance (as he won every race pretty much) so would be nice for them to reward winners more.

Yeah you have a point about a point for Pole, maybe that one wouldn't work, but you get the idea.

 

Your right about Kimi in '07, and yes really the driver who wins the most races across the season deserves the title, which was Kimi and Massa in '07 and '08 respectively.

 

Maybe 12, 8, 6... is the best solution?

[Goron_3]

Yeah you have a point about a point for Pole, maybe that one wouldn't work, but you get the idea.

 

Your right about Kimi in '07, and yes really the driver who wins the most races across the season deserves the title, which was Kimi and Massa in '07 and '08 respectively.

 

Maybe 12, 8, 6... is the best solution?

 

Oh yes definately.

It used to be 9,6,3,1 and then 10,6,4 etc, so i think 12, 8, 6 could work. That said, I think 15, 10, 6 etc would work wonderfully. Really puts pressure on the drivers to win.

[Retro_Link]

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/72093

 

Williams reveal 2009 wing package

 

 

Williams have become the first team to reveal what the 2009-specification front wings will look like after Jonathan Kennard shook down an FW30 chassis fitted with the new-style front and rear wings at the Kemble airfield today.

 

The team had previously trialled a 2009-style rear wing at Barcelona in September, but today's run was the first time that the revised front wing had been displayed. Most teams are expected to try parts modified for the 2009 regulations in next week's Barcelona sessions.

 

Under next year's radically different aerodynamic rules, the wings have been simplified with most of the current additional protrusions removed. The front wing is lower and wider, and drivers will be able to make a limited number of wing angle adjustments from the cockpit. The rear wing has been made narrower and taller.

 

The aim is to improve the quality of the racing by allowing drivers to follow each other more closely in fast corners.

 

The definitive versions of the 2009 cars will also have different diffusers, slick tyres and kinetic energy recovery systems, and will no longer feature extra aerodynamic devices on the central bodywork.

 

Kennard's straightline test today was the former Formula 3 front-runner's first run in a Formula One car, and he expressed his gratitude to the team afterwards.

 

"It has been a good day today and great to be able to drive the new-spec Formula One car for the first time," he said.

 

"I would like to extend my thanks to Sir Frank (Williams) and the team for the opportunity. I enjoyed working through the test programme and assisting the team with their preparations for the 2009 season."

I actually like the look of the new aero package now I've seen both wings together; well on the Williams anyway, with their livery.

Obviously there will still be changes made to the chasis between now and March and slick tyres will go on etc... but it's better than expected.

 

Something I'm really beginning to not like however is all the recent talk of the KERS systems and actually I'd rather they either scrap it, or wait until a standard system is developed that the teams will all run.

 

Here's some recent stories:

 

Webber: KERS will penalise heavier drivers

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/72047

 

Kubica: KERS might disadvantage me

http://www.itv-f1.com/home.aspx#

 

Toyota to introduce KERS only in mid-2009

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/71896

 

Analysis: Slick impact on KERS future

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/72024

 

Di Montezemolo critical of KERS

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/72076

 

The last thing I want is an '09 grid full of unbalanced cars and drivers:

 

- Some cars with KERS - speed advantage.

- Some cars without KERS - disadvantage.

- Lighter drivers at an advantage - weight distribution options.

- Heavier drivers at a disadvanatge - limited weight distribution options.

- Unsafe and Unreliable KERS systems - leading to title effecting reliability problems.

- etc...

 

I'd hate it to mess up the grid, especially when it sounds like it may be pointless in the first place!

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/71896

 

But with the devices currently believed to weigh between 25 and 60 kilogrammes, some teams suspect that the advantage of the extra power boost will be outweighed by the handicap of the extra weight at the rear of the car.

 

"You have got to remember that the KERS, when you analyse the potential, the difference it makes can be somewhere between 0.1s and 0.3s, perhaps at the maximum 0.35s per lap, putting aside whether it helps you overtake.

 

"Having your weight distribution inappropriate for the tyres by more than one or two percent will probably make more difference than those one or two tenths of a second per lap.

[Emerald Emblem]

Looks like I will have to find a new driver to support in 2009, despite the experience I don't think that'll keep Barrichello in the sport:

http://www.itv-f1.com/news_article.aspx?id=44606

[Goron_3]

Looks like I will have to find a new driver to support in 2009, despite the experience I don't think that'll keep Barrichello in the sport:

http://www.itv-f1.com/news_article.aspx?id=44606

 

He had a great season aswell, would be a shame to see him go

 

The new cars actually look fine..was quite worried they'd be horrid! God can't wait for next season it's going to be so good.

Looks like I'll be supporting Vettel and Massa

[Retro_Link]

The new cars actually look fine..was quite worried they'd be horrid! God can't wait for next season it's going to be so good.

