I'll go against logic with this one

[KingOfHyrule]

If you're prepared for a lengthy intro to a potential raging discussion about the Wii, read on!

 

I know gaming is supposed to be fun, but Christ knows it's turned into an art that people yap and cheer about constantly over the the last decade or so, so I thought I'd talk about it. I've been having a few unorthodox thoughts about the Wii lately and thought I'd share them to see what the forum thinks. Does anyone else find it...strange?

 

I finished Zelda a week ago and I haven't really wanted to turn the console on much at all; Wii Sports is fun for 25 minutes, Red Steel is a pain to play and the visuals bring me back to early GameCube days - what's going on? Why does Zelda, effectively a GameCube title itself, look better than most launch titles for a supposedly new and more powerful console? Dare I say it, I even think The Wind Waker felt more "Zelda" than Twilight Princess in some ways - coming from a hardened, longterm Zelda nut!

 

I can't help but feel that, yes, Nintendo have taken all the right turns, but taken it a few miles too far and sacrificed some of their old standards with this new console. I'm worrying the Wii will end up the gimmicky, weak machine everyone assumed it would turn out to be. Personally I think if Zelda wasn't on the launch list, the Wii would be fucked by now even. Nintendo are smart, though.

 

It's veering really far away from traditional gaming, and that's ok, they said they'd do it anyway; but it's slightly removing some enjoyment from playing the old way and the way that worked - for me personally anyway. I want Nintendo to prove me wrong and make some great games in the Wii's lifetime - not just Mario, Zelda and Metroid, again and again and again. Then Super Smash Bros for when your mates come round. As much as they're great games, they can't remain as powerful as always. Zelda showed signs of ageing without a doubt this time, like Nintendo had genuinely run out of ideas in some parts and that Zelda will become staler and staler as the years go on. A real shame should it happen!

 

Anyone else agree or disagree?

[solitanze]

I have a similar viewpoint:

 

http://www.n-europe.com/forum/showthread.php?t=11764&page=1

 

Maybe we won't be playing games from any of the big three for much longer:

 

http://www.gamespot.com/news/6164051.html?sid=6164051&tag=latestnews;title;1

[motion]

Dare I say it, I even think The Wind Waker felt more "Zelda" than Twilight Princess in some ways - coming from a hardened, longterm Zelda nut!

 

On that, I absolutely agree, without a doubt in my opinion.

 

I suppose we have to remember this is only the beginning for the Wii, of course they're going to be showing off all these games that highlight the innovation of the controller this early on. Hopefully in time they'll realise that people don't only want cool party games for when your mates come round and the odd Zelda, Metroid etc...

[The Lillster]

If they can keep doing cool and interesting things with the wii remote, then I think Nintendo will be very successful. If that doesn't work, who knows?!?

[Domstercool]

It's the same with a lot of consoles that just come out. You play the games at launch then you have to wait and wait. It's not until the flow of games that come out after the slow launch period that you really start getting into the system.

[4q2]

Go on then....I may go off on tangents here but wtf :P

 

I finished Zelda a week ago and I haven't really wanted to turn the console on much at all; Wii Sports is fun for 25 minutes, Red Steel is a pain to play and the visuals bring me back to early GameCube days - what's going on? Why does Zelda, effectively a GameCube title itself, look better than most launch titles for a supposedly new and more powerful console?

 

Zelda.....What can I say ?

Graphically, wouldnt everything have been done on a glorified GC devkit ?

If isnt that, then its down to the lazyness of the developers.

I have been playing Phantasy star Universe on the 360 for the past few days, and I get the exact same feeling....

 

Its early days yet, but someone will show something that makes the machine visually shine once people get used to the new hardware...Remember RE4....

For the developers that really do care there are methods and techniques for dealing with any hardware shortcomings the Wii may come across.

 

I can't help but feel that, yes, Nintendo have taken all the right turns, but taken it a few miles too far and sacrificed some of their old standards with this new console.

This is a comment I dont really understand. I still see the main standards of fun and accesibility....Can you expand on the standards that you see as sacrificed?

 

I'm worrying the Wii will end up the gimmicky, weak machine everyone assumed it would turn out to be. Personally I think if Zelda wasn't on the launch list, the Wii would be fucked by now even. Nintendo are smart, though

Zelda played a huge part in the drive for sales of the new console, but didnt Japan report Wii sports as the biggest release seller ?