Looks like I'll be supporting Vettel and Massa

Can see ALOT of the new front wings getting knocked off though! They're right out to the edge of the tyres!

[Emerald Emblem]

http://www.itv-f1.com/news_article.aspx?id=44616

Barrichello won't be testing, I don't see him staying at Honda anymore.

[spenno182]

Next year will be all about Jenson Button, i've actually got a feeling he will be right up there. Think vettell(sp?) will have a great season too.

[Emerald Emblem]

Jenson would have been set had he got a Mclaren or Ferrari drive. He stayed and Honda and went backwards. If Honda don't have a competitive car next year then Jenson's days are numbered to be able to become world champion..

[spenno182]

Apparently they held back this year to make a real push for it next season so yeah it is make or break. Hope he does well.

[Will]

Jenson would have been set had he got a Mclaren or Ferrari drive. He stayed and Honda and went backwards. If Honda don't have a competitive car next year then Jenson's days are numbered to be able to become world champion..

 

Jenson's main problem is that he's just not that good. Even in a Mclaren or Ferrari drive I doubt he'd be able to win a championship.

[Retro_Link]

Jenson and Honda will be midfield at best next year I reckon.

 

And about the whole Honda drivers situation next year; in a year full of changes Honda would be wise to keep Barrichello for his experience, at least just for the '09 year.

Teams will need to constantly keep developing throughout '09 to get the new aero packages sorted, the KERS systems up and running etc... and having a rookie driver in that situation would provide you with nothing!

Ruben's is full of knowledge and can help them develop the car through to perhaps a more challenging car in 2010.

 

In other news:

 

Canadian GP fails in rescue bid:

http://www.itv-f1.com/News_Article.aspx?id=44618

 

The Canadian Grand Prix's hopes of returning to the 2009 Formula 1 calendar appear doomed after Montreal officials said they were unwilling to meet Bernie Ecclestone's “unreasonable” financial demands.

 

The breakdown in talks will come as a blow to Formula 1’s manufacturer teams after many expressed unhappiness that there would be no North American round in 2009 considering it was an important market for car sales and many of their major sponsors were US-based.

Fuck you Bernie!

 

Also:

 

Whilst the Williams '09 aero package actually looked alright [though maybe their nose will change too], BMW's does not!

 

F1's new era gets underway

http://www.itv-f1.com/News_Article.aspx?id=44619

 

Most of the teams will be in action during this week's three-day Barcelona test, and the majority are expected to use hybrid cars featuring elements of the very different 2009 rules.

 

BMW Sauber was the first team to take to the track with a new-style wing package this morning, giving an early indication of what next season's cars might look like.

[Ryan]

Looks nimble.

[Retro_Link]

Looks nimble.

 

Honda '09 nose and slick tyres:

 

 

KERS

 

 

Not liking it much so far, the BMW just looks so unadvanced and basic! The GP2, Formula3 and A1GP cars look better than these!

 

Surely if the new noses stay as they are we'll get no more wheel to wheel racing and bashing because the wings will come off!

[Emerald Emblem]

I wonder if the traffic light system will actually work for Honda next year. After Ferrari's disasters do you think Honda can avoid as many slip ups during pit stops? I still think the lollipops are the way to go and stay.

[Retro_Link]

I wonder if the traffic light system will actually work for Honda next year. After Ferrari's disasters do you think Honda can avoid as many slip ups during pit stops? I still think the lollipops are the way to go and stay.

Yeah I think the lollipop is probably the most consistant for reliability; sometimes the guy releases the car early but it works well enough.

 

Honda think they will have a better solution because their traffic light system will immobise the car whilst the fuel hose is connected; thus the driver will not be able to pull away early.

But surely shutting the car down whilst it's fuelling could potentially bring its own problems, i.e. it not starting up again!

 

 

 

EDIT: Sounds like a total shambles!!...

 

Klien: '09 BMW worst looking car ever

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/72176

 

Christian Klien says the BMW Sauber he tested yesterday at Barcelona is the ugliest Formula One car he has ever seen.

 

"I never saw such a sexy car," joked Klien after testing. "It looks very, very new to everybody.

 

"To me, for the moment, it's the worst (looking) Formula One car I have ever seen. It just doesn't fit together.

 

"But we will get used to it. There will be a lot of modifications until the first race in March."

 

All eyes were on the German squad yesterday, when the team ran with an hybrid 2008 car fitted with a 2009 aerodynamic configuration, designed to provide a lot less downforce.

 

The very wide front and the narrow rear wing did not make for an attractive car, although Klien admitted driving it was a different matter.