 

 

It's veering really far away from traditional gaming, and that's ok, they said they'd do it anyway; but it's slightly removing some enjoyment from playing the old way and the way that worked - for me personally anyway. I want Nintendo to prove me wrong and make some great games in the Wii's lifetime - not just Mario, Zelda and Metroid, again and again and again. Then Super Smash Bros for when your mates come round. As much as they're great games, they can't remain as powerful as always. Zelda showed signs of ageing without a doubt this time, like Nintendo had genuinely run out of ideas in some parts and that Zelda will become staler and staler as the years go on. A real shame should it happen!

 

 

I dont know what to say regarding this....If Zelda, MArio and Metroid were not on the Wiilease list (heh :P) there would be uproar...

Each of those games cannot stride from the normal formula. I can see N's reluctance to ditch them due to the fact they are what make people buy Nintendo machines for the most part....

Saying that, they have announced some new franchises such as that disaster game thingy and Project Hammer.

 

Either way, If it doesnt work out, look on the bright side.....Nintendo have shown more innovation than any one other console manufacturer and havent made you pay through the nose for it.

[The-chosen-one]

for me wii sports doesn't Count on a Sales list becouse wii sports is packed with every wii of course that its the best sold game aloud

[solitanze]

Wii Sports was released as a stand alone game in Japan not bundled with the system.

[Zechs Merquise]

I agree with what you're saying. I think the biggest problem Nintendo will encounter is a lack of games due to the vast technical differences between the Wii and the 360/PS3.

 

For example, I'm sure if they were technically more similar then games like Rainbow Six Vegas etc would be ported over with Wii-mote controls. But because of the difference they won't be. This will lead to major problems as development shifts to PS3/360 and finally ends for PS2/XBOX. All games on the Wii will have to be completely new builds, hence making it harder for developers.

 

I've never really been that tempted away from Nintendo before, but I want to play games like Rainbow Six and Ghost Recon. I also wish we would be seeing Link and Samus in beautiful Hi-Def.

 

I've said it before - but every generation Nintendo has the best ideas, but screws it up due to one or two silly mistakes. With the N64 it was the cartridge format instead of CDs which drove devlopers away. The Gamecube was purple - PURPLE. It also lack any online features. With the Wii, it looks great, is innovative and fresh with it's outlook, but wait, they decided not to stay up to date with technology when it comes to graphics and sound.

 

Still, I hope I'm wrong. I've been playing Nintendo games since Game & Watch were the hottest toy in the play ground. I would hate to see them mess up and end up going the way of Sega.

[solitanze]

I agree with what you're saying. I think the biggest problem Nintendo will encounter is a lack of games due to the vast technical differences between the Wii and the 360/PS3.

 

For example, I'm sure if they were technically more similar then games like Rainbow Six Vegas etc would be ported over with Wii-mote controls. But because of the difference they won't be. This will lead to major problems as development shifts to PS3/360 and finally ends for PS2/XBOX. All games on the Wii will have to be completely new builds, hence making it harder for developers.

 

I've never really been that tempted away from Nintendo before, but I want to play games like Rainbow Six and Ghost Recon. I also wish we would be seeing Link and Samus in beautiful Hi-Def.

 

I've said it before - but every generation Nintendo has the best ideas, but screws it up due to one or two silly mistakes. With the N64 it was the cartridge format instead of CDs which drove devlopers away. The Gamecube was purple - PURPLE. It also lack any online features. With the Wii, it looks great, is innovative and fresh with it's outlook, but wait, they decided not to stay up to date with technology when it comes to graphics and sound.

 

Still, I hope I'm wrong. I've been playing Nintendo games since Game & Watch were the hottest toy in the play ground. I would hate to see them mess up and end up going the way of Sega.

 

Despite their many wrongdoings that I constantly criticise, they won't just surrender the market they practically built. If they go out, it'll be on their terms, not the fact that they couldn't cope financially and the only thing they could possibly stop is making home consoles.

[The-chosen-one]

and i think nintendo will do great this year

 

with the games coming out,

 

Naruto ,

bleach,

mario,

metroid ,

Disaster: day of crisis ( updated trailer is on youtube )

DragonballZ ,

Smash bros brawl ,

Pokemon ,

Wii sports2 with online function

Horror game Sadness,

Final Fantasy ,

Mortal kombat armegeddon ,

Medal of honor ,

Prince of persia ,

Dragon Quest ,

Samurai warriors ,

Heroes ,

Resident evil ,

mario party 8 ,

Project hammer ,

Sonic ,

Donkey kong ,

Fire emblem ,

Iron man ,

Gundam ,

One piece adventure ,

Sword of Legendia

Sengoku

Tennis masters

Mario strikers

Forever blue

Baja Destruction

the Dog island ,

Blazing angels ,

The last ninja ,

Teenage mutant ninja turtles ,

The Sims

Big brain training

The godfather

Rampage total destruction

open season

Avatar last airbender,

 

and still many more Games

 

i hope they anounce a release date for Kid icarus very soon becouse it whas already anounced by miyamoto himself when he whas interviewed by ign when they asked if there will be an kid icarus for wii and then miyamoto asked that if they would make that the guy from ign would buy it he said hel yeah then miyamoto answered oke then whe will make kid icarus but now i whant a release date

and i hope that this game will be as good as zelda is

 

o and nintendo also anounced a Zelda 2008 release but i know the way nintendo works it comes out in 3009 or something like that haha

[flameboy]

I do agree with you, but I merely think this is what we have to put up with as early adopters of a new console. look at the 360 for quite awhile it was merely the home of upscaled ported games. and even themselves they can be found guilty of not bringing out stellar games at first. but now it's built up momentum and has a increasingly good range of games.

 

this will soon happen with the wii I'm sure, once the PS2 is a dead console, we will stop getting ports, getting our own versions based on next gen rather than last gen. also expect mini game collections whilst they will always exist will maybe die down sooner or later, as people become sick of them.

 

I think it will also be a progressive thing, as more and more people get into gaming, enticed by the idea of wii sports etc... they will soon want to try more traditional games and then I think developers will be more encouraged to attempt to make more and more traditional feeling games that take advantage of the Wii, this can also have its downside, something I think Ubisoft are exploiting very well, new gamers won't know what is and isnt a port for sure, and could see a rehash of a game on an island end in a store with new release above it and think wow that looks good I'll grab that, not realising most of dismissed it as shit years ago. so games like the to be released Driver Parallel Lines will sell really well because of this fact.

 

Kingofhyrule, I have nearly completed Zelda I think and the thought of it scares me! I'm part of the way through Red Steel, but completing that doesn't fill me with much excitement. and then you look to the future for a new truly great adventure/rpg etc... and it seems a far way off. thank god I've just got the Zelda's Collector Edition for the cube and got Majora's Mask to play (I never completed it as a kid)

[solitanze]

Could Sony bring upon their own demise as a result of being TOO SUCCESSFUL? PS2 being the most successful console of all time, a difficult act to follow, everyones still lapping it up, therefore theres very little need for A LOT of people to buy a PS3?

 

Its the equivalent of Ocarina of Time compared to other Zelda games. Perfection cannot be beaten.

[flameboy]

Could Sony bring upon their own demise as a result of being TOO SUCCESSFUL? PS2 being the most successful console of all time, a difficult act to follow, everyones still lapping it up, therefore theres very little need for A LOT of people to buy a PS3?

 

Its the equivalent of Ocarina of Time compared to other Zelda games. Perfection cannot be beaten.

 

it is true, a problem both sega and nintendo had after the SNES and Megadrive, they didn't know what to do.Sega realised the Saturn too early and it was too hard to program for and Nintendo left it too late with the N64, and stupidly stuck with catridges.

 

the same could also be said with Atari with the Jaguar.

 

Could the PS3 be the 3DO of this generation, a console with unquestionable power, thats never exploited?

[dazzybee]

No I dont agree at all - I feel people who do are just very short sighted; there's something you need to remember:

 

IT'S BEEN OUT A MONTH!!!!

 

Look back at any console, this month has more decent releases than I can ever remember!! The PS3 is in a much worse state than the Wii and you'd never be able to tell that much that the 360 has had a year head start.

Look at the games that are coming out - was Zelda compromised or better on the Wii? For me way better. Does Mario look like it will be compromised? Metroid? Smash Bros? Of course not. Is EA supporting it in a big way? Yes.

 

Of course theres going to be a lot of gimmicky games; there always is, there was with the DS. It's a brand new and pretty radical new way to play games, there needs to be a lot of experimenting and due to the popularity, unfortunatly theres a lot of cashing in.