 

"It drives quite well, actually. As you saw, the laptimes are quite good already," the Austrian added. "There is still a few improvements coming over the winter. Basically it's quite a lot less downforce but with the slick tyres it compensates quite a lot.

 

"Especially in the slow-speed corners you get much more grip with the slick tyres. High-speed corners are a bit more tricky. But the main problem today was the cold temperatures."

 

The BMW Sauber tester said it was still very hard to bring the new slick tyres up to working temperature.

 

"These are the first slick tyres basically. Now I'm not sure if they have some improvement for these tyres but the warm-up doesn't seem to be very good, even in summer time," he said.

 

"Slicks is for sure the right direction. The race car looks better on slicks. It's also important to change regulations after a few years to give some other teams an opportunity and to keep the speeds down. Now we will lose maybe two seconds."

 

The Austrian also said he is not expecting the regulation changes to allow drivers to run too closely to each other.

 

"Even with these aerodynamics it's still not possible to drive right behind another car. We will see in the first few races. It's more of a problem to not knock off the front wing at the first corner.

 

"This morning we were not sure we could drive in the last chicane, where the kerbs are quite high. But it's not a problem actually."

Ugly brakable cars, brought about by new regulations that many are now saying won't have any real effect, with dangerous KERS devices that teams aren't sure when to implement and will give lighters drivers an advantage!

 

Coupled with Bernie's new obsession for F1 race tracks in the Far East, which see's him helping China retain its GP [despite the fact it makes no money], whilst letting Canada, France and let's face it Great Britain and probably Austraila go!

[Gizmo]

Ugly brakable cars, brought about by new regulations that many are now saying won't have any real effect, with dangerous KERS devices that teams aren't sure when to implement and will give lighters drivers an advantage!

 

Coupled with Bernie's new obsession for F1 race tracks in the Far East, which see's him helping China retain its GP [despite the fact it makes no money], whilst letting Canada, France and let's face it Great Britain and probably Austraila go!

 

Don't forget medals.

 

http://www.itv-f1.com/news_article.aspx?id=44628

[Will]

Don't forget medals.

 

http://www.itv-f1.com/news_article.aspx?id=44628

 

I really really hope that goes through, the title being decided by number of wins is absolutely the right thing to do imo.

[Noodleman]

Just give 12 points for the win..... I don't like the idea of only 3 drivers getting "points" well medals in this case in a race. Realistically how many drivers will even pick up 1 3rd place under this system.

[Retro_Link]

I really really hope that goes through' date=' the title being decided by number of wins is absolutely the right thing to do imo.[/quote']I'm not sure it is...

 

- With 3 [or however many] races to go a driver could have already won, rendering the rest of the season pointless.

 

The last two seasons have gone down to the very final race! It doesn't get more exciting than that!!

 

- Really what's the point of Silver and Bronze? yes they'll be used as countbacks in the event of a draw but...

Say for example it's a really close season and the Season is awarded to someone who has won 4 Golds and maybe a couple of Bronzes. Does this person deserve it more than someone who has won 3 Golds [just 1 less] and say 10 Silvers?

 

In other words having a consistant season will be pointless. You could just throw all your resouces at say the 4/5 GP's you know your car will be strongest at.

 

I think 12 points is probably the best solution for rewarding the race winners.

 

Plus I really like seeing the leaderboard changing throughout the season!

[Will]

Well I think the awarding of medals is a bit ridiculous and like you say, silver and bronze wouldn't mean much. I'd actually keep the points as they are but as soon as you have a win you're ahead of anyone without one, more wins the higher you are. 5wins + 50 points is better than 4 wins and 100 points.

 

I think having a consistent season is pointless to be honest, it would be a terrible thing for the sport if someone came 2nd or 3rd in every race and won the title just by being almost the best at every race.

 

I'm not sure historically but it wouldn't surprise me if using this wins method the titles would still mostly go down to the final race - possibly with more people in the running. You'd also have much more chance of comebacks in the 2nd half or even much later on if the season has been close. It would mean every team was developing their car for the whole season rather than, as happened this year, mid-field and lower just abandoning all hope and moving onto next years car.

[Retro_Link]

It is a tricky decison.

 

You may say consistency isn't all that important, but if you look at it in terms of team reliability, what if a driver wins 5 golds and has [theoretically] 15 DNF [through reckless driving, a poorly dveloped car etc.], then you get a driver with 4 golds and finishes all other races. Is that fair they are world champion?

Not necessarily the best driver would win the championship; they could have been lucky at some races, driven badly/dangerously at other races etc... and still walked home with the title.

 

I don't think the medals system has been thought through by Bernie.

I mean what happens to all the drivers and teams that finish outside the top 3?

How is the constructors titles going to be decided if there aren't points available for those positions?

How will the teams make their usual money from where they finish in the championship?