 

The Wii's future is VERY bright!!

[4q2]

for me wii sports doesn't Count on a Sales list becouse wii sports is packed with every wii of course that its the best sold game aloud

 

Wii Sports was never a pack in game on japanese territory (as pointed out by Solitanze)....Even if it hadnt been the case I'm sure Wii play was the second highest seller for Japan above and still above Zelda. Those crazy Japs love their minigames though.

BTW....wasnt Wii sports 2 officially denied as WIP?

 

Personally, the release list still makes me more moist with anticipation than any other console though...No more Heroes, BWII, Sadness (A title that has gone very quiet over recent months...I get the impending feeling that it is going to be ditched, but hope I'm wrong), this could be one of the best couple of years N have given us in a long time....

 

Just a thought here, dont look at the controller as anything other than a controller...Its nothing more than a radical redesign of what we have used for years. Sony have attempted the same thing, but have not provided the same amount of attention and care to the design. This I think is where those thoughts of 'gimmick' come from. As usual Nintendo have laid down the hardware capable of playing a mean game. Its down to the developers to produce and N to keep them interested in producing.

[KingOfHyrule]

I got a different feeling with the N64 and GameCube when I first got it - I had GameCube on the PAL launch and it all looked like a huge jump up from the N64 and it felt like I was playing something brand new, and that great things would follow. With Wii it feels like I'm playing a GameCube with a remote control, it just doesn't have the same punch in my opinion. I understand it's only out a month, and pointing with the controller is cool, I like it, but I'm not so convinced yet that it'll hold strong, doubled with visuals on a par with GameCube, and deliver what we all wanted. But maybe it will eventually?

[motion]

I actually think the graphics on the Wii are worse than the GC (Zelda being the exception) and that's what's disappointing me the most.

[Pit-Jr]

Its bad enough that the hardware is last-generation but to add insult to injury, we get to play last generation games again too! 3rd parties are dumping their last-generation crap onto the Wii, but look who the biggest offender is:

 

Mario Strikers 2?

Battalion Wars 2?

Wario Ware 5-6?

Mario Party 9?

Fire Emblem 47?

Metroid Prime 3?

Mario Galaxy?

 

Grow some fucking balls and make new IPs, you know those things that made you famous in the first place

[Serebii]

Day of Disaster

Project HAMMER

 

and theres a couple more

 

THEY ARE MAKING NEW IPs...THEY JUST ARE NOT OUT YET. I do notice you distinctly forgot to put them

 

Plus I cant believe you people are moaning about visuals...my god I thought we were past this

[Pit-Jr]

Day of Disaster is not even a Nintendo game, its a Monolith game. As for Project Hammer, IF Nintendo is developing it internally, then wow, one game.

[KingOfHyrule]

Plus I cant believe you people are moaning about visuals...my god I thought we were past this

 

I'm over the lack of ground breaking HD visuals - I'm not over the fact that most Wii games look like first generation GameCube games - something isn't quite right that in order to introduce a new controller, graphics have to take a back seat. Why didn't they just release the Wii controller for GameCube after all in that case? Wii is a more powerful machine, it's just confusing that games look balls on it.

[dabookerman]

I dont see where all the hype for Day of disaster and Hammertime is coming from

 

If they werent Nintendo games we all would of dismissed them long ago

[Serebii]

Day of Disaster is not even a Nintendo game, its a Monolith game. As for Project Hammer, IF Nintendo is developing it internally, then wow, one game.

Pretty sure theres another one which I've forgotten but them having a new IP or even 2 known before the launch is a lot more than previous generations. Plus don't forget that it doesnt have to be developed internally for it to be Nintendo;

F-Zero GX: Amusement Vision

Yoshi's Island DS: Artoon

Wario Ware Smooth Moves: Intelligent Systems

Pokémon Battle Revolution: Genius Sonority

Starfox Assault: Namco

Metroid Prime 3: Retro Studios

Mario Strikers Charged: Next Level Games

Mario Party 8: Hudson

and so forth

 

They do not have to be developed in house to be New IPs and thats that

 

Sounds to me you're just grasping for reasons to bitch and moan

[motion]

As for Project Hammer, IF Nintendo is developing it internally, then wow, one game.

 

Agreed, wow, one game.