Will the drivers title be decided through medals, but the constructors the same as it is now? because that would be confusing the situation! etc...

 

 

Update:

 

Check the aero!

 

 

'09 - '08 Wing comparison

 

 

BMW, Williams and Honda

 

[Emerald Emblem]

I think if they replace points with medals then it may very well ruin the enjoyment of it all. This in no way helps the teams who struggle to even score the minor point places and as Retro_Link said would render the final races pointless if one driver got enough golds over his rivals. If they want to include medals at all then it should intertwine with the points system or just leave it as the points system.

[Goron_3]

I think if they replace points with medals then it may very well ruin the enjoyment of it all. This in no way helps the teams who struggle to even score the minor point places and as Retro_Link said would render the final races pointless if one driver got enough golds over his rivals. If they want to include medals at all then it should intertwine with the points system or just leave it as the points system.

 

They'll still be constructors points.

 

They should just change to point system to 15, 10, 7, 5, 4, 3, 2, 1

 

OR

 

12, 8, 6, 4, 3, 2, 1. Seriously, it would reward winning unlike the current system and is similar therefore to the older scheme of 10, 6, 4, 3, 2, 1.

[Retro_Link]

Kimi interview with Top Gear Magazine:

http://www.shell.com/home/content/ferrari-en/news_features/2008/kimi_interview/kimi_interview.html

 

How old were you when you first became interested in cars / speed / racing?

Right from when I was very little, I was interested in anything that had an engine. If I had not become a driver, I would certainly have been a mechanic.

 

Growing up, which drivers do you remember watching and who were you impressed by?

I never had a hero or an idol. My friends tell me I should have raced in the Seventies when maybe Formula 1 was less formal and I would definitely liked to have known James Hunt.

 

When did you think you might become pretty good yourself and why?

That’s not for me to say. I always wanted to be a racing driver and I gave it everything I had to do that. From then on, it’s my results that speak for me.

 

Wouldn’t it make sense if all testing was banned? More time for snowmobiling, less expensive for the teams and still the same for everybody!

No, I’d be asked to spend more time on the simulator! But joking aside, I think the current situation is pretty well balanced. We don’t test as much as we used to a few years back and we work more efficiently.

 

But that’s unlikely, so what do you find most useful about testing, personally?

I just love driving a Formula 1 car, which means I even like testing.

 

While you’re testing and racing, how aware are you of the part you play in helping develop new technologies, like Shell V-Power, for example?

In a sport as finely honed as Formula 1, where the difference between first and last is measured in tenths of a second, you have to push to the limits in terms of car development, in all areas. As far as the engine is concerned, we are currently in a particularly special stage, where development on certain components is frozen for a few years. This means we can have a fuel or an engine oil that gives us a few horsepower more, a gearbox oil that improves lubrication and makes such an important component more reliable and that is a really vital point.

 

What was your most satisfying Grand Prix win ever?

Hard to say as all the wins are great. Of course, the first one and the one in Interlagos last year which meant I was world champion will always stay with me.

 

What were your main reasons for joining Ferrari from McLaren?

Simply a desire to change after so many years with the same team. I felt comfortable at McLaren, just as I feel comfortable at Ferrari. The two teams are different because of their different character, but both share a common desire to get the very best results.

 

Is Ferrari just another team for you or does the immense history and list of its previous great drivers ever cross your mind? Does Ferrari feel different in this way?

There is definitely a special atmosphere at Maranello and you can feel the special appeal of a marque that is part of racing history. It’s nice and I’m proud to be part of this history.

 

Many fans don’t understand how much the driver does during a race. Can you talk us through some of the things you have to do while racing – brake adjustments, driving around problems etc…

That’s true, from the outside it is difficult to understand all the details of what happens on track. First and foremost there is so much work that one does along with the engineers when the car is in the garage: defining the set up, the day’s work programme, strategies. Then, when you are sitting in the cockpit, there are so many parameters you can control: the brake balance, some engine and electrical parameters, the gearbox. Then there are unexpected situations such as the arrival of the safety car and specific moments that require you to go through complex programmes such as the start. This year, with the introduction of a standard electronic control unit, there are slightly less things to do, but next year, new parameters will come into play, such as the electronic control of the flap on the front wing and the boost switches linked to the energy accumulated through the KERS system.

 

What makes a great driver, in your view?

In the end what matters are the result, but one has to take into account that in the current Formula 1, the car remains the dominant factor. Without a competitive car, you can’t win, no matter how talented you are.

 

What’s the best thing about your job?

Driving and racing to win – there’s nothing else.

 

And the worst?

Speaking in public?? Honestly, it’s not a strong point of mine, but I know it’s part of my job and I have to accept it as such.